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Trump’s Boldest Argument Yet: Immunity From Prosecution for Assassinations

Posted on 1/10/24 at 6:20 pm
Posted by Eurocat
Member since Apr 2004
15042 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 6:20 pm
A lawyer for the former president said he would be immune from prosecution for the murder of a political rival while in office unless he was first impeached and convicted in Congress.

Eight years ago, just before the Iowa caucuses, Donald J. Trump crowed about his invulnerability.

“I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody, and I wouldn’t lose any voters, OK?” he said. “It’s, like, incredible.”

On Tuesday, at a federal appeals court argument held the week before this year’s caucuses, a lawyer for Mr. Trump said that the Constitution basically states the same thing.

It took a few questions from Judge Florence Y. Pan to pin down the lawyer, D. John Sauer. But in the end he made the jaw-dropping claim that former presidents are absolutely immune from prosecution even for murders they ordered while in office.

“I asked you a yes-or-no question,” Judge Pan said. “Could a president who ordered SEAL Team 6 to assassinate a political rival, who was not impeached, would he be subject to criminal prosecution?”

Mr. Sauer said his answer was a “qualified yes,” by which he meant no. He explained that prosecution would only be permitted if the president were first impeached by the House and convicted by the Senate.

LINK
Posted by TrueTiger
Chicken's most valuable
Member since Sep 2004
67763 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 6:22 pm to

quote:

He explained that prosecution would only be permitted if the president were first impeached by the House and convicted by the Senate.


That's exactly what the Constitution says.
This post was edited on 1/10/24 at 8:02 pm
Posted by keakar
Member since Jan 2017
29983 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 6:27 pm to
quote:

Eurocat


Posted by Nosevens
Member since Apr 2019
10276 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 6:29 pm to
Do you even know why he would be?
Posted by SEC. 593
Chicago
Member since Aug 2012
4042 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 7:31 pm to
Where is that?
Posted by OceanMan
Member since Mar 2010
20009 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 7:35 pm to
quote:

Mr. Sauer said his answer was a “qualified yes,” by which he meant no.


I’m not sure that is what it means.
Posted by beaux duke
Member since Oct 2023
400 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 7:38 pm to

I'm stealing that gif
Posted by roadGator
Member since Feb 2009
139983 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 7:38 pm to
Euro trash again.
Posted by SEC. 593
Chicago
Member since Aug 2012
4042 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 7:39 pm to
Yeah, I read that as "yes if the following conditions exists".
Posted by LSU2ALA
Member since Jul 2018
1928 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 7:40 pm to
quote:

That's exactly what the Constitution says.


Could you perhaps quote that as it doesn’t seem to be in any version I have read.
Posted by themunch
Earth. maybe
Member since Jan 2007
64635 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 7:45 pm to
Thanks for the reminder....
Posted by TrueTiger
Chicken's most valuable
Member since Sep 2004
67763 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 7:49 pm to
If he is successfully impeached, then he can be prosecuted.

Impeachment conviction lifts immunity.


quote:



Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law.

U.S. CONST. art. I, § 3, cl. 7
Posted by jimmy the leg
Member since Aug 2007
34081 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 7:56 pm to
He is just setting up Obama.
Posted by olddawginCa
Member since Aug 2023
811 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 8:15 pm to
If Trump or any President actually called for the assassination of a political rival, they would be impeached faster than you could say, "Richard Nixon".

This is just a absurd tactic by the Judge to discredit Trump's valid defense.
Posted by Bourre
Da Parish
Member since Nov 2012
20240 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 8:19 pm to
Posted by AgSGT
Dixon, MO
Member since Aug 2011
1621 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 8:24 pm to
Obama got away with assassinating two Americans via drone attack, how is this hypothetical different?
Posted by BengalOnTheBay
Member since Aug 2022
3855 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 8:39 pm to
We already have a 14 page thread discussing this, dipshit.
Posted by cwill
Member since Jan 2005
54752 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 8:42 pm to
This:

quote:

Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law.


Doesnt say he’s immune if he’s not impeached.
Posted by SEC. 593
Chicago
Member since Aug 2012
4042 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 8:47 pm to
Reading the unbolded clause there to me is key because that is one sentence in full. The bolded (imo) is stating that the impeachment trial is not the full extent of the legal process and only serves as the conduit of removal from office.
Posted by TrueTiger
Chicken's most valuable
Member since Sep 2004
67763 posts
Posted on 1/10/24 at 8:49 pm to

It says he's fair game if successfully impeached.

You think he's not in that circumstance?
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