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Message
I'm a conflicted conservative - I'm pro gun but want more gun control
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:12 am
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:12 am
Does that make me less of a conservative? Does the fact that I fully understand that banning AR-15's and the likes would do little to curb events like yesterday but still wouldn't have a single problem with a ban on them make me an embarrassment to the base of the party I align mostly with? Tell me why I should be shunned by members of the party I identify strongly with because I slightly disagree with most of its members on one issue. Just because it's a major issue doesn't make me less of a conservative.
Here are my beliefs and thoughts on mass shootings and how to best prevent them:
1. Mental health, not the gun, is the main issue at hand here. We as a society have GOT to stop turning a blind eye to potential threats out of fear of being told to mind our own business. Adults and children alike need to grow accustomed to and be very comfortable with both asking for and offering help.
2. We have to work together to find ways to lessen and discourage ALL forms of bullying. That includes the major form for our children today - cyber bullying. Instagram, Snapchat, and yes, Facebook offer avenues to bully others on a stage that none of today's young adults ever experienced. Texting rumors, lewd pictures, and mean-spirited jokes about kids means that the subject of the bullying is now on display to so many more at such a faster rate than we ever were subjected to when we were in school. This has a tremendous affect on a child's mind and it has to stop.
3. Guns don't kill people, people kill people. I completely understand this. Trust me. However, I still believe that we have a moral obligation to put more regulations in place to make background checks when buying any gun more thorough. Yes, I said "more regulations" and "any gun". It doesn't make me a liberal by any stretch of the imagination. When students all unanimously agree that red flags were present on a person's social media accounts, it's time to include reviews of social media accounts in background checks. Perhaps these background checks are done by "panels" so to speak. Three reviewers with psychology backgrounds are tasked with individually reviewing a person's social media background and a majority of them have to give the okay. That could be in addition to the obvious existing protocols in place.
Yes, this would result in a longer wait time to get your gun. You wait at the DMV for hours to renew your driver's license, you wait in line at the grocery store, you wait weeks for tax refunds to arrive, you wait for an insurance adjuster to review any insurance claim you have. Why can't you wait a little longer to receive the go-ahead to purchase a gun. A gun is a powerful tool that only responsible adults should be able to obtain and use.
4. Piggy backing on #3 - Semi-automatic rifles such as AR-15s and such should be banned again. Now here is where I really go back and forth. I feel like in a literal sense, we as citizens could use one of these types of weapons in the very unlikely event that we are ever overthrown by our own government or by an invading foreign government. However on the flip side of that argument, if any foreign government ever tries to invade us or if our own government ever tries to overthrow us, no gun (regardless of type) is going to go far in helping you defend yourself when most governments have an airforce that can push a button and annihilate you if they wanted to. They know you have guns so why would they bring guns to that fight too? They're going to use something more powerful than a gun, such as bombs. I'm obviously talking in extremes here - don't take my words and think I expect our government or another government to come and bomb us any time soon.
Bottom line: I have very little problem with banning these types of weapons for citizens.
Those are my human being thoughts. They shouldn't make me any less of a conservative and certainly shouldn't make me a liberal. I feel like the problem with our government is that Republicans are afraid of bending on these issues out of fear of being shunned by their own party and voters. Democrats are afraid of bending on their side for the same reasons. It's time we all come together, as humans first, parents 2nd, and a nation 3rd and figure this shite out. I've prayed many times since yesterday. I've prayed for the children who experienced fear like few of us can imagine, both those who didn't make it and those who were able to hug their parents and friends afterward. I've prayed for those poor parents who will never hug their child again. I've prayed for the shooters family as well because regardless of their faults, they've lost a loved one now too. But although I go to church and believe in the power of prayer, I also understand that prayer alone will not fix this.
WE are the answers to our own prayers. We pray for a solution to this problem but we fail to see that God has given us brains and the ability to work together to formulate solutions. THAT'S what God has answered our prayers with and until we wake up and realize that, nothing will change.
We have to figure this thing out. We have to.
