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re: Watched Rambo III - why was Russia interested in Afghanistan?
Posted on 6/12/21 at 8:55 am to Gravitiger
Posted on 6/12/21 at 8:55 am to Gravitiger
Afghanistan bordered the Soviet Union.
1
Posted on 6/12/21 at 8:59 am to OleWar
quote:
This and the opposition to the Communist government in Kabul, took the form of Jihadist Islam. The Soviets were always fearful that this contagion could spread into the Central Asian and Muslim populations in Russia. Remember this was the time when Islamic fundamentalism was replacing nationalist movements in the greater Middle East.
This is anachronistic. The opposition to the communist government in 1978 was formed by a variety of groups, including the other major communist faction in the country. Jihadist groups did not form along those explicit lines until the middle of the 80's, with concurrent formation of Islamic resistance groups forming in numerous areas. So it is definitely not accurate to suggest the Soviets were worried about Jihadis at the beginning of the invasion, as their explicit justification was part of the Brezhnev Doctrine. The replacement of nationalist movements with fundamentalist movements started in 79 in earnest, but those considerations didn't make it into Soviet support of the new Iranian regime, which had a much deeper historical relationship to Central Asian Soviet states than Afghanistan.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:01 am to Epaminondas
quote:It bordered the Soviet Union for 60 years before they invaded. And there were a dozen other countries that bordered the Soviet Union that they didn't invade.
Afghanistan bordered the Soviet Union.
This post was edited on 6/12/21 at 9:06 am
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:02 am to Gravitiger
quote:
Which was started and funded by the Soviets. The question is why?
Because there were still major factions within the communists in Afghanistan despite the fact they controlled the government. Essentially the Soviets were fearful that the Khalqist faction led by Hafizullah Amin would seek out US support, which was a red line to the Soviets who were operating under the Brezhnev Doctrine. Thus they invaded in order to install their preferred leader.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:06 am to thelawnwranglers
quote:It wasn't.
why was Russia interested in Afghanistan?
But those with power and control used the Russians to gain more power and wealth by gaining control of the 10s of trillions in untapped natural resources as well as the largest poppy field on the planet, among other things.
When the Russians failed, they called upon the United States. And the rest as they say is history...or current events depending on how you look at it.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:08 am to crazy4lsu
Britain had feared that the Russians would move on India at the beginning of "The Great Game." The first British/Afghan war ended badly for the Brits, but they achieved their goals in the second round. Saying it is where empires go to die isn't always the case, though some have spent way too much time and energy there.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:11 am to TheFonz
quote:
I’m sure, as it is with such things, there are multiple, more complicated reasons.
It’s biblical. Russia (Magog) will get together with the rest of the Middle East eventually.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:16 am to thelawnwranglers
pipeline from north of Afghanistan to markets.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:18 am to thelawnwranglers
When I was in Afghanistan in 2010, I was amazed seeing several Russian tanks and trucks that was left back in different areas.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:22 am to thelawnwranglers
Afghanistan was a bordering country to the USSR. They had a local interest in controlling the territory.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:24 am to SpotCheckBilly
quote:
Britain had feared that the Russians would move on India at the beginning of "The Great Game." The first British/Afghan war ended badly for the Brits, but they achieved their goals in the second round. Saying it is where empires go to die isn't always the case, though some have spent way too much time and energy there.
It is probably true of the US and Russia, who were bogged down in pointless quagmires. But the region was conquered and ruled by the various Persians empires, various Greek empires, the Mauryans, and the Arabs. The big difference in winning is a desire to use the region as more than either resource extraction or a buffer state.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:37 am to thelawnwranglers
Look at the wars the United States has fought in Asia since 1950. Now look at where China is located. We armed the Taliban to the teeth so they could kill Russians. When we fought against the Taliban and OSB, they killed our own troops with weapons we gave them for free (see also Iraqi army). CIA made sure we sided against the Taliban and with the opium growers in the 2000s.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:46 am to TX Tiger
quote:
ontrol of the 10s of trillions in untapped natural resources
I hear this mentioned a lot. So who is now getting these resources? What company/country is extracting them and selling them?
