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Message
re: America/LA Prison Population. Explain these numbers in as non-partisan way as possible
Posted on 6/18/20 at 8:44 am to WaWaWeeWa
Posted on 6/18/20 at 8:44 am to WaWaWeeWa
quote:
Everyone keeps ignoring the question
Why did violent crime quadruple between 1960 and 1980. The twenty years before the war on drugs.
I tried to provide some hypotheses for this question in your thread from 9 days back.
quote:
LBJ's war on poverty started in 1964...perhaps these were the early salvos in a rise in fatherless homes.
You also had civil rights movements/protests heating up, protesting an unpopular war, people coming back "changed" from that war, a global pandemic, a global energy crisis, and a rise in inflation, interest rates, and unemployment all in that time period.
Also, it's possible some of the dip in violent crime in the 1990s can be attributed back to the results of Roe v. Wade.
War on drugs started in 1971.
2
Posted on 6/18/20 at 8:45 am to RT1941
quote:
People that can afford to buy their way out of an arrest for DUI/paraphernalia/weed charges will pay an attorney $3,500-$5,000 + court fees of $1,000-$1,500 + entry into the "2nd Chance Program" of $500-$1,500 + drug testing fees of $75/mo + monitoring fees of $75/mo + the installation of a breathalizer in their car for $500 + monthly monitoring of the device of $50/mo......
Getting people on the hook for fees and whatnot like this, even for minor citations, is something that should really be looked into.
Posted on 6/18/20 at 8:45 am to Jake88
quote:The same exists in Alabama, but it's expensive and the drug user has to be able and willing to undergo random drug testing for an extended time + pay a lot of $$ for court fees/attny fees/drug rehab program fees. Some simply can't afford the cost to get the rehab they need.
That is already utilized in La. Many parishes have "drug court" where the sorts of offenders you're talking about have their cases heard.
Posted on 6/18/20 at 8:52 am to Sasquatch Smash
quote:
People that can afford to buy their way out of an arrest for DUI/paraphernalia/weed charges will pay an attorney $3,500-$5,000 + court fees of $1,000-$1,500 + entry into the "2nd Chance Program" of $500-$1,500 + drug testing fees of $75/mo + monitoring fees of $75/mo + the installation of a breathalizer in their car for $500 + monthly monitoring of the device of $50/mo......
quote:The State of Alabama has looked into it, and they found a lucrative revenue stream that they are guaranteed will not diminish. It's a fricking racket, but if someone gets caught with paraphenalia in their an automobile they own & registered under, they are getting arrested - no questions asked. No drugs could even be present - just a pipe and they're getting arrested.
Getting people on the hook for fees and whatnot like this, even for minor citations, is something that should really be looked into.
Then +/-$7,500 later after they complete the program and pay out the arse for an attny, and court fees the charges are miraculously dropped.
Posted on 6/18/20 at 8:54 am to sgallo3
For Profit Prison Industry
Posted on 6/18/20 at 8:54 am to cuyahoga tiger
quote:not just the war on drugs but also the rise in drug use is very proportionate to that chart.
The war on drugs
Posted on 6/18/20 at 9:01 am to WaWaWeeWa
quote:
Can someone explain the rise in violent crime from 1960 to 1980? We can’t just ignore a quadruple increase in violent crime like it has no impact on incarceration.
Psychedelics, heroin, crack and then the subsequent turf wars that followed
Posted on 6/18/20 at 9:07 am to Sasquatch Smash
quote:
Also, it's possible some of the dip in violent crime in the 1990s can be attributed back to the results of Roe v. Wade.
It’s possible but isn’t it also possible that violent felons were eventually locked up and taken off the streets at significant enough numbers that we finally saw the dip?
Posted on 6/18/20 at 9:15 am to sgallo3
Crime increases & incarceration increases. So we should defund the police. That will certainly help.
Posted on 6/18/20 at 9:49 am to Oilfieldbiology
quote:
Psychedelics, heroin, crack and then the subsequent turf wars that followed
Very interested in hearing about these turf wars specifically.
Posted on 6/18/20 at 9:56 am to sgallo3
quote:
Explain
Person 1: There oughta be a law!!!
Person 2: There oughta be a law!!!
Person 3: There oughta be a law!!!
...
Person 1,295,395: There oughta be a law!!!
...
Person 20,935,190: There oughta be a law!!!
...
Person 265,871,900: There oughta be a law!!!
Now let's make the alphabet soup version of all these, then we'll start on the Hate Crime versions, ...
Seeing a trend?
