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re: Kobe chopper's flight pattern was just weird and all over the place

Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:00 pm to
Posted by EA6B
TX
Member since Dec 2012
14754 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:00 pm to
quote:

Maybe he COULDN'T climb because of restricted airspace above him because of all the airports in the area. Restricted airspace around airports kinda looks like an upside down wedding cake centered on the airport. Local traffic can fly under each tier of the restricted space just f


ATC would have worked to get him clearance if he had informed them of his situation, it is part of their job to get pilots out of bad situations.
This post was edited on 1/27/20 at 1:01 pm
Posted by Kingpenm3
Xanadu
Member since Aug 2011
9924 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:13 pm to
quote:

Yep. Used to take a chopper to/from practices and home games. Dude was rich enough to say frick LA traffic and had a private helicopter for his commute.



I just have no concept of how many helipads are out there or if helicopters always use "official" helipads. Could Kobe have had a pad at his house? Where could you land close to the Staples Center? His Mamba Academy?
Posted by 777Tiger
Member since Mar 2011
92315 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:14 pm to
quote:

Where could you land close to the Staples Center?


most big time sports arenas have helipads close by
Posted by Kingpenm3
Xanadu
Member since Aug 2011
9924 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:15 pm to
quote:

fog definitely was the contributing factor and pilot lost orientation
if windy as well that would have not been helpful in trying to get out of it


What kind of mechanical and tower mandated ceiling would they have? Why not just go real high in fogged out conditions?
Posted by 777Tiger
Member since Mar 2011
92315 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:16 pm to
quote:

What kind of mechanical and tower mandated ceiling would they have? Why not just go real high in fogged out conditions?


he would have to remain clear of class B airspace if he took off VFR
This post was edited on 1/27/20 at 1:19 pm
Posted by Tchefuncte Tiger
Bat'n Rudge
Member since Oct 2004
63427 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:23 pm to
quote:

What is vertigo?


Something you can get while piloting an aircraft without any horizontal references or not trusting your instruments. It's similar to spatial disorientation, which killed John F. Kennedy, Jr., and a lot of other pilots and passengers.
Posted by GeauxxxTigers23
TeamBunt General Manager
Member since Apr 2013
62514 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:23 pm to
quote:

just the opposite at work, if someone asks "did you look at the weather?" the response is "why? we're going to go anyway aren't we?"
You should try Africa, where they literally just copy and past the forecast everyday of the year. No radar, being 500 miles away from home plate hoping there’s not a thunderstorm sitting over the field when you show up with 500 lbs or gas in the tanks
Posted by 777Tiger
Member since Mar 2011
92315 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:25 pm to
quote:

where they literally just copy and past the forecast everyday of the year.


you baws don't have satcom or internet over there?
This post was edited on 1/27/20 at 1:26 pm
Posted by KiwiHead
Auckland, NZ
Member since Jul 2014
37608 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:49 pm to
Sea fog was lingering in the canyons, I suspect wind was minimal.

He was following the 101 Ventura Freeway....it cuts a wide swath through that area. How low was he? Did he slow down and possibly stall out and he was too low that he did not have time before he hits the deck?
Posted by aTmTexas Dillo
East Texas Lake
Member since Sep 2018
24019 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:56 pm to
quote:

After this tragedy I refuse to step in one unless absolutely necessary.


I'm sure an accomplished IFR pilot could have pulled this off. Even if that meant radioing in for an appropriate clear landing site.
Posted by BayouNation
Member since Sep 2008
2127 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 1:58 pm to
Nothing but a parking lot around his Mamba Academy.

Posted by GeauxxxTigers23
TeamBunt General Manager
Member since Apr 2013
62514 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 2:08 pm to
quote:

you baws don't have satcom or internet over there?
I can get satellite weather before I take off but we do 10 hour missions. That shits irrelevant 10 hours later. I can ask some kid in Germany with satcom what he thinks the weather in africa looks like but that’s really hit or miss.
Posted by RebelRye
Metairie, LA
Member since Nov 2018
1162 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 2:09 pm to
quote:

Nothing but a parking lot around his Mamba Academy.


There's a couple of large parking lots or open spaces a few blocks out. He could easily land in one of those and have a car waiting to take them to the building. I've had the governor land his chopper in our parking lot and caravan to whatever event he was attending.
Posted by LCA131
Home of the Fake Sig lines
Member since Feb 2008
77244 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 2:14 pm to
That picture also shows the California Cartwheel Center. I wonder what that's all about. Big building just to teach cartwheels.
Posted by baldona
Florida
Member since Feb 2016
24215 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 2:15 pm to
I am not from LA nor know it well at all, but why did he build his Mamba Academy 2 hours away from his house? Seems a hell of a lot easier.

