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re: The NFL's official explanation for Goff's fumble

Posted on 9/13/26 at 10:19 pm to
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
486973 posts
Posted on 9/13/26 at 10:19 pm to
Published 12 years ago on September 21, 2014

Rule:

quote:

If, after intentional forward movement of his hand, contact by an opponent materially affects the passer, causing the ball to go backward, it is a forward pass, regardless of where the ball strikes the ground, a player, an official, or anything else.


quote:

In Geno Smith’s case, the only reason the ball went backward was due to the defensive contact. Alex Smith was moving his arm slightly, but in an obvious forward passing motion when viewed on replay. Because the actions of the quarterbacks made the ball a forward pass, both plays were ruled incomplete passes in replay. With the repeal of the Tuck Rule in 2013, the end of a forward motion ends the intention to pass, and not tucking the ball into the body. The next issue for these plays involves intentional grounding, as it was argued that these passes were nowhere near an intended receiver. However, the rules allow the word intentional to have meaning — the actions of both Smiths were intended to be passes to an eligible receiver, and the intentional grounding rules give similar deference to the quarterback as Rule 8-1-1a does to make it incomplete. In this case, if there is no eligible target in the path of the intended pass, the referee can still call intentional grounding. Such a call is rarely made, though, because it is difficult to actually determine what would have happened without the defensive contact.


There are 2 separate discussions that are being conflated:

1. Was this a fumble or was the arm coming forward?
2. If it was a pass, was it a backwards pass?

If it's a pass (which I disagree with, but that's the ruling on the field), it can't be considered a backwards pass and won't be intentional grounding, due to the contact.

If it's not a pass, none of that matters b/c it's a fumble.

Those are the 2 options. I think it was a fumble and #1 is where the NFL made the mistake.
Posted by LooseCannon22282
South Alabama Fan
Member since May 2008
36517 posts
Posted on 9/13/26 at 10:26 pm to
Goff got hit before he threw it. His arm was not going forward.

That's the way I saw it.

thank you for that

The ruling on the field was correct but then the league office made some phantom narrative in real time in which we have no choice but to live with.
Posted by Y.A. Tittle
Member since Sep 2003
112185 posts
Posted on 9/13/26 at 10:29 pm to
quote:

1. Was this a fumble or was the arm coming forward? 2. If it was a pass, was it a backwards pass?


If you watch the replay, Goff looks like he was originally intending to go forward, but switched to a sort of ‘throw it away’ motion clearly more toward the sideline, just before and proceeding into getting hit.

I don’t get why that’s not a relevant distinction here.
Posted by Sauce Castieaux
Asheville, NC.
Member since Nov 2015
5933 posts
Posted on 9/13/26 at 10:33 pm to
I honestly dont need to read their statement because it doesnt matter. This has been going on for quite a while and off the top of my head last year it was the phantom Grnaderson roughing the passer vs Dart and the overturned Chris Olave catch vs Arizona.


I get it... during the course of a game there will always be bad calls. The typical bad calls I get. They are just blatantly making shite us in regards to us
Posted by uptowntiger84
uptown
Member since Jul 2011
5998 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 7:38 am to
Just remember anything that is crazy will usually happen to the Saints. Bad calls, no calls whatever it is it usually happens to screw the Saints over.
Posted by Beauw
Blanchard
Member since Sep 2007
4439 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 10:15 am to
Dead horse, nobody cares, I get all that. But this kind of crap is what made me lose my love of watching the Saints play on Sundays.....

They don't even try to hide it.
Posted by Dizz
Member since May 2008
16312 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 10:24 am to
So if a quarter back brings the ball up and the balls falls out of his hand why is that not an incomplete pass because he began the trowing motion?
Posted by rt3
now in the piney woods of Pineville
Member since Apr 2011
148448 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 10:31 am to
Posted by rt3
now in the piney woods of Pineville
Member since Apr 2011
148448 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 10:32 am to
Posted by Barbellthor
Columbia
Member since Aug 2015
11996 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 11:13 am to
So on a pump fake if you fumble it's actually an incomplete because you started raising your arm which has never been a thing ever.

frick the NFL.
Posted by Proximo
Member since Aug 2011
25977 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 11:14 am to
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This post was edited on 9/14/26 at 11:15 am
Posted by Proximo
Member since Aug 2011
25977 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 11:16 am to
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feels like the entire internet is on our side on this one
Posted by paulb52
Member since Dec 2019
9639 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 11:16 am to
Both in Michigan. Hmmn, Looks like the same replay guy from Ann Arbor. Michigan and Detroit both steal wins via instant replay bullshite. Coincidence?
Posted by paulb52
Member since Dec 2019
9639 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 11:20 am to
Backwards pass = lateral = fumble. Basic rules of football.
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
486973 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 11:52 am to
quote:

Backwards pass = lateral = fumble. Basic rules of football.


quote:

If, after intentional forward movement of his hand, contact by an opponent materially affects the passer, causing the ball to go backward, it is a forward pass, regardless of where the ball strikes the ground, a player, an official, or anything else.


Once the ruling is that it was a pass, the "it went backwards" is irrelevant due to the contact.
Posted by Teufelhunden
Galvez, LA
Member since Feb 2005
6102 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 11:59 am to
In the history of the NFL, a play in which the Qb has been hit as he started his windup and loss the ball has never been called an incomplete forward pass.

So smart QBs going forward should just throw the ball in the dirt in any direction as they're being sacked. Incomplete forward pass.
Posted by paulb52
Member since Dec 2019
9639 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 1:14 pm to
Official explanations are insulting the intelligence of NFL fans everywhere.
Posted by Sauce Castieaux
Asheville, NC.
Member since Nov 2015
5933 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 1:55 pm to
Yep

Either they tell you it was the right call or they tell you it was the wrong call. Either way tough shite for you.

Id almost rather them say nothing
Posted by MUMFORD
Houston
Member since Nov 2008
2011 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 1:59 pm to
Posted by rt3
now in the piney woods of Pineville
Member since Apr 2011
148448 posts
Posted on 9/14/26 at 2:11 pm to
quote:

feels like the entire internet is on our side on this one

Yeah... a rare W for Saints having a bit of sympathy

Unfortunately it means nothing in the grand scheme of things

Also... if this ruling ends up being the difference between a division title or a playoff spot and missing the playoffs altogether... I'm going to be a sad whodat
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