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Posted on 3/15/24 at 9:29 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
Airbus needs to buy Boeing if they really want things straightened out, but that's obvious antitrust and can't happen.
Posted on 3/15/24 at 9:38 pm to fwtex
quote:
Boeing is now fully run by accounting and finance guys instead of aviation people.
This is the problem with so many business and industries currently. They are run by banks, not technically competent people.
Posted on 3/15/24 at 9:39 pm to RedRifle
John Oliver (love or hate him) shows some interesting information about Boeing's stock and how they might have been more concerned about manipulating their stock prices than the safety of their products.
Youtube.com
Youtube.com
Posted on 3/15/24 at 9:40 pm to RedRifle
Guy has a point.
B School professors push two things these days
1) Financial metrics over everything
2) DEI is necessary for business
Combine these two and it’s a recipe for disaster
See it’s not the bean counters or DEI
It’s the intersection of both
B School professors push two things these days
1) Financial metrics over everything
2) DEI is necessary for business
Combine these two and it’s a recipe for disaster
See it’s not the bean counters or DEI
It’s the intersection of both
Posted on 3/15/24 at 9:42 pm to TygerTyger
quote:
There’s no part of me that believes that union workers are more skilled, motivated, or produce a higher quality product.
Except for the fact that we have 50 plus years of history that says they did just that.
Unions are ruining education and the post office, but unions still do a very good job with skilled labor.
Posted on 3/15/24 at 9:44 pm to RedRifle
All of that is true except the Union BS. the South Carolina planes aren’t dropping parts mid-flight.
Posted on 3/15/24 at 9:49 pm to RedRifle
You can trace a big portion of the multi-decade fall of General Motors to the shift in power from their Detroit HQ to their NYC Treasury Department. Like Boeing's move of the HQ to Chicago, this was done for no reason other than powerful non-engineering execs liked being in NYC. That, combined with accountant Roger Smith becoming CEO, was the beginning of a very long end for GM.
Problem with Boeing is that their fall would be a national security issue, rather than just an economic disaster. I wonder if the government will step in, even with no immediate threat of bankruptcy, if Boeing keeps dropping the ball?
Problem with Boeing is that their fall would be a national security issue, rather than just an economic disaster. I wonder if the government will step in, even with no immediate threat of bankruptcy, if Boeing keeps dropping the ball?
Posted on 3/15/24 at 9:51 pm to Hondo Blacksheep
quote:
Airbus needs to buy Boeing if they really want things straightened out, but that's obvious antitrust and can't happen.
Oh yeah, overlaying a multinational European bureaucracy should clean that mess right up.
Posted on 3/15/24 at 10:14 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:
Unions are ruining education and the post office, but unions still do a very good job with skilled labor.
I have worked in both union and non union jobs. It is nice that the union could prevent me from working unlimited 20 plus hour shifts due to short staffing however it did hurt that I wouldn't make more money than a person who was less productive.
Had unions not become 'political' and also seem to keep bad employees rather than realizing that getting rid of a shite worker helps both the union and the company....more people would probably support a union.
Posted on 3/15/24 at 10:25 pm to RedRifle
Nonsense. The free market regulates itself perfectly - Boeing's problems are DEI and woke, whatever that means.
Posted on 3/16/24 at 12:34 am to RedRifle
This isn't complicated.
Boeing's non-engineering, financial background CEO & COO don't know how to run the business.
Deconstruct it all you want down the ladder from there, but at root that is the issue.
Financial engineering doesn't work very well in what is fundamentally a complex, highly engineering reliant company.
Boeing's non-engineering, financial background CEO & COO don't know how to run the business.
Deconstruct it all you want down the ladder from there, but at root that is the issue.
Financial engineering doesn't work very well in what is fundamentally a complex, highly engineering reliant company.
Posted on 3/16/24 at 1:58 am to RedRifle
This happens in almost every major and minor company that is bought and sold in our country. But some bad decisions are worse than others especially when these bad decisions center around making commercial airplanes. Cutting corners and outsourcing never works long term. It's all cooking the books bullshite and it usually ruins a company to the core.
Posted on 3/16/24 at 2:14 am to MrQuibehdoh
quote:
A lot of people just…hate the idea of an organized workforce having leverage over their corporate overlords.
Those of us who were adults back in the 70’s and 80’s have a negative view of unions because they had become out of control - run by thugs and obstacles to the smooth running of the economy. They were not always like that. At one time they had a glorious mission to shift power to an equitable position between labor and management. This shift is what beat Marxism.
