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re: Could a modern supercar complete a 500 mile Nascar oval race?
Posted on 12/10/18 at 10:31 am to BayouBlitz
Posted on 12/10/18 at 10:31 am to BayouBlitz
Give me some numbers then.
What my quick google search gives me is:
Laferrari 217
Aventador 217
720s 212
Gt2rs 212
What my quick google search gives me is:
Laferrari 217
Aventador 217
720s 212
Gt2rs 212
1
Posted on 12/10/18 at 10:37 am to weagle99
I don't know about that. But I do know second place is the first place loser baw!
Posted on 12/10/18 at 10:58 am to DarthRebel
quote:
No, I just understand consumer built vs. race built. They really are 2 different worlds
Obviously.
quote:
You cannot take any modern supercar and even come close to surviving a complete race vs. race built NASCAR.
That's the base 1st gen Mclaren MP4-12C which is a Supercar yes, the title of the thread says Supercar but the body of the post is referring to hypercars basically.Anyway, that Mclaren was on street tires of course it's going to get killed versus a racing slick race car anywhere.
Aventador V12(If we have to use an aventador, let's at least use the SV)
LaFerrari V12 Hybrid (Hybrid wouldn't do much good on 500 mile oval)
Bugatti W16 AWD (Heaviest most luxurious)
Let's throw out the above hypercars and just go with modern supercars on tires that are appropriate for the track or put the nascar on street tires.
So a Ford GT(supercar) - lightweight ~650hp fully integrated roll cage with hydraulic suspension active aero and was basically designed for endurance racing from the ground up.
Yes, I know that above picture is the actual race car but just like any race car it is designed to a formula and I'm sure it's limited in its own way.
Look! They've even been to Daytona.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:01 am to Hermit Crab
quote:
Hermit Crab
You are right, do not get sucked down to their level
There are very few consumer built cars that can pass the 200mph level and most doing it are at max performance level. NASCAR can cruise at that speed.
A Veyron weighs 1000 more pounds than a NASCAR. A Aventador weighs 600 more pounds.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:04 am to achenator
quote:
that car is barely breathing at 124. At its max of 270 its a different story. It may be ok at 180-200. I was mainly thinking of a Aventador. I don't think it could handle 500 miles at wide open.
I can’t believe this is even a discussion. SMH
In order for these supercars to perform at ~200 mph they are pushing the limits of aerodynamics and air consumption for their design. Put it in NASCAR race where it can’t get clean air and say “good by” to its downforce and most of its power. Those cars aren’t designed to operate in a pack, five feet from the car in front of it, behind it, and to either side of it. It’s going to overheat, it’s engine won’t be able to breathe, and it’ll lose all of its controll.
It’s also a world of difference running near the redline for 3 hours straight verses the 20 minutes they test a supercar for. I’d be willing to bet that even if you gave a Bugatti the ideal tires and put it in the track by itself at Dega running at 200 mph, it’ll blow its engine before it’s third tank of gas is used.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:06 am to weagle99
Of course. Stupid question.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:08 am to SlapahoeTribe
This is like trying to compare a cigarette boat to a military ship. Different worlds completely. They'd smoke a stock car for 10 laps. Then kaboom.
This post was edited on 12/10/18 at 11:09 am
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:09 am to weagle99
Short answer? Not only no, but hell no.
I have had the privilege of disassembling a Yates motor built for Talladega. Anyone who thinks NASCAR engines/engineering/builds are crude and simple just don't know what they are talking about.
There is not a supercar built that could even begin to take the kind of abuse that a NASCAR race like Daytona, Talladega, Atlanta, Texas Motor Speedway, or even Pocono puts on these cars. Short tracks would be even worse.
I have had the privilege of disassembling a Yates motor built for Talladega. Anyone who thinks NASCAR engines/engineering/builds are crude and simple just don't know what they are talking about.
There is not a supercar built that could even begin to take the kind of abuse that a NASCAR race like Daytona, Talladega, Atlanta, Texas Motor Speedway, or even Pocono puts on these cars. Short tracks would be even worse.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:11 am to DarthRebel
quote:
A Veyron weighs 1000 more pounds than a NASCAR. A Aventador weighs 600 more pounds.
quote:quote:Let's throw out the above hypercars and just go with modern supercars
s14suspense
Nascar weight (3250)
Ford GT weight (3054 lbs. to a top speed of 216 mph) and that's with air bags and navigation and a warranty. The second you start levelling the playing field with tires(most important factor) and fuel(Nascar is running E85 no? I'm sure the ford GT could push much higher hp and run cooler with E85) you wipe away the advantages of the Nascars.
This post was edited on 12/10/18 at 11:18 am
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:13 am to EarlyCuyler3
quote:
This is like trying to compare a cigarette boat to a military ship. Different worlds completely. They'd smoke a stock car for 10 laps. Then kaboom.
