re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

Only neocons and shitlibs support additional funding of Ukraine. Mostly neocons on this thread.

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I know you think you’re being sharp. But when it comes to Ukraine I was referring to their stated war aim of regaining all of the land occupied by Russia going back to 2014. They no more have the ability to reclaim areas like Crimea than Mexico does of reclaiming Texas. It’s simply unrealistic. On the other hand, Russia has made it clear now they intend on complete conquest of Ukraine and its reincorporation into Russia. That’s equally unrealistic. When you set aside emotion and look at this war objectively, you can see both sides have war aims that are completely divorced from reality.

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I know that Ukraine stated that their goal was to retake the Donbas and Crimea, but goals are goals and reality is reality.

This war began in 2014 and we have witnessed a lot of death and destruction. Ukraine has fought for 8 years with very little help from the West. We didn’t get heavily involved until March of 22.

Where were all these peaceniks for those 8 years? They only surfaced bigly after Putin was stymied at the gates of Kiev anc was run out of Kharkiv and Kherson City.

Review the we record. Peace talks have been held in regards to Ukraine for the entire decade. Treaties were signed to protect the peace and were broken.

Why would you expect a workable treaty now?

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Big elections this year. High leverage opportunities where peace may be beneficial for pols.

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You are dreaming

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Macron just made a speech to the French parliament. I don't parlez vous, but it sounded bellicose.

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It seems the Russian support checks have stopped coming. French politicans of all stripes are now unloading on Putin. Even political streetwalker Marie Le Pen has now done a 180 and has unfriended Vlad. LINK

So sad to see how the beliefs and efforts of decades can quickly be lost. I know, just shocking.

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I think the administration will say and do most anything to calm the public.

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How would Potatobrain & Co acknowledging the arrest of cyberperps seven months after the fact "calm the public"?

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I'd rather it be buried at the bottom of the sea than have it be used to kill our brothers in Christ.

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So you ok with Russian Christians murdering innocent civilian Ukrainian Christians? You ok with Russian Christians waging a war of aggression against Ukrainian Christians? Would you have opposed French and Spanish Christians supporting American Christians against British Christians in 1776? You would have been opposed to American Christians fighting German and Italian Christians in WW2?

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I know that Ukraine stated that their goal was to retake the Donbas and Crimea, but goals are goals and reality is reality.

This war began in 2014 and we have witnessed a lot of death and destruction. Ukraine has fought for 8 years with very little help from the West. We didn’t get heavily involved until March of 22.

Where were all these peaceniks for those 8 years? They only surfaced bigly after Putin was stymied at the gates of Kiev anc was run out of Kharkiv and Kherson City.

Review the we record. Peace talks have been held in regards to Ukraine for the entire decade. Treaties were signed to protect the peace and were broken.

Why would you expect a workable treaty now?

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Who said I expect a workable treaty now? In fact, I said the exact opposite. The prospects of a workable treaty are pretty much nonexistent at this time. I’ve said this multiple times for a long time now. Ukraine and Russia both have war goals that neither has the military capability to achieve. And neither is willing to compromise, at least at this time. This war, which already resembles WWI in multiple ways, will end the same as that war did; namely when one side reaches exhaustion and collapse. The only question left to answer is which side that will be.

Right now, the long term prospects do not favor Ukraine. I don’t say that out of any hate for Ukraine or love for Russia. I have no emotional attachment to either. It’s just the objective truth.

But that is not to say there is no chance for Ukrainian prospects to improve. But that will require an industrial mobilization in the West not seen since WWII. Right now I see no evidence of this starting. But that’s what will win the war for either side, namely massive mobilization. This is a positional war of attrition. The winner will be determined by who can feed the meat grinder with more men and more material longer than the other side. Barring some unforeseen developments like a revolution in either Russia or Ukraine, again both unlikely in either case, its numbers that will win this war. And as things stand today, the numbers favor Russia. And that imbalance favors Russia more and more each day that the fighting continues. Ukraine has to have massive help from the West, far more than the West is providing today, to have a chance to not be the side that reaches exhaustion and collapse first. Again, all I’m saying is the objective truth, free of bias for or against either side.

Either Ukraine must receive massive help from the West, or at some point in the not too distant future they will reach that point of exhaustion and collapse that I mentioned above. And if that happens, the peace that will be imposed on them will be far worse than anything they could get today. I’m not lobbying for or against such help for Ukraine. I’m just saying that’s the reality of the situation as things stand today.

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If aid slows to Ukraine, that is COMPLETELY realistic. It may be realistic even with the aid. Ukraine's demographics are only going to get worse, and they don't have the population to continue a war of attrition forever.

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In the long term, it is possible. But it will require a lot more of the meat grinder I was just speaking about in the post right above yours. I cannot say how much blood and treasure each side will have to hemorrhage before that point is reached, but it will be substantial.

The VP for Lukoil Vitaly Robertus was found hanged on the shitter in his office. You can’t make this shite up. Guess someone got in trouble for those drone hits.

LINK

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Russia's demographics being helped either and it has more geographical territory to cover.

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It's an important point to consider. What was an asset in the past is, due to technology, becoming a liability.