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re: NBA Offseason officially kicks off, Ingram’s days in NOLA coming to an end per Stein
Posted on 7/15/24 at 3:59 pm to Dantheman504
Posted on 7/15/24 at 3:59 pm to Dantheman504
I also was hoping he could be a defensive guy, I was hoping for a poor man’s Zach Randolph as a max potential. I only mentioned EJ today because he had 4 blocks last night
This post was edited on 7/15/24 at 4:02 pm
1
Posted on 7/15/24 at 4:03 pm to SCLSUMuddogs
quote:
also was hoping he could be a defensive guy, I was hoping for a poor man’s Zach Randolph as a max
Yeah Zach Randolph/ Draymond was the vision. In reality we were hoping for a mid PJ Tucker. I still think he could maybe become a poor man's PJ Tucker but its not looking great.
One of the other reasons the hype disappeared is because he was already a 2nd rd pick that slipped because of his age. So the fact that he still hasn't done much after he fell due to being older says a good bit.
This post was edited on 7/15/24 at 4:05 pm
Posted on 7/15/24 at 5:13 pm to Dantheman504
quote:
No. I'm saying for this specific situation he (EJ Lidell) was not good enough and that's the reason why.
You are trying to say "well if he did get minutes he'd be better".
No. Those players exist, EJ Lidell is not one of them. Atleast he wasn't in the (2) years he was here.
He was outplayed by JRE in limited minutes and probably in practice.
Yeah it was really telling that Willie was playing a 2 way guy in JRE over a guy that had a full contract like EJ.
I loved the EJ pick when it happened. He was a good college guy that slipped in the draft.
Posted on 7/15/24 at 6:42 pm to SCLSUMuddogs
I’d do Podz and two first round picks from the warriors and not look back
Posted on 7/16/24 at 11:47 am to Macintosh
Just for fun and to test out our fan tolerance at this point and how emotional we can get. Would you do:
Pels get: Jarrett Allen and Caris Lavert
Cavs get: Brandon Ingram and 2025 top four protected Pels first
I know many/most would not have traded BI for Allen alone. Wondering now if some would provide incentive for the swap.
Pels get: Jarrett Allen and Caris Lavert
Cavs get: Brandon Ingram and 2025 top four protected Pels first
I know many/most would not have traded BI for Allen alone. Wondering now if some would provide incentive for the swap.
Posted on 7/16/24 at 11:56 am to PELsu
I'm not giving up a first and Ingram for Allen.
As much as ingram creates a cap conundrum, so will Allen in 2 years hartenstein just got paid. Allen will too. I'm not giving up a first for just any center
As much as ingram creates a cap conundrum, so will Allen in 2 years hartenstein just got paid. Allen will too. I'm not giving up a first for just any center
Posted on 7/16/24 at 12:18 pm to htran90
quote:
I'm not giving up a first and Ingram for Allen.
As much as ingram creates a cap conundrum, so will Allen in 2 years hartenstein just got paid. Allen will too. I'm not giving up a first for just any center
To play devils advocate, when Allen is up for contract, both BI and Cj's deals would now be off the books. Your big money earners would be Murray, Herb, Trey, and Zion, three of which likely well below max levels. Along with the massive cap increases, you could definitely afford to pay Allen pretty well if you wanted. You also would hopefully be hitting a time that Missi is ready to contribute to some extent.
Posted on 7/16/24 at 1:07 pm to PELsu
I wouldn’t do that
If anything were to be added I would do no more than a top 20 protected 1st
If anything were to be added I would do no more than a top 20 protected 1st
Posted on 7/16/24 at 2:56 pm to Soggymoss
I would do a lottery protected first that changes to 2 future 2nds for them. I'd rather Strus but I doubt Cleveland lets him walk.
I really think BI is addition by subtraction in so many ways. Not really caring about getting "value."
I really think BI is addition by subtraction in so many ways. Not really caring about getting "value."
Posted on 7/16/24 at 3:16 pm to PELsu
quote:No way would I trade a lightly protected 1st plus BI for Allen and Levert. That is a heavy overpay.,
Just for fun and to test out our fan tolerance at this point and how emotional we can get. Would you do:
Pels get: Jarrett Allen and Caris Lavert
Cavs get: Brandon Ingram and 2025 top four protected Pels first
I know many/most would not have traded BI for Allen alone. Wondering now if some would provide incentive for the swap.
Posted on 7/16/24 at 4:15 pm to NOSHAU
quote:
No way would I trade a lightly protected 1st plus BI for Allen and Levert. That is a heavy overpay.
Maybe but it solves a lot of problems for your team. Sometimes the deal may not be exactly what you want but its much better than the alternative as well. At this point I don’t think Griff will win a BI deal- either he accepts that and trades him or he lets him walk. He can try to get him to sign for less- but doesn’t solve much of your team problems.
Posted on 7/16/24 at 4:40 pm to NOSHAU
quote:
No way would I trade a lightly protected 1st plus BI for Allen and Levert. That is a heavy overpay.,
Id do that and thank Cleveland.
BI aint worth 40m a year otherwise he would have been gone by now.
Posted on 7/16/24 at 5:28 pm to PELsu
I would consider that trade if Caris Levert was rerouted somewhere else and we didn't take back any salary, and we got back 4 2nd round picks.
