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re: NYT: Border Patrol Tactical Team Was Ordered to Hold Back Before Confronting the Gunman

Posted on 5/28/22 at 6:55 am to
Posted by StanSmith
Member since May 2018
1064 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 6:55 am to
quote:

I'm still at a loss why no one with a gun took it upon themselves to run in.


During Charles Whitman rampage several civilians with guns joined in with the police to try and suppress Whitmans fire.
I know this from talking to Ramiro Martinez, the Austin PD officer that shot Whitman.

Posted by FlyFishinTiger
Fayetteville,AR
Member since Mar 2021
1030 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 7:55 am to
This LEO fiasco is the result of the feminization of American men. Dare we contrast this with the storming of Normandy beaches.
Posted by fr33manator
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2010
133302 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 8:27 am to
quote:

Should also be subjected to decimation per the Roman Legions punishment for cowardice.


Now this I can get behind.
Posted by StanSmith
Member since May 2018
1064 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 8:30 am to
I guess you could call it feminization.
I'm not an ubermale Rambo but I am an Army vet and was raised by a man and had uncles that provided great examples for how a man should act and what values he should follow.
The lack of action shown by law enforcement in Uvalde is beyond my comprehension. Not a man among those that stood by.
I have lost faith in the ability of most in law enforcement to do anything other than the easy part of their jobs. I know there are some in law enforcement that will do what is required in the most difficult and dangerous situations but they seem to be a minority in most departments.
Posted by HarryBalzack
Member since Oct 2012
16245 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 8:34 am to
Article VI of the Constitution says they have higher authority, but my understanding is they usually only exercise that when enforcing federal court orders or specific federal legal matters. Otherwise, they work in partnership with the locals

But, yeah, you'd think that someone from the feds would have looked around and realize the locals were running a clown show and grabbed the bull by the horns themselves.
Posted by StanSmith
Member since May 2018
1064 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 8:36 am to
Ordered by who?
Whoever it is should be fired, publicly disgraced and not hold a law enforcement job for the remainder of their lives.

The ability for a moral coward to get paid by the tax payer and suffer zero consequences for their piss poor judgment is the cherry on top of this shite sundae
Posted by LSUPilot07
Member since Feb 2022
7956 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 8:45 am to
Unfortunately in a situation like that there’s a reason tactical teams are taught to follow death to know where to go. In a situation like that there’s always going to be at least one officer that receives incoming rounds you just hope the others behind find them threat fast from those rounds and that they don’t penetrate their vests. You still have to go immediately though even knowing you will most likely take casualties.
Posted by GREENHEAD22
Member since Nov 2009
20535 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 8:53 am to
If I am a parent of one of those innocent children that was murdered I am having a hard time not killing that fat bald frick.
Posted by Ronaldo Burgundiaz
NWA
Member since Jan 2012
6746 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 8:55 am to
Posted by upgrayedd
Lifting at Tobin's house
Member since Mar 2013
138090 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 9:37 am to
Posted by deltaland
Member since Mar 2011
100387 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 9:56 am to
quote:

local police at the scene would not allow them to go after the gunman who had opened fire on students inside the school, according to two officials briefed on the situation.


How can local police “not allow them”

Did they threaten to arrest or shoot federal agents? It’s starting to look less like incompetence and more like it was intentional
Posted by IAmNERD
Member since May 2017
23720 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 9:58 am to
quote:

Initially I took a "wait and see" approach in regards to the police involved. I saw no good in piling on and shitting all over them from the jump until we learned more about what actually happened.

This. I realize that most police officers are doing a job no one else wants to do for little pay, and I normally respect what they do.

This, however, goes beyond incompetence into pure cowardice. I know the local guys, county guys, state, and federal cops don't like to step on each other's toes, but there needed to be at least one alph on that federal squad to look around at a bunch of idiots trying to frick a football and step up and say "HEY! Everybody stop what you're doing right now and give me a best plan of attack to put this psycho child-killer down, NOW! We are the feds and this is our scene now. If you don't like it, kindly frick off and I'll speak to you after we take care the a-hole with a gun inside."
Posted by deltaland
Member since Mar 2011
100387 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 9:58 am to
quote:

2-3 officers could have breached the room and had a high rate of success. And there were more than that available.


Any regular baw who can handle a gun could have put on a Kevlar vest and likely ended the situation. Guys like the shooter are weak and looking for easy targets. Not likely he would be much of an adversary. You’re not talking about a Chris Dorner type
Posted by UndercoverBryologist
Member since Nov 2020
8077 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 9:59 am to
quote:

Did they threaten to arrest or shoot federal agents? It’s starting to look less like incompetence and more like it was intentional


What would the “intention” be?

Local police and state police have operational control over these matters. School shootings are not a federal matter. The Feds were there in response to assistance, but if the local cops weren’t going to go in themselves, they almost assuredly weren’t going to let the Feds go in either.

It’s just simple small town incompetence.
Posted by Gulf Coast Tiger
Ms Gulf Coast
Member since Jan 2004
20515 posts
Posted on 5/28/22 at 9:36 pm to
quote:

It doesn’t pass the smell test in the least. I don’t hate cops in principle, but in this situation I’m finding it hard not to, for these bastards.


Sadly, There are a lot of terrible police departments in the US. This appears to be one of them

Posted by dallastigers
Member since Dec 2003
9481 posts
Posted on 5/29/22 at 3:09 pm to
quote:

Article VI of the Constitution says they have higher authority,


It’s constitution and laws made in pursuance thereof. They would have higher authority based on a federal law or defined crime under federal law meeting that criteria.

As it was written & ratified before 10th amendment the supreme law of the land should only include what powers constitution has delegated to feds and/or has prohibited the states from having, but that’s not how it plays out through various measures especially funding and broad & constantly evolving interpretation of 14th amendment along with powers granted congress to enforce its provisions.

I would still think Border would have legislative or regulatory restrictions on acting on it’s own in this situation that the FBI or maybe even the ATF might not have had.

This post was edited on 5/29/22 at 3:32 pm
Posted by ABearsFanNMS
Formerly of tLandmass now in Texas
Member since Oct 2014
19835 posts
Posted on 5/29/22 at 4:15 pm to
quote:

I have no idea — do federal officers trump local?


If Federal laws have/had been violated.
Posted by Earnest_P
Member since Aug 2021
5085 posts
Posted on 5/29/22 at 4:39 pm to
(no message)
This post was edited on 5/29/22 at 5:03 pm
Posted by Olderthandirt
Member since May 2022
559 posts
Posted on 5/29/22 at 4:45 pm to
Posted by prplhze2000
Parts Unknown
Member since Jan 2007
56887 posts
Posted on 5/29/22 at 4:59 pm to
He did wound several cops
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