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Started By
Message
Just to show you how badly we need to upgrade Jonas
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:22 am
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:22 am
This is is Defensive WAR statistic among all Centers in the league...dead last
5
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:23 am to PelsForLife
Ayton or Collins ain't much better
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:25 am to saints5021
Nope, I don't get the infatuation with those two...
On the other hand, here's the top 15 for Defensive WAR among Centers. I wonder what it would take to get someone like Mitchell Robinson?
On the other hand, here's the top 15 for Defensive WAR among Centers. I wonder what it would take to get someone like Mitchell Robinson?
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:25 am to PelsForLife
Why you got to shite on the big man? He tries really hard and is always available.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:32 am to BigPerm30
He's a great teammate and a warrior.
He's also slowed down and can't jump.
Next season, he will be a solid starting center for a lottery team or a great backup for a contender.
He's also slowed down and can't jump.
Next season, he will be a solid starting center for a lottery team or a great backup for a contender.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:34 am to BigPerm30
You do know Larry is 12th?
Jonas gives you simple easy offense, he was even passing out of the double and triple teams effectively last night. You need offense far more than defense with this team, especially with Zion out. When you need defense you can plug in a guy like Larry that can switch.
We have a much better big situation than what people think. My biggest concern going forward is 3pt shooting. It's getting even worse.
Jonas gives you simple easy offense, he was even passing out of the double and triple teams effectively last night. You need offense far more than defense with this team, especially with Zion out. When you need defense you can plug in a guy like Larry that can switch.
We have a much better big situation than what people think. My biggest concern going forward is 3pt shooting. It's getting even worse.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:37 am to PelsForLife
Steven fricking Adams is in the top defensive WARs.
He is also unplayable in the postseason due to his limitations.
He is also unplayable in the postseason due to his limitations.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:38 am to BigPerm30
Not like we need reliable players that can show up and play on the court instead of missing a vast majority of the season year after year after year.
This post was edited on 2/14/23 at 12:40 pm
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:38 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:This is exactly right. We need Jonas' offense. And btw Steven Adams is 9th on that list. Please tell me y'all don't think we would be better with Adams.
You need offense far more than defense with this team, especially with Zion out.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:42 am to PelsForLife
He is just super slow. Should be viewed as situational but we literally have nothing else there
Posted on 2/14/23 at 8:42 am to BigPerm30
quote:
Why you got to shite on the big man? He tries really hard and is always available.
He's done his job these couple years but its clear his defense puts a ceiling on what we can be.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 9:05 am to PelsForLife
Still sticking to Bam is our answer if Miami ever traded him.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 9:18 am to htran90
We have three guys making $30m+ next year, with extensions looming for Naji and Herb
Just to get another $30m center like Bam, we'd have to give up everyone like Herb, Dyson, etc.
So yeah we can upgrade rim protection, but we'll forfeit every ball stopping guard/wing we have
Best case scenario is finding our own Nic Claxton in the draft
Just to get another $30m center like Bam, we'd have to give up everyone like Herb, Dyson, etc.
So yeah we can upgrade rim protection, but we'll forfeit every ball stopping guard/wing we have
Best case scenario is finding our own Nic Claxton in the draft
Posted on 2/14/23 at 9:23 am to PelsForLife
quote:
how badly we need to upgrade Jonas
Nobody has ever really said this wasn't a need. But upgrading him is hard because we can't afford the salary of someone that is truly an upgrade and in a different talent tier.
Effective modern bigs are rare and teams hold onto them tightly. Even if you're ready to overpay, would the Nets actually trade Claxton? We all keep looking for the big swing answer. I think the answer is more likely to come from betting on a bunch of scratch offs and having multiple of them pay off and be cobbled together.
For example, this recent write up in SI on Karlo Matkovic sounds like he's progressed well. It's actually a surprisingly long write up considering we're talking about a draft and stash guy and there are several highlight clips.
quote:
The Pelicans have a gem according to most European scouts. GM Trajan Langdon has tons of connections across the Atlantic and, unless a trade happens, the team plans to bring Matkovic back over for NBA Summer League and training camp runs this summer.
