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Will rampant viewpoint discrimination be a permanent fixture in American life?
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:15 am
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:15 am
Viewpoint discrimination is the basis of modern day "cancel culture" - which has been extended from companies and celebrities to everyday Americans that happen to disagree with an angry mob on some points.
How long will this last before people start filing lawsuits or somehow fighting back? Does this disturbing movement have staying power?
How long will this last before people start filing lawsuits or somehow fighting back? Does this disturbing movement have staying power?
19
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:17 am to member12
The Power of the Powerless
quote:
Havel uses the example of a greengrocer who displays in his shop the sign Workers of the world, unite!. Since failure to display the sign could be seen as disloyalty, he displays it and the sign becomes not a symbol of his enthusiasm for the regime, but a symbol of both his submission to it and humiliation by it.
quote:
An individual living within such a system must live a lie, to hide that which he truly believes and desires, and to do that which he must do to be left in peace and to survive.
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:17 am to member12
quote:
How long will this last before people start filing lawsuits
Lawsuits for what?
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:19 am to member12
It has always been a permanent fixture to all societies.
Social media/internet has just allowed it to be more visible.
but yes, just like the #metoo movement died off when they went too far, this will also die off when they take it too far
Social media/internet has just allowed it to be more visible.
but yes, just like the #metoo movement died off when they went too far, this will also die off when they take it too far
This post was edited on 6/16/20 at 9:20 am
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:20 am to member12
We have to gain the power of the "mob" on our side.
Not that we need to behave in "mobish" behavior to the extent we're having people cancelled for wearing MSNBC shirts, but companies who bow to the mob need to be punished and enough people need to stand up and go:
At that point, we'll either have widespread conflict (less likely) or enter a period of temporary calm as the radicals realize the moment has passed. It'll come again, and worse next time, but a lot of them will go back to their safe spaces as they stop being propped up by politicians, media, corporations, etc.
Not that we need to behave in "mobish" behavior to the extent we're having people cancelled for wearing MSNBC shirts, but companies who bow to the mob need to be punished and enough people need to stand up and go:
At that point, we'll either have widespread conflict (less likely) or enter a period of temporary calm as the radicals realize the moment has passed. It'll come again, and worse next time, but a lot of them will go back to their safe spaces as they stop being propped up by politicians, media, corporations, etc.
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:20 am to Salmon
quote:
but yes, just like the #metoo movement died off when they went too far, then will also die off when they take it too far
If it hasn't been taken too far already, when the hell is that threshold? We are at an insane point right now.
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:22 am to member12
From a high trust society that allows diversity of opinion to a low trust society that demands that we observe an absolutist orthodoxy. All in the blink of an eye. Solid work, Democrats.
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:23 am to Green Chili Tiger
quote:
Lawsuits for what?
For example, if OSU had demanded Gundy apologize or something, him going "frick off and pay me, or you can do your worst and we'll litigate whether a news channel shirt violates the morality/conduct clause of my contract."
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:23 am to member12
quote:
If it hasn't been taken too far already, when the hell is that threshold? We are at an insane point right now.
have any of these "movements" had any type of real staying power? I can't think of one
we just are not built to keep our focus on one thing as a society
This post was edited on 6/16/20 at 9:32 am
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:24 am to Pettifogger
quote:
For example, if OSU had demanded Gundy apologize or something, him going "frick off and pay me, or you can do your worst and we'll litigate whether a news channel shirt violates the morality/conduct clause of my contract."
So lawsuits for hypothetical situations that didn't happen?
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:26 am to Salmon
The thing that concerns me is that we're setting a lot of terrible precedent. Probably 1/100th of the violent and destructive rioters have/will be prosecuted. Governments are making pretty blatant and public decisions not to punish people who are harming others, and they're going on the record and lying about the situations to justify doing so.
