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re: IVF and “build a baby, inc” will become the moral issue of our time?

Posted on 5/28/26 at 9:23 am to
Posted by 4cubbies
Member since Sep 2008
62481 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 9:23 am to
There’s some nuance there. Married couples can have Church-approved sex after menopause or if one of the spouses is infertile.
Posted by deltadummy
Member since Mar 2025
2905 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 9:43 am to


Antagonist claims life is special and part of God's will.

Loving couple wants children. Loving couple can't have children (GOD'S WILL, DAMMIT!!!!).

Sperm donor donates sperm, which is the same thing as intercourse. Because the woman has trouble with implantation, her egg is taken out and the donor's sperm (usually theloving husband) is used to fertilize the egg, same as intercourse. Fertilized egg is implanted into woman's ovary, same as intercourse. A child is born to a loving couple (also increasing the population, which is part of antagonist's religious, political and economic belief systems).

But it wasn't WILLED BY GOD, DAMMIT!!!!!!! SO IT'S NOT THE SAME!!!!!

Posted by Ingeniero
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2013
23445 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 9:44 am to
Right. The act just has to be "open to" the procreative element. Having sex while infertile or post-menopausal isn't a sin because you aren't intentionally preventing the act from achieving the end goal of procreation (see: Abraham and Sarah). Taking birth control or getting snipped would be different.
Posted by NC_Tigah
Make Orwell Fiction Again
Member since Sep 2003
140633 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 9:59 am to
quote:

I find it interesting that you are framing postponing marriage and raising children as an inherently masculine quality.
No. It's inherently a biological clock issue. Secondarily, many women are attracted to affluence, and men generally garner more of that with age.
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
38237 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 10:01 am to
quote:

f you don't understand this you don't trust in God. You just hope YOUR plans work out.


Because God's will could never include or be realized through medical science.
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
481024 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 10:09 am to
quote:

Antagonist claims life is special and part of God's will.

Loving couple wants children. Loving couple can't have children (GOD'S WILL, DAMMIT!!!!).

Sperm donor donates sperm, which is the same thing as intercourse. Because the woman has trouble with implantation, her egg is taken out and the donor's sperm (usually theloving husband) is used to fertilize the egg, same as intercourse. Fertilized egg is implanted into woman's ovary, same as intercourse. A child is born to a loving couple (also increasing the population, which is part of antagonist's religious, political and economic belief systems).

But it wasn't WILLED BY GOD, DAMMIT!!!!!!! SO IT'S NOT THE SAME!!!!!


but but but...TUBES and...INSTRUMENTS!
Posted by deltaland
Member since Mar 2011
103549 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 10:53 am to
quote:

She had previously froze her eggs, and has turned to IVF and surrogacy to create or her own custom baby, because she “always wanted to be a mom, but wanted to do it on her own time”. She created a whole batch of embryos, but only chose one and decided she won’t use the others and will have them destroyed. She also picked her sperm donor out of a catalog, custom creating her child as if she was ordering a new appliance


I’m ok with using IVF for married couples having trouble getting pregnant.

I’m not ok with the above. Perhaps there’s some reasonable middle ground between banning IVF and allowing the above
Posted by PorkBelly
Fayetteville
Member since Aug 2021
612 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 11:15 am to
IVF is evil. IVF will be how couples play God and choose genes, etc. We are given souls at conception. IVF freezes human souls and kills them more than abortion does. It’s directly tied to eugenics. Use your logic and reason.

If you are not conceiving a child it’s because you are not meant to.
This post was edited on 5/28/26 at 11:18 am
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
481024 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 11:24 am to
quote:

IVF will be how couples play God and choose genes, etc.

Why would IVF be necessary for this?

Why wouldn't non-IVF embryos permit this gene manipulation?

quote:

We are given souls at conception. IVF freezes human souls and kills them more than abortion does.

Most of those souls die from natural causes before they ever have the chance to become human.

quote:

If you are not conceiving a child it’s because you are not meant to.

This works for IVF, too. If God didn't want people to conceive with IVF, he could stop them.
Posted by SallysHuman
Lady Palmetto Bug
Member since Jan 2025
24293 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 11:25 am to
quote:

This works for IVF, too. If God didn't want people to conceive with IVF, he could stop them.