Then how is it that they make it through the entire Rolex 24?
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:13 am to troyt37
Even stock cars themselves struggle at short tracks. Look at how many brakes and tires fail at martinsville every time.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:15 am to weagle99
NASCAR isn’t a sport
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:17 am to troyt37
You're average supercar/hypercar no way. They simply aren't built for that.
I do wonder if a McLaren F1 would be able to do it. Much higher top speed than a NASCAR and the are proven endurance racing machines.
The F1 race cars that won the 24 hours of Le Mans were seriously just street cars retuned and caged. Some suspension components changed out as well. It was never intended to be a race car.
It beat out several purpose built race cars in a 24 hour race. I think it could hang.
An aventador would overheat after a few laps. Laughable to think it could compete.
I do wonder if a McLaren F1 would be able to do it. Much higher top speed than a NASCAR and the are proven endurance racing machines.
The F1 race cars that won the 24 hours of Le Mans were seriously just street cars retuned and caged. Some suspension components changed out as well. It was never intended to be a race car.
It beat out several purpose built race cars in a 24 hour race. I think it could hang.
An aventador would overheat after a few laps. Laughable to think it could compete.
This post was edited on 12/10/18 at 11:22 am
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:19 am to s14suspense
Horsepower to Weight
Ford GT - 0.2167 (650HP @ 3000lbs)
NASCAR - 0.2647 (900HP @3400lbs) @ or 0.2206 (750HP @3400lbs)
NASCAR has better power to weight and will win the oval race with ease and would lap GT in 500 mile race. GT will have 50/50 chance against 750HP engine in road race and less than 50% against 900HP engine. GT would complete either race.
NASCAR continues to restrict engine HP, thus the 750 number. GT would fail any scenario with fully unrestricted NASCAR engine.
Ford GT - 0.2167 (650HP @ 3000lbs)
NASCAR - 0.2647 (900HP @3400lbs) @ or 0.2206 (750HP @3400lbs)
NASCAR has better power to weight and will win the oval race with ease and would lap GT in 500 mile race. GT will have 50/50 chance against 750HP engine in road race and less than 50% against 900HP engine. GT would complete either race.
NASCAR continues to restrict engine HP, thus the 750 number. GT would fail any scenario with fully unrestricted NASCAR engine.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:23 am to EarlyCuyler3
quote:
Even stock cars themselves struggle at short tracks. Look at how many brakes and tires fail at martinsville every time.
Ding Ding Ding!
These modern supercars aren't catching fire or burning their brakes up. If anything they're all under-tired because street-car and over ventilated in order to perform the same in death valley and in the arctic circle.
at the rednecks saying the race cars are cruising along at 200 and a modern supercar is on the bleeding edge of blowing up at 200. Never heard of the autobahn or nurburgring. Bumpy
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:24 am to weagle99
Cars like these ran 200MPH for 500 mile races in 1969, they were modified production cars, NASCAR rules said a car had to be have had 500 units produced to qualify, the engine used had to be the engine that was offered in the car by the manufacturer. They were pretty far removed from the one of a kind built from the ground up units raced today. Notice the lack of aerodynamics, they were checked to assure all body panels were stock.
This post was edited on 12/10/18 at 11:26 am
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:24 am to EarlyCuyler3
quote:
Even stock cars themselves struggle at short tracks. Look at how many brakes and tires fail at martinsville every time.
Common sense is gone. The best NASCAR cars cost many times what these supercars cost, and they aren't spending that money on Corinthian leather, gold plated instrument clusters, and paint jobs that immediately make your girlfriends panties wet. They spend millions upon millions to go faster, and endure a 500-600 mile race.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:25 am to DarthRebel
quote:
NASCAR continues to restrict engine HP, thus the 750 number. GT would fail any scenario with fully unrestricted NASCAR engine.
quote:
fuel(Nascar is running E85 no? I'm sure the ford GT could push much higher hp and run cooler with E85) you wipe away the advantages of the Nascars.
You don't think Ford restricts power on their street-cars due to warranty/emissions/fuel economy???
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:25 am to MountainTiger
quote:
Then how is it that they make it through the entire Rolex 24?
That's not a wide open oval.
Posted on 12/10/18 at 11:25 am to MountainTiger
Uh do you not realize the C7r 911 Rsr and all the other supercrs at the 24 hours of Lemans aren't showroom cars? You can't just buy a 400k GT and think you're going to race for 24 hours. There are numerous improves to the engine, suspension brakes and tires that need to be done. Not to mention all the safety stuff.
A Buggati is not going to last more than 10 laps before either the brakes, tires, or engines explode at consistent wot
A Buggati is not going to last more than 10 laps before either the brakes, tires, or engines explode at consistent wot
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