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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

Posted on 7/17/23 at 9:50 am to
Posted by GeauxxxTigers23
TeamBunt General Manager
Member since Apr 2013
62514 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 9:50 am to
quote:

Can't really prove a negative


That’s what everyone here is doing

The simplest explanation is that Ukraine blew the bridge. You guys call everything a Russian false flag. When was the last actual Russian false flag?
Posted by JohnnyKilroy
Cajun Navy Vice Admiral
Member since Oct 2012
41375 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 9:52 am to
quote:

RogerTheShrubber

You ever figure out which other countries are being actively invaded by a foreign power while the US sits idly by despite promising protection?
Posted by tigeraddict
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2007
14888 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 9:55 am to
quote:

he simplest explanation is that Ukraine blew the bridge.


i dont think anyone here has said otherwise. What everyone is questioning is how it was launched, sea based drone, air based drone, missile, or truck bomb. and other question is where, From sea of Azov (which russia controls all ports within), from Taman (city on east east of Bridge, so infiltration units), or from Black sea (long range from Ukrainian cost, and long range from Ukraine merchant traffic, or 3rd party merchant from closer
Posted by Hateradedrink
Member since May 2023
4156 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 10:01 am to
Running theory with the most chatter right now seems to be a sea-based drone. The thought seems to be that at least guidance came from the Russian side of the bridge. Missile or other air-based modality is unlikely because there was no air defense activity.

It’s still possible a drone was launched from a commercial ship and guided from ops on the Russian side.
Posted by Tigris
Cloud Cuckoo Land
Member since Jul 2005
13163 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 10:39 am to
quote:

Running theory with the most chatter right now seems to be a sea-based drone.


I think that makes the most sense. If you look at the bridge the automobile lanes are lower and closer to the water than the train section, so an explosion from something sea-based will do a lot more damage to the auto bridge. Ukraine probably would have targeted the train bridge otherwise.
Posted by GOP_Tiger
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2005
21020 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 10:56 am to
Russian independent media outlet Meduza (now operating from Latvia):

quote:

The July 17 Crimea bridge explosion was a joint operation between the Ukrainian Security Service and the Ukrainian Navy, according to a source close to the Ukrainian Defense Ministry’s Main Intelligence Directorate who spoke to Meduza on condition of anonymity. This was previously reported by the Ukrainian outlets Ukrainska Pravda and RBC Ukraine.

According to Meduza’s source, the attack involved “the same type of underwater drones as the ones used on Sevastopol about three months ago.” He said that Russia’s troops in the region don’t have the equipment necessary to detect drones from a long distance and that as a result, they didn’t detect the ones used in this attack until it was too late.

“The observers who were on duty overnight tried to hit the drones with large-caliber firearms and machine guns but were unable to,” he said.
quote:

The source also said that one of the bridge’s pillars was damaged. The Russian authorities have not confirmed this; the Russian Transport Ministry reported earlier that the roadway was damaged but noted that previous media reports about damaged pillars had not been verified. The claim has also not been confirmed by independent sources.

Meduza’s source noted that while a damaged span can be “replaced by a new one,” damage to a pillar would be a more serious issue. “But the main thing is that […] if you trace the maritime border along the territory between Russia and Ukraine, then the [damaged] pillar, the 145th one, is located behind this border, on the [internationally recognized] territory of Ukraine,” he said.
Posted by NOLATiger163
Insane State of NOLA
Member since Aug 2018
628 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 11:12 am to
quote:

Ukraine probably would have targeted the train bridge otherwise.
I suspect that the Kerch train bridge is more important to Russian war logistics than is the Kerch highway bridge, and the main reason that the highway bridge has been targeted (successfully twice now) is that it can be substantially damaged with a considerably smaller warhead. The design loads for the train bridge were probably a lot larger than the design loads for the highway bridge, so almost every part of the train bridge is more strongly-built, so it would require a much larger warhead to take it out. I.e., better to take the highway bridge out of operation for a while than to cause relatively minor, quickly-repairable damage to the train bridge.
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
42746 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 11:26 am to
quote:

Is there evidence to suggest they didn’t?


Lol


For the record if Ukraine took advantage of the grain deal and used a grain ship to blow up the bridge again, I would be opposed. I think that would not be in their best interests to have the grain deal cancelled.

But no one needs to prove they did not. You have to prove they did.
Posted by Jim Rockford
Member since May 2011
105465 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 11:31 am to
It would be much stealthier and more deniable up use a trawler, of which there must be hundreds in the Black Sea at any given time.
Posted by DabosDynasty
Member since Apr 2017
5180 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 12:11 pm to
Probably a dumb question, but why wouldn’t Ukraine have used several multiples more of the same method for attacking the bridge to really knock it out for significant time? Shouldn’t that be the point? If it was 2 naval drones (I saw suggested 2 cruise missiles so that’s what I’m basing my count on) then why not 10 in 5 separate sections or less than 5 sections with more firepower to damage it more severely?

Idk shite about explosives so probably a dumb question.
Posted by tigeraddict
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2007
14888 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 12:23 pm to
quote:

Probably a dumb question, but why wouldn’t Ukraine have used several multiples more of the same method for attacking the bridge to really knock it out for significant time? Shouldn’t that be the point? If it was 2 naval drones (I saw suggested 2 cruise missiles so that’s what I’m basing my count on) then why not 10 in 5 separate sections or less than 5 sections with more firepower to damage it more severely?



speculation on my part here, but it is a lot easier to conceal the launch and approach of 2 drones then 10

especially if this was an attack launched by an infiltration force from the Azov sea or a small boat in the black sea
Posted by cypher
Member since Sep 2014
5722 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 12:28 pm to
from twitter...

