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re: Russia on verge of biggest gain in Ukraine since summer
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:34 pm to GumboPot
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:34 pm to GumboPot
quote:
At this point I don't know what the answer is. I don't have enough data and only see the same news you see. But what's happening right now is not working.
My question has nothing to do with data.
You think it is reasonable to demand that any country agree that its neighbor gets to control its political and foreign policy decisions?
That is simply a nonstarter for almost every nation on earth, and definitely for one of Ukraine's size. We are not talking about Monaco, etc here.
This post was edited on 1/12/23 at 3:36 pm
1
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:35 pm to GumboPot
quote:
Zelensky had a chance to get out and he chose death of his people instead. What a dummy.
He could have cut a deal with Putin, doomed thousands of his citizens to Russia, left Russian armies on his borders, and waited for Putin to attack for the third time, or he could have continued to fight Russian aggression.
Luckily for Ukraine Zelensky is no Neville Chamberlain who traded land for a faux peace.
This post was edited on 1/12/23 at 3:45 pm
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:36 pm to BigMob
quote:
They didn’t happen to include pics of this did they?
Social media will ban you if they are posted. Photos are around if you know where to look. Makes a WWI battlefield look great. Masses of infantry charging and chopped up like sausage in a meat grinder
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:36 pm to CitizenK
quote:
Photos are around if you know where to look.
aka r/combatfootage
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:39 pm to GumboPot
quote:
"Ukraine should allow Russia to annex its territory" is such a bizarre opinion to hold. What choice do they have?
Fight back just as they are,
That’s their only real option. They once were under Russian control and they hate the Russians for treating them like dogs. They don’t want to ever go back.
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:43 pm to Indefatigable
quote:
You think it is reasonable to demand that any country agree that its neighbor gets to control its political and foreign policy decisions?
The problem for Ukraine is the U.S. having control over Ukraine's foreign policy decisions. There would be no war if there were not Western influence in Ukraine.
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:43 pm to doubleb
quote:
doomed thousands of his citizens to Russia,
You mean ones who want to be with Russia?
The thing to do is let people have the government they choose. Ukraine or Russian.
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:43 pm to GumboPot
quote:
If Zelensky was smart he would have gave Putin assurances more than a year ago that he would not join NATO going forward and maybe form a relationship with Russia so they can live in peace. Now with Western interest involved Russia and Ukraine can never reconcile.
Putin invaded in 2014. Ukrainians hate Russia.
They already had deals with Russia and Putin reneged. Why give up something when the other guy is a proven liar? They had already tried that when they gave up their nukes.
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:43 pm to Powerman
quote:
Be sure to seek medical attention if your erection lasts longer than 4 hours
I'm not happy for Russia.
I'm happy that people like you, who have had Biden's cock down to your trachea since he was elected, are being made fools, AGAIN, by believing, YOUR MEDIA, has been telling the truth rather than what Biden's tells them to report.
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:46 pm to GumboPot
quote:
The problem for Ukraine is the U.S. having control over Ukraine's foreign policy decisions. There would be no war if there were not Western influence in Ukraine.
Do you even consider the possibility that Western influence in Ukraine is present because Ukraine wants to further integrate with the West? They have been generally moving that direction economically and politically for three decades. Is that not entirely within Ukraine's sovereign prerogative?
This post was edited on 1/12/23 at 3:47 pm
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:46 pm to Indefatigable
Zelensky Is nothing but a money shuffler put in place by Obama to send our money back over to him and his group.
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:46 pm to riccoar
quote:
I'm not happy for Russia.
I'm happy that people like you, who have had Biden's cock down to your trachea since he was elected, are being made fools, AGAIN, by believing, YOUR MEDIA, has been telling the truth rather than what Biden's tells them to report.
Uh I'm no Biden fan at all
Stop being a retard
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:47 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
The thing to do is let people have the government they choose. Ukraine or Russian.
Sure, I’d be for that.
Open the borders and let folks migrate to Russia or to Ukraine.
After a year close the borders and its back to business as usual.
Of course Russia troops would have to leave Ukraine.
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:49 pm to GumboPot
Oh no, they will then control the biolabs which create the superhuman gay demon Jewish Nazi soldiers
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:49 pm to GumboPot
quote:He had a chance in April. The UK and US scuttled it.
Zelensky should have crafted a peace deal when he had a chance.
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:50 pm to Indefatigable
quote:
Do you even consider the possibility that Western influence in Ukraine is present because Ukraine wants to further integrate with the West? They have been generally moving that direction economically and politically for three decades. Is that not entirely within Ukraine's sovereign prerogative?
If you are Ukraine or any other Western nation fearful of Russia you’d beg NATO to take you in under their umbrella.
If you wanted to prosper, have open markets, and grow your economy you’d beg to get into the EU.
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:51 pm to Indefatigable
quote:
Do you even consider the possibility that Western influence in Ukraine is present because Ukraine wants to further integrate with the West? They have been generally moving that direction economically and politically for three decades. Is that not entirely within Ukraine's sovereign prerogative?
Sure. But why isolate Russia?
Are we really scared of Russia or they just a foil for aggressive foreign policy to continue NATO?
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:51 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
The thing to do is let people have the government they choose. Ukraine or Russian.
In other words just cede territory to Russia. The pre-invasion areas of Donestk and Luhansk that were occupied by Russia in 2014 have already been Russified. The pro-Kiev population left years ago for the most part.
You want to set that precedent? I guess all we have to do is invade Alberta, expel the native Canadians, transplant the Dutton family in their place, then hold a plebiscite?
There are a few million Czechs who will testify that your idea isn't a very good one and will not prevent the aggressor from coming back for more.
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:51 pm to Harpo67
quote:
Zelensky Is nothing but a money shuffler put in place by Obama to send our money back over to him and his group.
Geez
Zelensky was elected at the end of Trump’s term.
Posted on 1/12/23 at 3:52 pm to GumboPot
quote:
Sure. But why isolate Russia?
Who is isolating Russia in this case? If anyone, its Moscow and its shitty domineering policies that it uses with its neighbors and former satellites. If it treated the former Warsaw Pact was equals instead of vassals, this would not be the trend.
NATO continues to exist because its members want it to. It really is as simple as that. There doesn't need to be any other reason. And I'll remind you that the former Soviet countries are NATO's most ardent supporters.
This post was edited on 1/12/23 at 3:54 pm
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