Posted on 3/16/24 at 4:00 am to LarryCLE
quote:
I see a lot of Boeing’s problems being blamed on the merger with McDonnell Douglas and the management takeover by MBA’s, but their planes are just as safe today as they have ever been. The 737 rudder design issue in the 90s happened before McDonnell Douglas
There is so much talk everywhere now about how Boeing was a perfect company that always did right before the merger. These seem to come from documentaries that completely ignore how when it came to accidents Boeing before the merger consistently tried to either blame pilots, generally obfuscate investigations and downplay design flaws.
You mentioned the 737 rudder issues, add to that the 767 thrust reversers deploying in flight, and downplaying the potential for the creation of flammable conditions in the fuel tanks both before and after TWA 800.
Posted on 3/16/24 at 7:37 am to Cfrobel
So my understanding is this board believes that an engineer should run Boeing and not worry about the financials? So the stock price and profit don’t matter?
Posted on 3/16/24 at 8:05 am to Cfrobel
quote:
There is so much talk everywhere now about how Boeing was a perfect company that always did right before the merger. These seem to come from documentaries that completely ignore how when it came to accidents Boeing before the merger consistently tried to either blame pilots, generally obfuscate investigations and downplay design flaws. You mentioned the 737 rudder issues, add to that the 767 thrust reversers deploying in flight, and downplaying the potential for the creation of flammable conditions in the fuel tanks both before and after TWA 800.
Pan Am had 5 fatal 707 accidents in a 9 month period in the early 70’s.
July 22, 1973
Flight 816, operated by Boeing 707-321B Clipper Winged Racer, crashed on takeoff from Faa'a International Airport for reasons unknown, killing 78 of 79 on board. The accidents remains the deadliest in French Polynesia.
November 3, 1973
Flight 160, operated by Boeing 707-321C N458PA Clipper Titian, crashed while attempting to return to Boston due to smoke in the cockpit, killing the three crew.[17]
December 17, 1973
Flight 110, operated by Boeing 707-321B (N407PA) Clipper Celestial was firebombed while parked at Fiumicino Airport by Palestinian terrorists, killing 30 of 177 on board; the terrorists then killed a guard and hijacked Lufthansa Flight 303, a Boeing 737, to Kuwait.
January 30, 1974
Flight 806, operated by Boeing 707-321B Clipper Radiant, crashed on approach to Pago Pago after encountering windshear from a microburst, killing 96 of 101 on board.
April 22, 1974
Flight 812, operated by Boeing 707-321B Clipper Climax struck the side of Mesehe Mountain (42 miles northwest of Denpasar) due to a navigation error caused by instrument failure, killing all 107 on board.
Posted on 3/16/24 at 8:15 am to baldona
quote:
So the stock price and profit don’t matter?
That’s what the CFO is for
Posted on 3/16/24 at 8:22 am to The Boat
I am all for reducing the power and influence of unions, especially skilled tradesman’s unions - this isn’t 1910 with coal miners being paid in scrip.
However, there is no questioning that Boeing’s Charleston facility has been shitting the bed. From finding wrenches in the the aircraft after delivery to wiring issues and just the inability to complete and deliver aircraft on time, Charleston has been bad. Boeing had to bring workers from Seattle to clean up their mess and retrain them in the late 2010s.
That said, it’s a result of their management being overzealous trying to move quickly on non-union labor. If done methodically it could have been a smashing success, unfortunately they used the 787 program as the excuse to “diversify” their manufacturing base and unfortunately that aircraft was already behind schedule so they had to rush everything.
Let’s not even start on the KC-46 Pegasus shitshow.
Tl;dr - Boeing has been a shite show for years.
However, there is no questioning that Boeing’s Charleston facility has been shitting the bed. From finding wrenches in the the aircraft after delivery to wiring issues and just the inability to complete and deliver aircraft on time, Charleston has been bad. Boeing had to bring workers from Seattle to clean up their mess and retrain them in the late 2010s.
That said, it’s a result of their management being overzealous trying to move quickly on non-union labor. If done methodically it could have been a smashing success, unfortunately they used the 787 program as the excuse to “diversify” their manufacturing base and unfortunately that aircraft was already behind schedule so they had to rush everything.
Let’s not even start on the KC-46 Pegasus shitshow.
Tl;dr - Boeing has been a shite show for years.
Posted on 3/16/24 at 8:55 am to baldona
quote:
So my understanding is this board believes that an engineer should run Boeing and not worry about the financials? So the stock price and profit don’t matter?
You make a great, safe, and reliable product that people feel comfortable using and your financials will take care of themselves.
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