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:53 am to notiger1997
quote:I haven't kept up with this in several years - just too depressing. Sometimes you just have to take a break from the Clown World.
ontrol of the 10s of trillions in untapped natural resources
I hear this mentioned a lot. So who is now getting these resources? What company/country is extracting them and selling them?
Last I checked it was China (surprise, surprise). But here's the kicker - they were mining with protection from the U.S. military.
Like I said, Clown World.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 9:53 am to TheFonz
quote:
The Soviet defeat by 1988 contributes to the saying “Afghanistan is where empires go to die.” The Brits lost, the Soviets lost, and we lost.
Can someone tell China how much opium they have and let China give it a shot?
Posted on 6/12/21 at 10:04 am to thelawnwranglers
The powerful individuals who pass laws to establish monopolies on forbidden drugs always try to obtain those same drugs for profitable distribution.
Afghanistan is a drug operation disguised as a war against terrorism. Vietnam was a drug operation disguised as a war against communism. It doesn't matter how many people die if profit is enormous.
Afghanistan is a drug operation disguised as a war against terrorism. Vietnam was a drug operation disguised as a war against communism. It doesn't matter how many people die if profit is enormous.
This post was edited on 6/12/21 at 10:05 am
Posted on 6/12/21 at 10:13 am to thelawnwranglers
The Communist Afghan government came to power in a coup in 1978, they swiftly attempted to modernize/centralize/secularize the country. This was done not over decades but quickly and violently. The Russians unleashed a wave of oppression upon the Afghan people. Most of the country, particularly rural religious elites were opposed, they soon saw the modernization as an attack on their way of life, which it was considering Afghanistan is made up of tribal sects and rebelled against the government.
Once other Muslim countries saw their fellow Muslims being oppressed by a secular government, and later by the officially atheist USSR, foreign fighters, notably the Chechen Mujahideen swarmed to the country. Osama Bin Laden joined the Jihad against the Russians.
Once other Muslim countries saw their fellow Muslims being oppressed by a secular government, and later by the officially atheist USSR, foreign fighters, notably the Chechen Mujahideen swarmed to the country. Osama Bin Laden joined the Jihad against the Russians.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 10:20 am to CobraCommander83
There’s an Australian doc series on Prime called Journeys to the Ends of the Earth filmed in 1999. David Adams is the host. One of the episodes is on Afghanistan, with the goal of visiting the Lost Buddhas (before the Taliban destroyed them). It shows how he has to deal with Taliban to get permission, and also discusses the aftermath of British and Soviet invasions. It’s pretty crazy to watch knowing 9/11 was just around the corner.
Edited to add link to the episode:
Here’s the episode
Edited to add link to the episode:
Here’s the episode
This post was edited on 6/12/21 at 10:22 am
Posted on 6/12/21 at 10:20 am to thelawnwranglers
So, the reasons, which are all probably accurate and intertwined with each other, are:
1.) Spread the Communist revolution
2.) Crush Islamist insurgency to prevent spread into Soviet Union itself
3.) Support new Afghan commie government
4.) Resources are a bonus
How was the Sino-Soviet relationship in the 80’s after their falling out in the 60’s? I’m sure there were reasons Afghanistan could help put the screws to China.
1.) Spread the Communist revolution
2.) Crush Islamist insurgency to prevent spread into Soviet Union itself
3.) Support new Afghan commie government
4.) Resources are a bonus
How was the Sino-Soviet relationship in the 80’s after their falling out in the 60’s? I’m sure there were reasons Afghanistan could help put the screws to China.
This post was edited on 6/12/21 at 10:21 am
Posted on 6/12/21 at 10:21 am to thelawnwranglers
Access to a warm water port was one of the reasons I remember given back then. Afghanistan didn't have that access but it got them a lot closer with only parts of Iran or Pakistan in the way.
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