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re: In hindsight was it a mistake for the US to ally with the Soviet Union during WW2.
Posted on 2/25/23 at 5:50 pm to bdavids09
Posted on 2/25/23 at 5:50 pm to bdavids09
The US was attacked by the Japs, we declared war on Japan the next day. About a week later Germany declared war on the US.
We had no option. We declared war on both Japan and Germany after they declared war on us. Naturally we allied ourselves with Russia and the other allies.
We had no option. We declared war on both Japan and Germany after they declared war on us. Naturally we allied ourselves with Russia and the other allies.
This post was edited on 2/25/23 at 8:35 pm
1
Posted on 2/25/23 at 5:59 pm to bdavids09
The alternative was what???… the whole relationship with Russia is based on Russia being insecure that the US saved the world in WW2… to a certain extent this is what our relationship with the world is based on
Posted on 2/25/23 at 7:16 pm to Ancient Astronaut
quote:
The mistake was not taking out Stalin after ww2
Yep.
Like McArthur & Patton wanted. They were right.
This post was edited on 2/25/23 at 7:17 pm
Posted on 2/25/23 at 8:18 pm to HempHead
are what caused his assassination.
—-oh, brother.
—-oh, brother.
Posted on 2/25/23 at 8:27 pm to Ancient Astronaut
quote:
The mistake was not taking out Stalin after ww2
I think the mistake was giving the USSR a little too much help.
We should have let them bleed more, obviously.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 2:12 am to LemmyLives
quote:
Everything FDR did to align us with a Socialist/Communist style economy and government was well publicized long before the war.
However, where the hell was West Germany, the UK, France, and the rest of Europe in supporting Eastern Europe in resisting Soviet rule?
The answer is in your question. The soviets gained control of Eastern Europe in exchange for fighting the Third Reich. That was always part of the deal.
To your point, you're correct that FDR admired Stalin and Stalinism. He is truly one of the most misunderstood and incorrectly praised presidents we've ever had.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 4:31 am to Major Dutch Schaefer
I think Patton was murdered that the car accident was a set up. He pissed off too many people with his words on the USSR.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 5:30 am to doubleb
quote:
Naturally we allied ourselves with Russia and the other allies.
You’re ignorant of history. We were supporting the Soviet Union before our declaration of war.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 5:59 am to RoyalAir
quote:
To your point, you're correct that FDR admired Stalin and Stalinism. He is truly one of the most misunderstood and incorrectly praised presidents we've ever had.
Roosevelt sure as hell did not admire Stalinism. The two men definitely got along well together but that's because both men knew what the other needed and wanted, and those needs and wants aligned with either man's political objectives for the most part. Roosevelt wanted peace in a post-war world, Stalin wanted security for the Soviet Union. Churchill, on the other hand, was more focused on preserving the British Empire.
Roosevelt, however, misjudged Stalin in one vital aspect: ideology. As practical and pragmatic as Stalin was, he was also an ideologue. Bolshevism ran through his veins and he believed in communism down to his bones. With a war-ravaged Europe, Stalin had visions of a people's revolution dancing in his head. He dreamed of a post-war Europe dominated by the proletariat and sincerely didn't think that these dreams stood in the way of Roosevelt's own post-war vision.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 7:32 am to RollTide1987
Roosevelt wanted us in the war in the worst way, and did everything he could do to get us involved.
And he let a lot of Soviet agents/sympathizers into the government.
And he let a lot of Soviet agents/sympathizers into the government.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 8:11 am to lowspark12
quote:
It’s just nonsensical… the US was supplying the red army through lend lease… we’re then gonna turn around and push on east fighting against our own equipment and munitions?… it’s silly.
Hasnt that been standard US government practice for a long time?
Also, lend lease involved old, outdated equipment.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 8:16 am to bdavids09
I'm not sure the western European nations would have had a problem with this if not for the fact that the Germans had invaded Poland which they were treaty bound to defend.
If there were no Poland like in 1914, I think the Western Europeans would have sat back and watched but also would have had time to beef up to make Hitler, Guderien and Rommel think twice about blitzing through in 40/41.
If there were no Poland like in 1914, I think the Western Europeans would have sat back and watched but also would have had time to beef up to make Hitler, Guderien and Rommel think twice about blitzing through in 40/41.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 9:03 am to bdavids09
Unless Germany figured out nukes, which all evidence says they were still a long ways off, Russia was always going to win. We should have just stated out and let the Russians and Germans grind each other down. Then killed Stalin and Hitler.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 9:21 am to Ancient Astronaut
quote:
The mistake was not taking out Stalin after ww2
I think this was a common sentiment back in the early 40s. My grandfather, who was too old for the war, always said we should have taken out the Russians after Hilter was gone.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 9:41 am to bdavids09
We definitely should have allied with the Soviets, but we should have required them to go all-in with the alliance. Specifically, to allow us to build air bases in Eastern Russia, near the Sea of Japan, Kamchatka, etc. We could have ferried bombers along the Aleutians to those bases and started bombing Japan itself in 1942, instead of losing tens of thousands of Marines, taking Pacific islands one at a time until we could build bases close enough in the Pacific to do that.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 9:47 am to Jim Rockford
Not to derail the thread but if you like alternate WWII history, and like video games, take a look at HOI4. I’ve spent soooo many hours running through alternate history paths.
My favorite is overthrowing hitler, turning Germany into a monarchy/democracy, and just wrecking the Russians with a NATO force.
My favorite is overthrowing hitler, turning Germany into a monarchy/democracy, and just wrecking the Russians with a NATO force.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 10:03 am to RollTide1987
quote:
Roosevelt, however, misjudged Stalin in one vital aspect: ideology. Bolshevism ran through his veins and he believed in communism down to his bones.
You could say the same about Stalin.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 10:11 am to bdavids09
quote:
In hindsight was it a mistake for the US to ally with the Soviet Union during WW2.
I know we love the US history in WW II but without the Russians we would all be speaking German now.
It was the Russian battles that ended Germany but we do not study them in US history. The biggest armored battle in the history of the world was Kursk on the Russian Front and that was the beginning of the end of Hitler.
The better question may be should we have followed US top military who wanted to pursue Russia after Germany was defeated.
Posted on 2/26/23 at 10:13 am to bdavids09
So your theory is that if we had just let Hitler (Nostradamus' second anti-christ) have his way and destroy the world, then we'd be spared the third and worst anti-christ? Great. I guess we would have never been born, but at least we don't have to see the lead up to the big one. 
Posted on 2/26/23 at 10:14 am to Cheese Grits
quote:
I know we love the US history in WW II but without the Russians we would all be speaking German now.
This is hyperbole to the max. Hitler did not have anything close to the capabilities needed to launch an invasion fleet across the Atlantic Ocean, land on the beaches of a heavily defended U.S. coastline, and sustain and protect a logistical supply line that would have stretched across thousands of miles of vast ocean.
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