Here are my beliefs and thoughts on mass shootings and how to best prevent them:
1. Mental health, not the gun, is the main issue at hand here. We as a society have GOT to stop turning a blind eye to potential threats out of fear of being told to mind our own business. Adults and children alike need to grow accustomed to and be very comfortable with both asking for and offering help.
2. We have to work together to find ways to lessen and discourage ALL forms of bullying. That includes the major form for our children today - cyber bullying. Instagram, Snapchat, and yes, Facebook offer avenues to bully others on a stage that none of today's young adults ever experienced. Texting rumors, lewd pictures, and mean-spirited jokes about kids means that the subject of the bullying is now on display to so many more at such a faster rate than we ever were subjected to when we were in school. This has a tremendous affect on a child's mind and it has to stop.
3. Guns don't kill people, people kill people. I completely understand this. Trust me. However, I still believe that we have a moral obligation to put more regulations in place to make background checks when buying any gun more thorough. Yes, I said "more regulations" and "any gun". It doesn't make me a liberal by any stretch of the imagination. When students all unanimously agree that red flags were present on a person's social media accounts, it's time to include reviews of social media accounts in background checks. Perhaps these background checks are done by "panels" so to speak. Three reviewers with psychology backgrounds are tasked with individually reviewing a person's social media background and a majority of them have to give the okay. That could be in addition to the obvious existing protocols in place.
Yes, this would result in a longer wait time to get your gun. You wait at the DMV for hours to renew your driver's license, you wait in line at the grocery store, you wait weeks for tax refunds to arrive, you wait for an insurance adjuster to review any insurance claim you have. Why can't you wait a little longer to receive the go-ahead to purchase a gun. A gun is a powerful tool that only responsible adults should be able to obtain and use.
4. Piggy backing on #3 - Semi-automatic rifles such as AR-15s and such should be banned again. Now here is where I really go back and forth. I feel like in a literal sense, we as citizens could use one of these types of weapons in the very unlikely event that we are ever overthrown by our own government or by an invading foreign government. However on the flip side of that argument, if any foreign government ever tries to invade us or if our own government ever tries to overthrow us, no gun (regardless of type) is going to go far in helping you defend yourself when most governments have an airforce that can push a button and annihilate you if they wanted to. They know you have guns so why would they bring guns to that fight too? They're going to use something more powerful than a gun, such as bombs. I'm obviously talking in extremes here - don't take my words and think I expect our government or another government to come and bomb us any time soon.
Bottom line: I have very little problem with banning these types of weapons for citizens.
Those are my human being thoughts. They shouldn't make me any less of a conservative and certainly shouldn't make me a liberal. I feel like the problem with our government is that Republicans are afraid of bending on these issues out of fear of being shunned by their own party and voters. Democrats are afraid of bending on their side for the same reasons. It's time we all come together, as humans first, parents 2nd, and a nation 3rd and figure this shite out. I've prayed many times since yesterday. I've prayed for the children who experienced fear like few of us can imagine, both those who didn't make it and those who were able to hug their parents and friends afterward. I've prayed for those poor parents who will never hug their child again. I've prayed for the shooters family as well because regardless of their faults, they've lost a loved one now too. But although I go to church and believe in the power of prayer, I also understand that prayer alone will not fix this.
WE are the answers to our own prayers. We pray for a solution to this problem but we fail to see that God has given us brains and the ability to work together to formulate solutions. THAT'S what God has answered our prayers with and until we wake up and realize that, nothing will change.
We have to figure this thing out. We have to.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:17 am to TDsngumbo
I'm pro gun and don't want more gun control. I'm not conflicted in the slightest.
Until we as a country wake up to the mental illness pandemic we have, things will not get better. I'd start with the insane overprescription of antidepressants.
There needs to be a real study that shows the correlation of anti-depressants and mass shooters. I'd bet it would shock everyone and be an "aha" moment.
But we will never get that because the solution to everything is to pass more laws and try to control law-abiding citizens a little more. Restricting freedom in the name of perceived safety.
Until we as a country wake up to the mental illness pandemic we have, things will not get better. I'd start with the insane overprescription of antidepressants.
There needs to be a real study that shows the correlation of anti-depressants and mass shooters. I'd bet it would shock everyone and be an "aha" moment.