Posted on 6/18/20 at 9:57 am to Oilfieldbiology
quote:quote:
Also, it's possible some of the dip in violent crime in the 1990s can be attributed back to the results of Roe v. Wade.
It’s possible but isn’t it also possible that violent felons were eventually locked up and taken off the streets at significant enough numbers that we finally saw the dip?
What kind of retort is that?
I used "possible" and "some" in my statement. Does that somehow exclude other possibilities?
Folks being imprisoned and folks not existing in the first place to commit crimes/be imprisoned are not mutually exclusive.
Posted on 6/18/20 at 10:00 am to WaWaWeeWa
quote:
Drug TRAFFICKING.
They aren’t in there for simple possession, that’s less than 1% of all prisoners.
Pile of horse shite. Let me walk you through this, using my state and marijuana. Florida it is a felony of the 3rd degree, punishable by up to 5 years in prison for possessing more than 20 grams. A whopping 0.71 ounces. Same 3rd degree felony for selling any amount of marijuana. Trafficking charges come in at 25 lbs. Most folks are NOT there for selling 25 lbs or more.
quote:
You want legal heroin, crack, and meth? If you say no, you haven’t solved a thing.
I mean 2 of the 3 items you listed are already "only" schedule 2 drugs. Doctors can literally prescribe methamphetamine to children as young as 6. While oxycodone isn't heroin, they'll still prescribe it to kids in 5th/6th grade. My brother broke his nose several times as a kid. The hospital absolutely is the first place he tried cocaine, as part of the surgeries.
quote:
Weed should be legal but when it is then criminals move into the next criminal enterprise.
And when it's not a non violent, victimless crime... they should be investigated, arrested, and prosecuted. Woefully simple concept.
Posted on 6/18/20 at 10:05 am to sgallo3
Big business, I know a guy who has a company which manages prisons.
He's killing it
LINK /
LaSalle Corrections and its affiliates currently manage 18 correctional facilities in Louisiana, Texas and Georgia with a total inmate capacity of over 13,000, and lease one facility to a law enforcement agency. We pursue opportunities throughout the United States.
He's killing it
LINK /
LaSalle Corrections and its affiliates currently manage 18 correctional facilities in Louisiana, Texas and Georgia with a total inmate capacity of over 13,000, and lease one facility to a law enforcement agency. We pursue opportunities throughout the United States.
Posted on 6/18/20 at 10:10 am to slackster
quote:Well gee, if you put it that way
We started cracking down on the possession of plants.
Posted on 6/18/20 at 10:19 am to Shiftyplus1
quote:
What happened in the mid 60s to early 70s? The introduction of mass welfare. Federal and local government representatives literally told regular citizens and single mothers that they didn't have to marry or work, that the more kids you had, the more money Uncle Sam would give you. The democrats then switched tactics, and became soft Marxists that told blacks they could never succeed on their own because systemic racism was a boot on their collective necks. Worked like a charm. Millions now are slaves to government handouts, and dont even see how the very party they are voting for is holding them back.
This is correct! LBJ called it "The War on Poverty", but it was actually a war against black men.
This post was edited on 6/18/20 at 10:20 am
Posted on 6/18/20 at 10:31 am to Jake88
quote:This doesn't address the OP's question unless your assertion is that Louisiana has the largest criminal population in the world.
There aren't enough people in prison in La. How many times do we hear about a terrible crime and the perpetrator has a RAP sheet with dozens of charges and several convictions? Actual non-violent criminals in prison in La are relatively few. Though the instant offense may be nonviolent in nature, if you dig into their history there is an excellent chance you'll find violence.
Posted on 6/18/20 at 10:57 am to Sasquatch Smash
quote:
I tried to provide some hypotheses for this question in your thread from 9 days back.
I think we agree on most of these points. My only argument would be that crime was rising before any war on drugs.
Posted on 6/18/20 at 10:59 am to MoarKilometers
quote:
Trafficking charges come in at 25 lbs. Most folks are NOT there for selling 25 lbs or more.
It is a well established fact that a very small percent of people in prison are not there for possession. It’s almost exclusively trafficking.
I’m all for legalizing marijuana. I just think that will have a meaningless effect on the prison population.
This post was edited on 6/18/20 at 11:00 am
Posted on 6/18/20 at 11:02 am to WaWaWeeWa
End THE war on drugs. We have 2/3 majority support at least for marijuana. Start there.. If it doesn't work out after 60 years then at least you have some statistics to back up your unprovoked war against your own citizens.
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