He keeps talking about the helicopter helping him reduce his drive time, but dang man live closer to where you work...
Posted by RebelRye
Metairie, LA
Member since Nov 2018
1162 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 2:16 pm to
Also some large parking garages just to the east of the facility too. Can easily land on the top level and it's walking distance if they didn't have a car.
Posted by baldona
Florida
Member since Feb 2016
24215 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 2:22 pm to
quote:

Also some large parking garages just to the east of the facility too. Can easily land on the top level and it's walking distance if they didn't have a car.


He did this multiple times a week, I'm sure he has somewhere he can land at a moment's notice saved for him. That photo update may be old or his landing spot not set up.
Posted by supatigah
CEO of the Keith Hernandez Fan Club
Member since Mar 2004
90064 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 2:23 pm to
quote:

Around 9.20am, the helicopter circled for about 15 minutes just east of Interstate 5, near Glendale. Air traffic controllers held up the helicopter for other aircraft for about 11 minutes, before clearing the Sikorsky S-76 to proceed north along Interstate 5 through Burbank's airspace.

Air traffic controllers noted poor visibility around Burbank, just to the north, and Van Nuys, to the northwest. Due to the poor visibility, the pilot could have contacted air traffic controllers and requested to switch to instrument flight rules (IFR), which would have allowed him to navigate through the clouds.

However, when pilots fly under IFR, it can take up a lot of time, especially in Southern California, which has an extremely busy airspace. Pilots flying under IFR will have to begin 20 miles or more away from the runway and are required to use special instructions in the form of diagrams called approach plates in order to land.

Paul Cline, an assistant professor of aviation at the City University of New York, told New York Magazine that flying under IFR could mean you could be in a holding pattern for 'an hour'.

'You’re just one of many waiting in line, and it doesn’t matter if you’re Kobe Bryant,' Cline added. 'A ton of rules come into play, and people don’t always want to fly that way [under IFR]. It takes away their ability to do whatever they want to do,' Cline said. 'The trade-off is you get to live.'

The aircraft continued under VFR and around 9.40am it turned west to follow US Route 101, the Ventura Highway. At about 9.44am, the helicopter turned again, toward the southeast, and climbed to more than 2,000 feet, in what appeared to be an attempt to put some space between the helicopter and the high terrain.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN IFR AND VFR FLYING
Under Visual Flight Rules (VFR) pilots must always be able to see things out of their windows, which includes the ground, other aircraft and obstacles.

Pilots flying under VFR must fly on the outside of clouds and are prohibited from flying into clouds.

Flying under Instrument Flight Rules (IFR) is extremely more challenging than VFR flying. Unlike VFR, pilots are allowed to fly into clouds where there is zero visibility.

One of the most illustrative differences between the two set of flight rules is the landing procedures.

Under VFR, pilots will fly toward the runway at an angle before executing a rectangular pattern near the runway and heading down for the landing.

Under IFR, pilots will have to begin 20 miles or more away from the runway and are required to use special instructions in the form of diagrams called approach plates.

The approach plates tell pilots where an aircraft will need to change its direction, what altitude it should be flying at, all while having zero visibility.

IFR pilots will usually only be able to see out of their windows toward the end of the instrument approach, which is when they will be able to see the runway.

In air traffic control audio which was recorded shortly before the crash, the pilot of the former Lakers star's helicopter is told by a controller that 'you're still too low level' to be tracked by radar.

This did not appear to be a sign of distress, because the helicopter was actually ascending at the time and the controller was referring to the technical difficulty with reading data rather than warning of an imminent crash.


Daily Mail article

quote:

dang man live closer to where you work...


there are two facilities, one in Thousand oaks, one in Redondo Beach (closer to his home in newport). Kobe signed a deal with the Sports Academy to rebrand it the Mamba Academy in 2018
Posted by 777Tiger
Member since Mar 2011
92315 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 2:23 pm to
quote:

dang man live closer to where you work...


with that kind of dough why would he want to live in the 'hood? I'd probably have done exactly what he was doing
Posted by supatigah
CEO of the Keith Hernandez Fan Club
Member since Mar 2004
90064 posts
Posted on 1/27/20 at 2:26 pm to
also the 50 yr old was fully Instrument Rated for the chopper

I think the pilot was in a hurry to get them there, bit off more than he could chew flying VFR and fricked up

in summary:
quote:

I know people shouldn't speculate, maybe it was mechanical failure, yadda yadda. But honestly...

-- pilot already knows he's flying close to the limits
-- hill looms up out of the murk
-- oh sh!t!
-- loads of aft cyclic/collective/left cyclic
-- enters cloud, not prepared for a sudden transition to the gauges
-- loses it


LINK

This post was edited on 1/27/20 at 2:29 pm
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