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re: Israel–Hamas War Discussion Thread: News Links On First Page
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:12 pm to Keltic Tiger
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:12 pm to Keltic Tiger
Ohnoanyway.gif
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:14 pm to Keltic Tiger
quote:There is currently a brightly lit "complex" or block in the middle of Gaza City with a couple spots here and there. I'm assuming that one concentrated spot is the aforementioned hospital complex running on generators. Either Hamas smuggled in fuel for it, the Israelis let some in with the promise that if anything else lit up it would explode shortly after, or Hamas actually planned ahead.
Re the electricity issue, there are several reports that the biggest concern is for hospitals, especially the ER's. That will be a major problem.
The rest of the spots is likely personal generators that will wink out as the fuel is exhausted, if they aren't robbed first.
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:14 pm to Keltic Tiger
If Hamas had spent all that aid money on... Well... Aid... They wouldn't be having this issue
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:17 pm to IAmNERD
quote:
Also have to take into account that it was a Jewish holiday and places like the IDF base they ran through would be short staffed due to the holiday.
The holiday was part of it but also a large portion of Israel was protesting Netanyahu and many IDF members were refusing to report b/c has been busy trying to change the laws so he can avoid being prosecuted for corruption.
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:19 pm to StormyMcMan
quote:
No Middle Eastern nation wants their own repeat of the Jordanian Civil War in 1970-71. Jordan had previously taken in Palestinians in significant numbers and served as a host for the PLO. The PLO, lead by Yasser Afarat, eventually repaid this charity by attempting to assassinate King Hussein and overthrow the Jordanian Government, with Syrian assistance.
Jordan annexed the West Bank in 1950 and granted them citizenship, and they still caused problems in Jordan.
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:21 pm to choupiquesushi
quote:
humans been around long before electricity was around
But not in the numbers or density that currently exist in Gaza. Electricity is a necessity in todays world.
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:22 pm to StormyMcMan
quote:
Israel could secure a major propaganda victory by offering to transport as many Palestinian civilians to Turkey or Iran as either country would allow, then watch both nations backtrack their rhetoric and make excuses for why it was impossible.
They absolutely should do this.
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:25 pm to ned nederlander
Sucks to be them. They needed to either build their own power plant or not piss off the people powering them.
I have the same opinion on California given all the stupid bullshite they do shutting down their own plants yet buying from Arizona, Texas, and elsewhere.
I have the same opinion on California given all the stupid bullshite they do shutting down their own plants yet buying from Arizona, Texas, and elsewhere.
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:27 pm to Hateradedrink
quote:
wielding energy as a weapon just makes countries seek green alternatives even faster.
Transition to green energy in a warzone?
This post was edited on 10/11/23 at 7:28 pm
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:27 pm to OleVaught14
quote:
If Hamas had spent all that aid money on... Well... Aid... They wouldn't be having this issue
They just want to radicalize as many Palestinians as possible. The median age in Gaza is only 18. W/roughly half of the population there being children it actually benefits them to have Israel constantly retaliate against them b/c then they can position themselves as the protectors of all the young uneducated kids who grow up believing their lies.
That's one of the many horrible things about this. I keep seeing people go "Well they voted for them" but that's but really the case for most of the population. The last national election there was 17 years ago. All they know in Gaza is what Hamas tells them and since much of the population is high school aged and under they believe them.
This post was edited on 10/11/23 at 7:28 pm
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:28 pm to AmishSamurai
no?
Just in general
no one wants to be beholden to a country that can turn off power because of “reasons”
Just in general
no one wants to be beholden to a country that can turn off power because of “reasons”
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:30 pm to Dr RC
quote:
The holiday was part of it but also a large portion of Israel was protesting Netanyahu and many IDF members were refusing to report b/c has been busy trying to change the laws so he can avoid being prosecuted for corruption.
Link?
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:31 pm to Dr RC
quote:
The holiday was part of it but also a large portion of Israel was protesting Netanyahu and many IDF members were refusing to report b/c has been busy trying to change the laws so he can avoid being prosecuted for corruption.
I hadn’t heard that. That makes me wonder if Israel had some warning that this might happen, and let it play out.
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:31 pm to Hateradedrink
“Reasons” is not liking them for political reason.
Not paying your bills or slaughtering their citizens? Beyond “reasons.”
Not paying your bills or slaughtering their citizens? Beyond “reasons.”
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:49 pm to Havoc
quote:
Link?
It had been going on for some time now. Neteanyahu had really divided the country before all this started.
quote:
JERUSALEM (AP) — Thousands of Israeli protesters flooded the streets outside Israel’s Supreme Court in Jerusalem on Monday, a day before it hears a pivotal case against the curbing of the high court’s powers by Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s far-right government.
Beating drums, waving blue-and-white Israeli flags and brandishing signs saying “Freedom” and “Hands off our Supreme Court!,” thousands of protesters from cities nationwide swarmed the main intersection outside the high court in a mass rally against the government’s deeply contentious judicial overhaul that has triggered one of the biggest domestic crises in Israeli history.
