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Message
re: The reality of amnesty for laborers
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:26 am to Goombaw
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:26 am to Goombaw
Getting America back on a sound economic footing is a hard road. Jobs for Americans is an important part of the process, even if it intially means higher costs and lower quality results. The tariff opponents don't like it, the deportation opponents don't like it. Basically nobody accepts the fact that the time for easy measures has passed, which means that economic discipline will be involuntary due to currency problems and inflation.
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Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:27 am to Ag Zwin
Why would you attempt to deal with the issue in good faith, when they didn't come here in good faith?
Why reward them by making them documented guest workers?
Expand the H-2A program and use those workers to fill the void to be created by the removal of the workers here illegally.
Why reward them by making them documented guest workers?
Expand the H-2A program and use those workers to fill the void to be created by the removal of the workers here illegally.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:31 am to Ag Zwin
quote:It's a principled answer.
Again, a simplistic answer.
We can debate our current system and the best ways to improve it, but we have to start with the foundational principles.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:31 am to Goombaw
I'm against amnesty, period.
But even if I was for it, you cannot have an amnesty plan without a locked down border and super strict immigration and egregious penalties for illegals and employing illegals. Basically, you have to make the country unlivable for illegals.
Otherwise, you will just be doing this amnesty plan every 10 years.
But even if I was for it, you cannot have an amnesty plan without a locked down border and super strict immigration and egregious penalties for illegals and employing illegals. Basically, you have to make the country unlivable for illegals.
Otherwise, you will just be doing this amnesty plan every 10 years.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:34 am to Goombaw
Good Mexican crews aren’t cheap. They haven’t been cheap for the past 30 years.
A lot of these crews travel doing massive projects. You aren’t going to find American guys who will travel city to city, staying 2 in a hotel room, for year after year.
A lot of these crews travel doing massive projects. You aren’t going to find American guys who will travel city to city, staying 2 in a hotel room, for year after year.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:36 am to Woolfpack
quote:
You aren’t going to find American guys who will travel city to city, staying 2 in a hotel room, for year after year.
bullshite. I spent nearly 1,600 nights in a hotel. I had a room to myself and was paid more (not construction work,) but that's called incentives adjusting. A lot of people in my job hated it, but they did it.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:39 am to Goombaw
quote:
Case in point: I had some flooring done recently. American guy said it was a 3-day job. We scheduled him, but then he flaked out, wouldn’t come out to the job for one reason and then another. Finally got fed up, contacted a Mexican guy Friday night, him and one other dude showed up the next Monday morning, they did the job in one day, and they did a great job. We paid them the same as the American dude was going to get.
I haven't had that experience.
We had a bunch of work done to the house about a year and a half ago and we had a fence torn down and replaced this year. Both times we contracted with an American, but when the people who showed up to do the work came, they were all Hispanic and they did not speak English, so my assumption is that they were here either legally on a work visa or illegally.
I wouldn't say they were worse than Americans, but they weren't any better. And the ones that did the work on the house absolutely, positively, under no circumstances were going to work even one second past 4:30.
Several times they made things more inconvenient for everyone, including themselves, because of this. Instead of working another 45 minutes or an hour and getting to a reasonable stopping place or being entirely done with something, they would start packing everything up at 3:45 or 4:00 so that they wouldn't have to work past 4:30 and then have to spend another 30-45 minutes the next morning pulling it all out again when they could have just worked through, gotten it done, and not had to waste time with all the extra packing up and pulling out.
My experience with construction/painting is six of one, half a dozen of the other as far as Americans vs immigrants. Except for one thing...if there's a problem, you can't talk to them if you don't know Spanish. You literally have to call the American that you contracted with in the first place who is not there and can't see what's happening and then try to get him to understand the problem, and THEN he has to try to get his crew to understand what to do. And if his Spanish is rudimentary—which our guy's was—that can be a PITA.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:40 am to Goombaw
quote:
Plus, you’re missing my main point: they aren’t just cheap labor. My experience in this industry over the last few years has been that Mexican crews (legal or illegal) are the best option, not because of cost, but for reliability and quality of work.
