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Started By
Message
Liberal Folks, Should We Tax the Rich?
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:29 pm
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:29 pm
So I did a bit of research.
Turns out, we are already doing that. Who knew??? The top 1% of American earners account for 40% of the federal income tax collected.
This Congress is looking to spend approximately 5 trillion on social programs, etc.
There are 700 ish billionaires in the USA. The net worth of these individuals is just shy of 4.5 trillion. Think about it. The feds can confiscate their entire net worth, and not pay for the spending they are proposing. And we all know that is not realistic. Nobody is repossessing 4.5 trillion in assets.
So my question to you, where do you get the money from? The 1% already accounts for such a large amount of income tax?
Who do you take from now? Corporations? Are you aware that corporations are just people? And a lot of average folks own these corporations. If you have a retirement account or participate in a pension plan, you're one of those average folks who has an ownership stake.
My point... what you want is not possible. There is not enough wealth in existence to 'tax the rich' to create these social programs. You have to tax the average taxpayer.
Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
Turns out, we are already doing that. Who knew??? The top 1% of American earners account for 40% of the federal income tax collected.
This Congress is looking to spend approximately 5 trillion on social programs, etc.
There are 700 ish billionaires in the USA. The net worth of these individuals is just shy of 4.5 trillion. Think about it. The feds can confiscate their entire net worth, and not pay for the spending they are proposing. And we all know that is not realistic. Nobody is repossessing 4.5 trillion in assets.
So my question to you, where do you get the money from? The 1% already accounts for such a large amount of income tax?
Who do you take from now? Corporations? Are you aware that corporations are just people? And a lot of average folks own these corporations. If you have a retirement account or participate in a pension plan, you're one of those average folks who has an ownership stake.
My point... what you want is not possible. There is not enough wealth in existence to 'tax the rich' to create these social programs. You have to tax the average taxpayer.
Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
29
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:32 pm to fjlee90
But AOC wore a cool dress
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:32 pm to fjlee90
I clipped an article out of the Journal of Accountancy (yes, I am a nerd) and keep it on my desk for such discussions.
For the 2017 tax year, the top 1%:
1.43m returns
$515,371 AGI Floor
Share of total AGI - 21%
Share of all income tax paid 38.5%
Average tax rate 26.8
For the 2017 tax year, the top 1%:
1.43m returns
$515,371 AGI Floor
Share of total AGI - 21%
Share of all income tax paid 38.5%
Average tax rate 26.8
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:33 pm to onmymedicalgrind
quote:
But AOC wore a dress she ripped off from Joy Villa
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:36 pm to AUauditor
quote:
For the 2017 tax year, the top 1%:
1.43m returns
$515,371 AGI Floor
Share of total AGI - 21%
Share of all income tax paid 38.5%
Average tax rate 26.8
Now do 20 years ago. It is quite eye opening how much the wealthy contribute to federal coffers. And how much that has increased by percentage over the past few decades.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:37 pm to AUauditor
quote:
AUauditor
No shame in being an accounting nerd. Now, an Auburn grad...
The real shame is the people clamoring to tax the rich are the 50% who don't pay taxes in the first place. Wealthy Dims are happy paying taxes because they look at it as charitable contributions. I'm a CPA and my liberal clients almost never make any charitable contributions. It's always the conservatives who make substantial charitable contributions. And it's not just giving money to church, either.
This post was edited on 9/16/21 at 12:38 pm
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:39 pm to fjlee90
quote:And what % of national income do they earn? I'll help you - it's probably 20-21%.
The top 1% of American earners account for 40% of the federal income tax collected.
The dirty secret is middle class taxes need to go up.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:39 pm to fjlee90
quote:
Liberal Folks, Should We Tax the Rich?
quote:
Turns out, we are already doing that. Who knew??? The top 1% of American earners account for 40% of the federal income tax collected.
You have to calculate how much they make to see if what they give is so unbalanced. If I had 10 sons and 1 was a billionaire, and the others were average middle class income earners and I installed a family "annual income tax to help the family" of course the richest son would end up paying 99.99% of the tax money even if he is only 10% of my sons.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:42 pm to Rex Feral
This is usually a bait and switch.