The Cavs won't do that though. They can't pay Mitchell a supermax, BI a 3rd contract near max, and Garland a rookie extension max. That's the point of this new CBA, that doing somethign like that just isn't sustainable, especially for small market teams. Even the big market teams can only do it for 2-3 year at most.
How's about this trade:
Warriors get BI and Kessler
Jazz get Looney, GP2 and 27/29 firsts from GSW
Raptors get Canadian Wiggins
Pels get Bruce Brown, Vezenkov(can't be traded until 8/27) and Moozes Mody, GSW 25 1st and 28 1st pick swap, 26 Raptors 1st (lesser of Indy/Tor)
Warriors actually get under the tax, and get better.
Utah doesn't give a shite and just wanted the future 1sts.
Raptors upgrade to a Canadian guy, and always intended on trading Brown.
Pels replace Naji/Dyson defense with Bruce, and get a bench shooter, and get under the tax.
The Cavs won't do that though. They can't pay Mitchell a supermax, BI a 3rd contract near max, and Garland a rookie extension max. That's the point of this new CBA, that doing somethign like that just isn't sustainable, especially for small market teams. Even the big market teams can only do it for 2-3 year at most.
How's about this trade:
Warriors get BI and Kessler
Jazz get Looney, GP2 and 27/29 firsts from GSW
Raptors get Canadian Wiggins
Pels get Bruce Brown, Vezenkov(can't be traded until 8/27) and Moozes Mody, GSW 25 1st and 28 1st pick swap, 26 Raptors 1st (lesser of Indy/Tor)
Warriors actually get under the tax, and get better.
Utah doesn't give a shite and just wanted the future 1sts.
Raptors upgrade to a Canadian guy, and always intended on trading Brown.
Pels replace Naji/Dyson defense with Bruce, and get a bench shooter, and get under the tax.
Posted on 7/16/24 at 6:02 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
Pels replace Naji/Dyson defense with Bruce, and get a bench shooter, and get under the tax.
This does nothing for our center situation though. At this point, any BI trade needs to somehow address this.
Posted on 7/16/24 at 6:07 pm to Pels_Yaz
address it mid-season if needed.
What's the difference if you add some backup 5 to what we currently have?
I"m not trading BI to specifically address the starting center position. I'm trading him to get the best return back.
What's the difference if you add some backup 5 to what we currently have?
I"m not trading BI to specifically address the starting center position. I'm trading him to get the best return back.
Posted on 7/16/24 at 6:13 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
address it mid-season if needed. What's the difference if you add some backup 5 to what we currently have? I"m not trading BI to specifically address the starting center position. I'm trading him to get the best return back.
Because by midseason we’re going to lose a lot of games. I think its silly to sacrifice half a season to get the best value back on BI. Even a legit backup center would be an upgrade over the third stringers we have.
This is my problem with Griff and people who want to just maximize BI trade value- that we’re willing to waste half a season of basketball or more doing this. We’re not a rebuilding team. Going into the season with third string centers is asking to literally have a severe disadvantage at a position against every team in the league. When every game counts in the west how is this a good strategy?
Posted on 7/16/24 at 6:25 pm to Pels_Yaz
quote:
Because by midseason we’re going to lose a lot of games.
If they are getting killed on the boards and losing because of it after the first 10 games, Griff is going to have no choice but to go after Duren or Kessler.
You also can't just dump BI because that will make you look like you are choosing money over winning, and that's a very quick way to lose a team. Some version of BI for Allen is about the only realistic trade that is low value while not potentially losing the team. If Cleveland isn't interested, there's not much you can do.
Posted on 7/16/24 at 6:32 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
Griff is going to have no choice but to go after Duren or Kessler.
This is assuming they’re available during that time. At that point in desperation, Griffin will HAVE to overpay to get them.
quote:
You also can't just dump BI because that will make you look like you are choosing money over winning, and that's a very quick way to lose a team.
You’re dumping BI to improve your team specifically at center. I dont think it makes it look like you’re choosing money over winning at all. To top it off you’re opening minutes for CJ and Trey who otherwise would be playing off the bench.
Personally I would argue keeping BI while having no legit NBA center is telling the team you wont make your team better because you don’t want to lose on a trade. These players are smart. Most are going to be concerned the lack of even a legit backup center on the team.
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:23 pm to Pels_Yaz
Agree, we need to improve the center position.
I however disagree with attaching any future picks to do so while moving Ingram. Teams giving up a center for Ingram do so with the intention of improving or filling a gap they have. At current cost and value, he still holds more value straight up to most available centers.
If you said Ingram for Allen and filler, because Cleveland has no 1st round picks available that's one thing. Adding a 1st is ludicrous, you can dump him for an expiring big like capela alone if that's the case.
I however disagree with attaching any future picks to do so while moving Ingram. Teams giving up a center for Ingram do so with the intention of improving or filling a gap they have. At current cost and value, he still holds more value straight up to most available centers.
If you said Ingram for Allen and filler, because Cleveland has no 1st round picks available that's one thing. Adding a 1st is ludicrous, you can dump him for an expiring big like capela alone if that's the case.
Posted on 7/16/24 at 7:31 pm to htran90
quote:
Adding a 1st is ludicrous, you can dump him for an expiring big like capela alone if that's the case.
You can’t because Atlanta doesn’t want him. Thats the thing there aren’t many other options. I’m not saying we should add a first for Allen but acting like we have better options also isn’t true. There just aren’t any options. Personally, I just think holding onto BI and going into the season with a third string center should not be an option.
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