Tell us about the reliability and efficiency of the thirteen relatives that they drag over with them who do not work.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:41 am to AC1221
quote:
Why would you attempt to deal with the issue in good faith, when they didn't come here in good faith?
Why reward them by making them documented guest workers?
Because in this specific case it's better for Americans if you do, and making things better for Americans is your job. Not exacting petty punishments on non-Americans for misdemeanor offenses.
This post was edited on 7/21/26 at 10:44 am
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:42 am to Goombaw
All we are doing by giving amnesty to people who have no skills and don't speak the language is setting ourselves up for more welfare recipients (them and their kids, who will also be mostly unskilled) when AI and robotics replaces manual work. It might be 10 years out before that is widespread, but these people are putting down roots and will be here for a lot longer than 10 years.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:42 am to Ag Zwin
quote:
Why not just make these visas more mobile and flexible so the worker can attach to projects instead of employers?
This.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:45 am to ShrimperDan
quote:
AI and robotics replaces manual work.
If AI and robotics gets to the point that it can replace a floor or a chain link fence—first of all we'll all be dead by then—but second of all, society will have to figure out how to function without money at that point.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 10:49 am to FearlessFreep
yeah it's just blueberries but I notice you forgot to quote the other part of my comment mentioning tons of other goods experiencing the same issue. On the aggregate, you're paying more for less available.
Plus, there's a lot more blueberries in the world than what make it to your grocery counter. Restaurants, bakeries, commercial bakeries and probably a lot more places than I know purchase the lions share of the crop. If they have to pay more for product, you are going to pay more for the next product.
Plus, there's a lot more blueberries in the world than what make it to your grocery counter. Restaurants, bakeries, commercial bakeries and probably a lot more places than I know purchase the lions share of the crop. If they have to pay more for product, you are going to pay more for the next product.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 11:01 am to atlgamecockman
> people stop buying blueberries in the current format because they are too expensive > mega farms shut down and the land is able to be used for other crops or sold to local farmers > less need for low income housing slums > lower crime and less human trafficking > the farms that stay open are able to sell fewer blueberries at a premium price and can now afford local labor > net positive for the local economy > negative impact on corporate mega farms and illegal aliens
Posted on 7/21/26 at 11:08 am to Bring Da Wood
The problems we have are so many American citizens that don’t want to work.
And many more that don’t work hard.
And so many American citizen employers that don’t get punished for employing illegal labor, or using H-1B labor instead.
And many more that don’t work hard.
And so many American citizen employers that don’t get punished for employing illegal labor, or using H-1B labor instead.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 11:13 am to Goombaw
quote:
Here’s the reality: any Mexican (they’re not all from Mexico, but I can’t ever tell who’s who) crew for roofing, concrete work, or just about any hard labor job will outwork American crews 2/1. Not only that, they actually show up when they say they will and do a good job.
They show up 6 Coronas deep and do terrible quality work. They just do it quickly.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 11:16 am to Goombaw
quote:
The focus on everyone going to college to get a 4-year degree and neglecting the trades was a massive mistake for our country.
I'm going to take a guess and say that there is a correlation between when high school guidance counselors started pushing every student to college and the federal government getting involved in the student loan game.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 11:24 am to wackatimesthree
So don't follow the law?
And, again, how is illegal labor better for Americans?
And, again, how is illegal labor better for Americans?
Posted on 7/21/26 at 11:27 am to Goombaw
cut out entitlements for able bodied males and you will suddenly have a influx of legal workers willing to do these trades.
also stop drug testing for residential construction.
also stop drug testing for residential construction.
Posted on 7/21/26 at 11:28 am to VADawg
quote:
They show up 6 Coronas deep and do terrible quality work. They just do it quickly.
exactly. dont forget the 4-6 coronas at siesta too.
look they do work hard but they take lots of short cuts too.
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