They eventually realize that they can't raise enough from the tax the rich, so they move to the middle class.
They eventually realize that they can't raise enough from the tax the rich, so they move to the middle class.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:48 pm to Big Scrub TX
quote:
The dirty secret is middle class taxes need to go up.
Or we could have the people who contribute jack shite start paying.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:49 pm to Eurocat
Hopefully you don’t procreate
No need for more of you radical leftists.
No need for more of you radical leftists.
This post was edited on 9/16/21 at 12:50 pm
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:49 pm to fjlee90
can you just reword the question.
Do you think we should have a progressive tax or not. Of course people who make more money pay more taxes.
The question should be, should you pay a higher % for income over a million than at 50k?
I say yes.
Do you think we should have a progressive tax or not. Of course people who make more money pay more taxes.
The question should be, should you pay a higher % for income over a million than at 50k?
I say yes.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:50 pm to Tigers0918
quote:Why?
I say yes.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:51 pm to fjlee90
You realize that when a spending bill is agreed to, that doesn't mean they have to come up with all that money immediately, right? Usually the items in those bills are paid for over a very long period of time.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:53 pm to Big Scrub TX
quote:
middle class taxes need to go up.
I'd rather we reduce government spending instead, thanks.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:56 pm to AUauditor
That's how progressive taxation is meant to work.
The basic idea is that the marginal utility of money decreases as you get richer i.e. it hurts less for a rich person to be taxed more than a poor person being taxed more.
The ratio of total AGI versus share of all income tax paid doesn't seem that bad to me. It's expected from any tax system that isn't going to be flat.
The basic idea is that the marginal utility of money decreases as you get richer i.e. it hurts less for a rich person to be taxed more than a poor person being taxed more.
The ratio of total AGI versus share of all income tax paid doesn't seem that bad to me. It's expected from any tax system that isn't going to be flat.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:56 pm to Mickey Goldmill
Thanks, Mickey Psaki.
We plebeians never knew that.
We plebeians never knew that.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 12:59 pm to fjlee90
Well, you'd have to tax people making less than $400,000.
US tax brackets are much more wide than European tax brackets. I suppose some folks would want our tax system to replicate a European tax system. For example, Germany's top tax bracket kicks in at roughly $200,000 while the US top tax bracket kicks in at $400,000. Their top tax brackets are much lower so I suppose some would like our system to be like that.
Then, there's the argument to be made that the average tax payer as you mentioned makes less than $100,000. Even if higher taxes were put on those making $100,000+, it wouldn't affect the 'average tax payer.'
Or implement a VAT like in Europe. VATs are pretty efficient forms of tax and they end up raising lots of money for governments. It's also a silent tax in that people don't notice it that much.
US tax brackets are much more wide than European tax brackets. I suppose some folks would want our tax system to replicate a European tax system. For example, Germany's top tax bracket kicks in at roughly $200,000 while the US top tax bracket kicks in at $400,000. Their top tax brackets are much lower so I suppose some would like our system to be like that.
Then, there's the argument to be made that the average tax payer as you mentioned makes less than $100,000. Even if higher taxes were put on those making $100,000+, it wouldn't affect the 'average tax payer.'
Or implement a VAT like in Europe. VATs are pretty efficient forms of tax and they end up raising lots of money for governments. It's also a silent tax in that people don't notice it that much.
Posted on 9/16/21 at 1:03 pm to Big Scrub TX
quote:
The dirty secret is middle class taxes need to go up.
No, the dirty secret is the government needs to do less, a lot less. Spend less, need less.
Do away with most of the loopholes, reduce the tax rates, and watch America flourish.
This post was edited on 9/16/21 at 1:29 pm
Posted on 9/16/21 at 1:03 pm to Oswald
quote:
I'd rather we reduce government spending instead, thanks.
Reduce? Hell, just keep it the same every year and the left calls it draconian cuts that starve the poor.
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