LINK
I'm not expecting a starting center out of him, but in Europe at least, he's a mobile rim running big that's a good rebounder and shot blocker. If that translates he can earn some of JV and a little of Larry's minutes and you've plugged a hole on the cheap.
I think scratch offs like this hitting are a lot more likely than trading for a Bam or even a Claxton.
This post was edited on 2/14/23 at 9:24 am
Posted on 2/14/23 at 9:24 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
We have a much better big situation than what people think. My biggest concern going forward is 3pt shooting. It's getting even worse.
My biggest concern is PF. With Zion out it puts a ton of pressure on our 5 to do it all inside.
Larry is our closer at the 5, JV is a good traditional center and inning eater, and Billy provides some backup stability, but man we are leaving them on a deserted island.
Thankfully the Pels can often get away with it, since so many teams play small ball, but Willy needs to look hard at playing Larry at the 4 along with JV/Billy when we play teams with 2 traditional bigs inside.
I’m not as concerned about shooting as I was. Josh should help that a good bit. He is a legitimate all around guard, so we can roll him in with our other guys and avoid having 3-4 non-shooters on the floor at any one time. You can get away with 1 by using him as a screener/slasher, but it screws up the offense to have 2-3 on the floor, so Josh is a big piece for helping that issue down the stretch.
***Also surprised to see Siakham and Ayton on that list…they are both too athletic and talented to be down that far
This post was edited on 2/14/23 at 9:26 am
Posted on 2/14/23 at 9:31 am to htran90
half this board was hoping a deadline trade would bring an athletic rim defender pnr defender.
its not like its news about jv. cannot move his gargantuan body quick enough to defend pnr in paint. we know.
and we notice that he sometimes flips the ball toward the basket without really shooting. i hate that. these usually miss. he often gets the rebound.
half the board wanted josh Richardson 3 and D. they got their wish.
im sure big athletic defender is on the griff summer shopping list.
fwiw a really good one was going to cost a premium at deadline. FO made the call that without zion pels were going to be lucky to get out of round one since the opponent will have home court. so no huge get. no huge deal. summer.
a lot depends on zion.
if hes in good form and pels get past round one its going to be easier to get a needle mover UFA.
for comparison sake, memphis were attempting to add a top tier guy at deadline to the almost ready Memphis team.
they offered 4 #1s and a couple decent young ones for mikal bridges.
i dont think hes worth it but the attempt reflects memphis FO was ready to go all in, to get a good two way. and on the morant time line. pels mgmt was not all in. pels are not a contender unless zion plays at or darn near 98%. so they didnt try for the finishing touch.
its not like its news about jv. cannot move his gargantuan body quick enough to defend pnr in paint. we know.
and we notice that he sometimes flips the ball toward the basket without really shooting. i hate that. these usually miss. he often gets the rebound.
half the board wanted josh Richardson 3 and D. they got their wish.
im sure big athletic defender is on the griff summer shopping list.
fwiw a really good one was going to cost a premium at deadline. FO made the call that without zion pels were going to be lucky to get out of round one since the opponent will have home court. so no huge get. no huge deal. summer.
a lot depends on zion.
if hes in good form and pels get past round one its going to be easier to get a needle mover UFA.
for comparison sake, memphis were attempting to add a top tier guy at deadline to the almost ready Memphis team.
they offered 4 #1s and a couple decent young ones for mikal bridges.
i dont think hes worth it but the attempt reflects memphis FO was ready to go all in, to get a good two way. and on the morant time line. pels mgmt was not all in. pels are not a contender unless zion plays at or darn near 98%. so they didnt try for the finishing touch.
This post was edited on 2/14/23 at 9:35 am
Posted on 2/14/23 at 9:39 am to PelsForLife
awesome stat
let's trade JV for PJ Washington and put him at center.