That's not how it works regarding free will.
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
481024 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 11:27 am to
quote:

That's not how it works regarding free will.

Well isn't that convenient?
Posted by chalmetteowl
Chalmette
Member since Jan 2008
55195 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 11:40 am to
quote:

There isn’t one.


Lady Gaga said they were born that way though
Posted by Narax
Member since Jan 2023
8432 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 11:50 am to
quote:

will become the moral issue of our time?

So it's not killing them before birth?
Or convincing them that they are the other sex so they can be sterilized and raped by homosexuals?
Posted by Bard
Definitely NOT an admin
Member since Oct 2008
59939 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 11:51 am to
quote:

To frame this as a pervasive “liberal feminist” mindset is disingenuous. Most Americans affirm that sex is biological and is determined at birth.


You read something into that which does not exist, but it's understandable because they operate to different depths within the same sphere. I'm not talking about the attempt to create some rhetorical ground for the pro-LARP (ie: tranny) crowd, I'm talking about the core of liberal feminism which will swear up and down the only differences between men and women are the obvious ones (basically, body hair and genethliac). These are the types who will get defensive and angry when you bring up that men are physically stronger and faster than women on average.

quote:

I find it interesting that you are framing postponing marriage and raising children as an inherently masculine quality.


Not so much inherent as it is a generalization based on males being more likely to be more independence-minded than females.

quote:

Coincidentally, I read a study yesterday that showed women who gave birth after 33 years of age have significantly longer telomeres as they age than women who had their children before turning 34. Breast cancer risks also decrease for women who have children after 33. So there are some benefits for women who postpone childbearing.


As I mentioned in my other post, there's still a timer on women when dealing with procreation and my main point in it is that liberal feminists ignore that in order to tell women "see, you can be just like men". The further they get beyond their 30s, the greater the chance of complications with the pregnancy, birth defects, etc. even with frozen eggs.
Posted by BigJim
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2010
15132 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 11:56 am to
quote:

She also picked her sperm donor out of a catalog, custom creating her child as if she was ordering a new appliance

How is this child going to have a normal life, growing up intentionally without his/her father?




Just a suggestion, but why don't you mind your own business and let people live their own lives?
Posted by SallysHuman
Lady Palmetto Bug
Member since Jan 2025
24293 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 11:58 am to
quote:

Just a suggestion, but why don't you mind your own business and let people live their own lives?


It's a message board... if everyone minded their own business there'd be nothing to discuss and debate.
Posted by CajunTripper
Member since Apr 2026
84 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 11:59 am to
so the people that can afford to spend a 100k on a baby will get to design it. its weird and just sad.

My wife and i tried everything but IVF to have a child at the end of the day at the time we couldn't afford 50k and it felt un natural to us to have a child that way.

Since then i have had some younger friends to this route of IVF and i hold nothing against them for bringing life into this world.
Posted by skylane
Polebridge Montana
Member since Oct 2005
2625 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 12:05 pm to
We had an unsuccessful IVF. It hit me several years later that the excess fertilizations were essentially 'aborted'. They weren't implanted in womb but still they were the building blocks of a human. They made it sound so sterile it wasn't until later pondering the concept that it hit me.

Other observations
IVF is like a casino, people only share their success stories, never the failures.

We went to a Seattle facility, lots of Lesbo couples in the waiting rooms. Were they looking to be implanted?
Posted by SallysHuman
Lady Palmetto Bug
Member since Jan 2025
24293 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 12:06 pm to
quote:

We had an unsuccessful IVF.


I'm sorry to hear that.
Posted by SallysHuman
Lady Palmetto Bug
Member since Jan 2025
24293 posts
Posted on 5/28/26 at 12:09 pm to
quote:

As I mentioned in my other post, there's still a timer on women when dealing with procreation and my main point in it is that liberal feminists ignore that in order to tell women "see, you can be just like men". The further they get beyond their 30s, the greater the chance of complications with the pregnancy, birth defects, etc. even with frozen eggs.


If you notice her wording, she's all about what's "best" for the woman- what may be best or not for the child is not even an afterthought.
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