BLM and rioting concerns me less than the blatant and visible propaganda being put out around the country by local governments/police forces/etc. No, politicians lying isn't new, but lying when there is blatant video evidence to the contrary and about significant things (not the size of Trump rallies) is pretty disturbing.
BLM and rioting concerns me less than the blatant and visible propaganda being put out around the country by local governments/police forces/etc. No, politicians lying isn't new, but lying when there is blatant video evidence to the contrary and about significant things (not the size of Trump rallies) is pretty disturbing.
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:26 am to member12
"Viewpoint discrimination" certainly is an interesting term for treating people differently based on their actions and beliefs.
If I don't like your opinion about something, I'm allowed to say so.
I'm allowed to say it on the internet.
Other people are allowed to agree with me.
I'm allowed decide whether or not I want to associate or do business with you.
What exactly is the alternative to this system?
If I don't like your opinion about something, I'm allowed to say so.
I'm allowed to say it on the internet.
Other people are allowed to agree with me.
I'm allowed decide whether or not I want to associate or do business with you.
What exactly is the alternative to this system?
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:26 am to member12
quote:
How long will this last before people start filing lawsuits or somehow fighting back? Does this disturbing movement have staying power?
At some point, they'll go after someone who snaps and reacts violently.
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:28 am to Green Chili Tiger
quote:
So lawsuits for hypothetical situations that didn't happen?
Seems like a pretty silly retort considering:
a) it came really close to happening; and
b) it's happening all over the country
Sitting here today, you do not think the situation I proposed ("Gundy, apologize for the shirt or we may have to move to other action against you") is far fetched - true or false?
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:28 am to member12
Always has, and likely always will. I'll save myself the effort and just c/p one of my posts from another thread:
This isn’t new. The only change is who is in control.
Go back 50 years and have someone say, on live television, that they are an atheist who is in favor of interracial gay marriage.
Can you tell me with a straight face that this person wouldn’t face significant repercussions for stating their opinions/beliefs?
This isn’t new. The only change is who is in control.
Go back 50 years and have someone say, on live television, that they are an atheist who is in favor of interracial gay marriage.
Can you tell me with a straight face that this person wouldn’t face significant repercussions for stating their opinions/beliefs?
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:30 am to member12
quote:
How long will this last before people start filing lawsuits or somehow fighting back?
If you fight back, you'll be labeled a white nationalist or a member of a vigilante militia. Seriously, the people fighting this "war" on behalf of BLM are the biggest saps alive. The money being raised by BLM is going to Act Blue, which is essentially a fundraising arm of Democratic political candidates. So the people fighting against systemic racism are essentially funding the campaign of the man who helped write the 1994 Crime Bill, which institutionalized federal mass incarceration.
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:30 am to Pettifogger
quote:
but lying when there is blatant video evidence to the contrary and about significant things (not the size of Trump rallies) is pretty disturbing.
Absolutely.
But its that whole Sam Harris and Jordan Peterson debate, no? If enough people believe the lie, does that become truth?
Peterson seems pretty well respected on this board and he claims it does. Kinda frightening, right?
This post was edited on 6/16/20 at 9:32 am
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:32 am to Chuck Barris
quote:
Other people are allowed to agree with me.
I'm allowed decide whether or not I want to associate or do business with you.
This is where it breaks down.
Society at large does not find "I don't like kneeling for the anthem" to be hateful/offensive. If the 20% of people who do find those proclamations problematic want to boycott you - ok.
But some fraction of those people are threatening to destroy not only you, but the people who are related to you, those who do business with you, etc. all over a relatively neutral position statement.
And as mentioned, some of that falls back on the majority of sensible people in this country who are letting the mob dictate such things to media/corporations/etc.
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:33 am to Salmon
It's already been taken too far.
Posted on 6/16/20 at 9:33 am to Pettifogger
quote:
Sitting here today, you do not think the situation I proposed ("Gundy, apologize for the shirt or we may have to move to other action against you") is far fetched - true or false?
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