No one is going to mistake JV for some great defensive center.
That's not who he is, and i don't understand why we have to trade him to get what we need. JV is a role player. Larry is a role player. We simply need another role player that is better defensively.
JV has single handedly won us games b/c of his offense. Did you watch the game last night? I wouldn't say he was the only reason we won since BI would take that honor for the most part, but i would say that if you plug in about 20 other centers for him last night, we probably don't win that game. And you can say that about many games since he's been here.
He is one of the few centers in the league that you simply cannot play small ball against b/c he is too skilled offensively, and too fricking big to deal with. That is his worth to this team, not shot blocking and perimeter defense.
That's why we have Larry Nance.
If you want a center who can score on his own down low through bully ball and finesse, rebound like a beast, defend the rim, and effectively defend perimeter screens, then put together a trade package for Giannis or Bam.
and i say all of that and i would agree that we need to trade JV. Not that i don't like JV or what he brings to the team, b/c he's very beneficial to us since we have two "stars" who sit on the bench in street clothes more than they play the game, but we would be much better off with a big that can defend at a higher rate, even if his offensive game only consists of rim runs and put backs. Our team has more than enough fire power offensively with the other 4 guys on the court. our center does not need to be an offensive threat like JV is.
I'd do what we can to get Walker Kessler, keep Billy and keep Nance. There's no need to have tons of money invested in those 3 guys.
let's trade JV for PJ Washington and put him at center.
No one is going to mistake JV for some great defensive center.
That's not who he is, and i don't understand why we have to trade him to get what we need. JV is a role player. Larry is a role player. We simply need another role player that is better defensively.
JV has single handedly won us games b/c of his offense. Did you watch the game last night? I wouldn't say he was the only reason we won since BI would take that honor for the most part, but i would say that if you plug in about 20 other centers for him last night, we probably don't win that game. And you can say that about many games since he's been here.
He is one of the few centers in the league that you simply cannot play small ball against b/c he is too skilled offensively, and too fricking big to deal with. That is his worth to this team, not shot blocking and perimeter defense.
That's why we have Larry Nance.
If you want a center who can score on his own down low through bully ball and finesse, rebound like a beast, defend the rim, and effectively defend perimeter screens, then put together a trade package for Giannis or Bam.
and i say all of that and i would agree that we need to trade JV. Not that i don't like JV or what he brings to the team, b/c he's very beneficial to us since we have two "stars" who sit on the bench in street clothes more than they play the game, but we would be much better off with a big that can defend at a higher rate, even if his offensive game only consists of rim runs and put backs. Our team has more than enough fire power offensively with the other 4 guys on the court. our center does not need to be an offensive threat like JV is.
I'd do what we can to get Walker Kessler, keep Billy and keep Nance. There's no need to have tons of money invested in those 3 guys.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 9:43 am to teke184
quote:
Steven fricking Adams is in the top defensive WARs.
I’ll take your Steven Adams and raise you Anthony Davis.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 9:52 am to TeddyPadillac
quote:
We simply need another role player that is better defensively.
should be possible in summer. there are going to be a few centers in round 1 draft.
fwiw the pels have jv under contract next season. about 14 million.
if traded he gets $1 million bonus.
I think this is adams last year at memphis. they will also be shopping for a big like pels want, to backup for jj jr.
i suspect gsw wants one too.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 9:56 am to CP3forMVP
I’m not sure what y’all are arguing. If Steven Adams is healthy, he is massively better defensively and I wouldn’t think anyone would argue that. It’s his free throw shooting as much as anything that makes it really difficult to play him in big spots. He also historically wears down drastically as seasons go on, which is what happened here.
And the Grizz have completely gone off the rails since he got hurt.
Love seeing Nance so high, that’s pretty interesting.
And the Grizz have completely gone off the rails since he got hurt.
Love seeing Nance so high, that’s pretty interesting.
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