But we will never get that because the solution to everything is to pass more laws and try to control law-abiding citizens a little more. Restricting freedom in the name of perceived safety.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:18 am to TDsngumbo
I have no ill feelings for people who come to the rational decision that gun control measures that may save lives are more important than gun liberties.
I disagree with them and will challenge their beliefs, but there is nothing inherently wrong with coming to that position.
I reserve my anger for those who lie about their intentions, or who see gun limitations as a means to other liberty infringements.
I disagree with them and will challenge their beliefs, but there is nothing inherently wrong with coming to that position.
I reserve my anger for those who lie about their intentions, or who see gun limitations as a means to other liberty infringements.
This post was edited on 2/15/18 at 9:19 am
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:18 am to TDsngumbo
nobody is reading all that crap. gun control equals infringement. guns protect us from tyranny. There's a trade off. Unfortunate but true.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:19 am to TDsngumbo
Nothing changed after Sandy Hook.
That was literally the final straw.
It's time to accept the fact that nothing will happen after this. The nation will completely forget about it in a week.
That was literally the final straw.
It's time to accept the fact that nothing will happen after this. The nation will completely forget about it in a week.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:20 am to TDsngumbo
quote:
Does that make me less of a conservative?
Yes, it does. Welcome to the middle where there's no room for anyone.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:22 am to TDsngumbo
quote:Why would you care if you are shunned. Thats a groupie mentality. If you cant form your own opinion on topics you are a follower. There are several issues in which I have conservative views, just like there are some that I'm liberal on. You have some good ideas but this board sees things 90% 1 way. You will probably get ripped on here because of it
Does that make me less of a conservative?
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:23 am to TDsngumbo
I feel like the answer to these school shooting is to train the teachers how to use a gun and then have them carry it on their person. If a psycho or any criminal knew that people were carrying and ready to defend themselves or others, then these mass shootings would go away. That may be a naïve thought but I actually believe it will deter these events.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:26 am to TDsngumbo
Smothering gun control just means that the crazy people out there that are intent on killing people will just move to other means.
Besides, more gun control does nothing for the billions of guns already out there. Nobody is going to go door to door, searching for guns.
Besides, more gun control does nothing for the billions of guns already out there. Nobody is going to go door to door, searching for guns.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:27 am to TDsngumbo
I understand your point and concerns but I'm not to that point yet. Self-policing at this point should be the responsibility of family and friends.
As far as this:
As far as this:
quote:be prepared to wait a year for a gun if this idea is ever put into law. What do you do in the case of no social media footprint?
Perhaps these background checks are done by "panels" so to speak. Three reviewers with psychology backgrounds are tasked with individually reviewing a person's social media background and a majority of them have to give the okay.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:28 am to TDsngumbo
quote:People keep saying this, but if they won't annihilate areas in the mid east and those dimwits can fight off the US for a decade, what do you think hundreds of thousands of ex:military militia guys in the US could do?
when most governments have an airforce that can push a button and annihilate you if they wanted to
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:30 am to TDsngumbo
quote:
2. We have to work together to find ways to lessen and discourage ALL forms of bullying
Wrong. Back in the day when bullying was allowed these nerds were too scared to do anything
Make bullying great again
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:36 am to TDsngumbo
quote:
Does that make me less of a conservative?
Yes. Pissing on God given rights enumerated in the Constitution is not a conservative position.
quote:
Does the fact that I fully understand that banning AR-15's and the likes would do little to curb events like yesterday but still wouldn't have a single problem with a ban on them make me an embarrassment to the base of the party I align mostly with?
Yes, it does. Turning your back on a Constitutional right that provides security and protection for all Americans, when you acknowledge that doing so will do nothing to fix the problem, is idiotic. The fact that you are also willing to ignore the additional risk you would put the rest of the population in by doing so is an embarrassment, and ignorant.
quote:
Tell me why I should be shunned by members of the party I identify strongly with because I slightly disagree with most of its members on one issue.
This is not a slight disagreement, skippy. You either protect and defend the Constitution and Bill of Rights, or you don't. The 2A is THE right that puts teeth behind all of the others we enjoy. Without the 2A, we would have lost the Constitution and Bill of Rights completely, long ago.