Satellite view of the damaged Crimea bridge following this morning explosion




This post was edited on 7/17/23 at 12:30 pm
Posted by TBoy
Kalamazoo
Member since Dec 2007
28758 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 12:45 pm to
quote:

For the record if Ukraine took advantage of the grain deal and used a grain ship to blow up the bridge again, I would be opposed. I think that would not be in their best interests to have the grain deal cancelled.

And when we are speaking of international shipping vessels and grain haulers, these are not Ukrainian flagged vessels.
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
299716 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 12:45 pm to
quote:


You ever figure out which other countries are being actively invaded by a foreign power while the US sits idly by despite promising protection?



Answered immediately. Youre weeks behind.
Posted by JohnnyKilroy
Cajun Navy Vice Admiral
Member since Oct 2012
41375 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 12:50 pm to
quote:

Answered immediately. Youre weeks behind.


False.

Why do you lie so much?
Posted by StormyMcMan
USA
Member since Oct 2016
4689 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:15 pm to
quote:

Putin holds a televised meeting following the attack on the Crimea bridge. Will live tweets.

Given the two attacks on the Crimea bridge, I want concrete proposals on ensuring it's security - Putin

A terrorist act was carried out against the Crimea bridge - Putin

Russia's deputy PM tells Putin that one part of the road on the Crimea bridge is completely destroyed and will have to be rebuilt - Kommersant

Russian deputy PM tells Putin that by 15 September the traffic on one side of the road will reopen, while on the other side it will open by November 1 - TASS

LINK

quote:


BREAKING: Russia's Defence Ministry is preparing proposals on the answer to the Crimea bridge attack, Putin says - TASS

"It was a senseless and cruel terrorist act by Ukraine and we will respond", Putin says


LINK
Side note: I chuckle at how Putin says he will respond when Ukraine actually does something like this. You're at war and bomb cities nightly, how exactly are you going to "respond" with something different?

quote:

Russians have assembled a group of more than 100 thousand servicemen near Kupiansk and Lyman, says the Speaker of the Eastern Group of Ukrainian Armed Forces Serhii Cherevatyi.

"A very powerful group is concentrated in the Lyman-Kupiansk direction now. There are more than 100,000 troops, more than 900 tanks, and 370 MLRS," says Cherevatyi.

LINK

quote:

The President of Russia, Vladimir Putin stated today during a Televised Meeting that the Ministry of Defense is preparing a number of Response Options for the “Terrorist Attack by the Kyiv Regime” against the Kerch Striat Bridge and that he has also requested the Military to provide him with “Concrete Proposals” on the Future Security of the Bridge.

LINK

quote:

People keep asking me why only the road part of the Kerch Bridge was attacked.

This wasn’t the case, the attack on the road bridge was just a lot more successful. The rail bridge was left with limited superficial damage.

LINK
quote:

Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba is holding urgent consultations with partners at the UN headquarters after Russia's withdrawal from the "grain agreement".

The Minister announced this on Twitter.

"Russia threatens global food security. We are doing everything to save the Black Sea grain corridor," Kuleba wrote.


LINK

quote:

Putin signed a decree on the nationalization of "Baltika" and "Danone" companies. They are now under the temporary management of the state-owned company Rosimushchestvo.


Baltika is a brewery
Danone is a food company
Both are/were subsidiaries of Western companies

Rosimushchestvo is "The Federal Agency for State Property Management is a subdivision of the Russian Ministry of Economic Development"

LINK
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
42746 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:28 pm to
Putin- bombing roads, bridges, cities, apartment buildings, and schools in Ukraine is all right since we are stopping NATO aggression, bulldozing Bio Labs and stopping corruption.

Putin- it’s a terrorist act to blow up a bridge in my conquered territory.
Posted by StormyMcMan
USA
Member since Oct 2016
4689 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:30 pm to
And a few more that posted while I was making the last post

quote:

A Base for the Wagner PMC Group in the Town of Mol'kin in the Krasnodar Krai Region of Southwestern Russia will be Shutdown on July 30th with the remaining Fighters at the Base seen lowering the Wagner and Russian Flag at the Installation earlier today before leaving for New Facilities in Belarus.

LINK

quote:

#Belarus ratified the agreement with #Russia on the creation of training and combat centers for military personnel.

LINK

quote:

Azerbaijan allocates $7.6 million for humanitarian assistance to Ukraine, — Report.

It is reported that President Ilham Aliyev signed the corresponding order.

LINK


quote:

That is a lot of workers.

LINK
Posted by GOP_Tiger
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2005
21020 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:41 pm to
quote:

That is a lot of workers.


Yes, the report was that there was "minor" damage on one track on the rail bridge. Fixing that appears to be the goal of those workers.
Posted by TigersSEC2010
Warren, Michigan
Member since Jan 2010
38491 posts
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:42 pm to
quote:

EDIT 2: the pilot reportedly drowned before rescuers were able to reach him.


Good. That one loss is worth more to Russia than 5,000 conscripts getting slaughtered.
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