The sea of protesters hoisted up a giant banner that read “The court is supreme.”
On Tuesday, all 15 of Israel’s Supreme Court justices will appear on the bench for the first time ever to hear appeals by rights groups and individuals against the first major part of the overhaul, which the the government pushed through parliament in July. The divisive law cancels the court’s ability to block government actions and appointments using the legal concept that they are “unreasonable.”
LINK
quote:
As Israel plunges deeper into crisis after the country’s parliament passed the first bill of a controversial judicial overhaul, thousands of Israeli army reservists – the backbone of the Israeli military – are threatening not to show up for work. And Israel’s leaders are sounding alarms about the country’s readiness for war.
The law that came into effect on Wednesday took away the court’s power to veto government decisions based on them being “unreasonable.” Millions opposed the change, according to opinion polls, which critics said would erode the independence of the courts and harm Israel’s democracy.
“At the current point in time, the IDF (Israel Defense Forces) is competent,” IDF Chief Spokesperson Rear Adm. Daniel Hagari told reporters on Tuesday, but he acknowledged that the country’s military readiness could be affected.
“If reservists do not show up for a long time, there will be damage to the army’s competence. It is a gradual process that will be affected according to the presence of the reservists,” he said.
The threat is unprecedented in its scope, experts say, and the military has pleaded with reservists to remain in their posts.
LINK
quote:
Some members of Israel's military reserve are refusing to report for duty, in protest against plans by the ruling right-wing government to weaken the judiciary.
DANIEL ESTRIN, BYLINE: Omer Dank is in the streets after decades in the sky. Recently retired from the air force, he fought in every major Israeli military campaign since the early '90s. Now he says Israel is fighting him.
OMER DANK: (Speaking Hebrew).
ESTRIN: "The Israeli government has launched a war against its citizens," he said in a speech at a roadside protest. "We are under attack over Israel's basic common denominator - liberal democracy." Israel's government is proposing to weaken the independence of the Supreme Court. Many Israeli reservists have threatened not to serve. Hundreds have already skipped reserve duties.
DANK: It's a real big deal.
ESTRIN: That's Dank speaking to NPR. His job was to sit in the back of an F-16 fighter jet and guide bombs to their targets.
DANK: If the courts won't be independent or won't be considered as independent by the world, by the U.N., by the U.S., every pilot in the Israeli air force will be at risk of being arrested in other countries.
ESTRIN: Israel has already faced allegations of war crimes for its airstrikes on Gaza, killing civilians while fighting Hamas. Some officials have even faced European arrest warrants. But Israel has staved off prosecution, arguing that its judiciary holds the military to account. Human rights groups say Israel doesn't do that enough. Dank says the proposed legal changes could tip the balance.
DANK: No one will be able to give us the assurance that it will be OK.
ESTRIN: The widespread calls for disobedience throughout Israel's military units are unprecedented. In Israel, most citizens must serve in the military, and many volunteer for decades in the reserves. Israel's military depends on reservists for special missions. Chief of Staff Herzi Halevi is worried.
LINK
This post was edited on 10/11/23 at 7:52 pm
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:54 pm to Havoc
quote:
Link?
What DrRC said is true. A decent portion of Israelis don't want Bibi, and many of them were protesting him. Some of those were even in the towns that saw some of the worst of the Hamas slaughter. One town had a large anti-Bibi banner displayed on its water tower. It also isn't untrue that prior to this attack he was looking at options to minimize blowback on himself.
There is also a contingent of Israelis who blame him for allowing Hamas to get to where they could pull this off. Not that he directly allowed this attack, but instead he directly fostered the growth of Hamas in Gaza by way of policy.
This post was edited on 10/11/23 at 8:02 pm
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:56 pm to Dr RC
quote:Yep, huge scandal and major political upheaval there over this blatant corruption prior to this most recent conflict...now they have a unified gov
has been busy trying to change the laws so he can avoid being prosecuted for corruption.
Anyone who follows middle east foreign affairs would tell you the timing of this massive intelligence failure is vv interesting
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:58 pm to BigBinBR
quote:
I hadn’t heard that. That makes me wonder if Israel had some warning that this might happen, and let it play out.
I said earlier in this thread that the cynic could look at some of what Bibi said following the attack, look at Egypt emphatically stating that they gave warning prior to the attack, and draw that conclusion.
This post was edited on 10/11/23 at 7:59 pm
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:59 pm to LegendInMyMind
quote:
I said earlier in this thread that the critical thinker could look at some of what Bibi said, look at Egypt emphatically stating that they gave warning prior to the attack, and draw that conclusion.
Posted on 10/11/23 at 7:59 pm to BigBinBR
quote:
I hadn’t heard that. That makes me wonder if Israel had some warning that this might happen, and let it play out.
It makes for a good conspiracy but I doubt it. Odds are he's going to have to step down once the war is over. This happened on his watch and I don't see how it's possible he can avoid the blame.
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