The rest of your post is the same old bullshite we've seen a thousand times. Do away with gun free zones, and protect our kids the same way we protect everything else we hold dear, with guns.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:38 am to TDsngumbo
Your very long and rambling proposal and feelings advocate for the abolishment of the first amendment with government monitoring and regulation of “social media” and and the complete destruction of the 2nd amendment, which I assume means you would also get rid of the 4th amendment in order to implement.
So please spare me the crap about how you are a conservative, or even an American for that matter. You can have exactly what you wish - move to China or Great Britain or Germany.
Your feelings do not replace the Constitution.
So please spare me the crap about how you are a conservative, or even an American for that matter. You can have exactly what you wish - move to China or Great Britain or Germany.
Your feelings do not replace the Constitution.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:38 am to TDsngumbo
I largely agree with what you said. One issue with conservatives is that there is a fear that when (in the future) you get a whacko liberal like Hillary or Biden elected then there is a movement that Christianity is a mental disorder....or at least the fundamentalists.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:38 am to TDsngumbo
quote:
Tell me why
All these types of posts are the same. "I'm a gun loving conservative, but something has to be done. My opinion blah blah blah."
Look buddy, the AR 15 is no more dangerous or deadly than any other gun. Period. Not one of my guns left the house yesterday and went on a mass killing spree. I don't give a damn about your feelings of confliction. It's not my job to convince you of anything. If you don't want an AR 15 then don't have one.
For all of you talking about AR 15 bans, do you think it's time to ban cigarettes? Cigarette smoking causes around 480,000 deaths annually in the US. That a whole lot more than gun deaths in the US. Even if you count suicides in the total (which comprise abut 2/3 of gun deaths).
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:44 am to TDsngumbo
Say it with me.
This shooting happened at a facility with 100% prohibition of any guns.
This shooting happened at a facility with 100% prohibition of any guns.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:52 am to TDsngumbo
Do you RA when people bully rex or toddy?
Do you comment upon the ad hominem piling on?
Do you comment upon the ad hominem piling on?
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:53 am to TDsngumbo
There's nothing to figure out. The problem isn't about guns or even mental illness. It's a moral problem.
We as a society have worked very, very hard to throw God out of the public square over the last half of a century and then wonder where He went as these shootings happen. Children are being raised to believe that nothing exists but this life and there is no comeuppance in another life after this one. Whatever we do will either be remembered here on earth after we die or it won't, but there's nothing to hope for or look forward to. There's no objective reason to be "good", to treat our neighbors with dignity, respect, or just plain kindness. Life doesn't have inherent value and truth, itself, is subjective.
With all of that, it's no wonder that more and more people have such a low view of life (even their own) that they don't mind taking it from others.
A person who wants to kill others will find ways to do it unless their moral compass is reset.
We as a society have worked very, very hard to throw God out of the public square over the last half of a century and then wonder where He went as these shootings happen. Children are being raised to believe that nothing exists but this life and there is no comeuppance in another life after this one. Whatever we do will either be remembered here on earth after we die or it won't, but there's nothing to hope for or look forward to. There's no objective reason to be "good", to treat our neighbors with dignity, respect, or just plain kindness. Life doesn't have inherent value and truth, itself, is subjective.
With all of that, it's no wonder that more and more people have such a low view of life (even their own) that they don't mind taking it from others.
A person who wants to kill others will find ways to do it unless their moral compass is reset.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 9:54 am to TDsngumbo
I am conservative and gun neutral. I want guns out of the hands of bad people. The vast majority of all the gun murders that happen are the result of a person illegally obtaining a firearm.
The VAST MAJORITY of gun crimes are caused by folks that DONT FOLLOW the LAW! More LAWS won’t solve that problem! We need to better enforce the laws we have and SEVERELY punish those who have an illegal firearm in their possession.
The VAST MAJORITY of gun crimes are caused by folks that DONT FOLLOW the LAW! More LAWS won’t solve that problem! We need to better enforce the laws we have and SEVERELY punish those who have an illegal firearm in their possession.
This post was edited on 2/15/18 at 9:56 am
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