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re: Milton Friedman, neoliberalism & modern conservatives
Posted on 9/29/26 at 2:17 pm to 4cubbies
Posted on 9/29/26 at 2:17 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
He wants to protect the Earth by... colonizing space?
And providing global cheap (in some cases free) internet access, and employment for thousands, and the rescue of free expression from the left on Twitter/X. I’m sure I’m blanking on other areas he’s into.
quote:
New Orleans can't provide clean drinking water?
Not reliably. Boil water advisories are pretty common in NOLA.
quote:
California made it illegal to investigate government corruption. Weird. So did Governor Landry.
As has already been pointed out, you’re making my point. Government isn’t to be trusted.
This post was edited on 9/29/26 at 2:19 pm
Posted on 9/29/26 at 2:21 pm to Y.A. Tittle
quote:
I meant the post immediately above your last one I responded to.
I was legitimately wondering what fluorescent lights had to do with anything. I'm a natural blond.
Posted on 9/29/26 at 2:29 pm to Penrod
quote:
I must not be explaining this well enough. Conservatives, like everyone else, believe that it is the government’s rightful job to protect the environment, so there is no incentive for them to come up with a different way.
Now, if I proposed a trillion dollars of new spending to save roly-pollies presumably you would oppose that. This doesn’t mean you are against the government protecting the environment; it just means you think the roly-pollies are doing just fine, and this isn’t necessary. So it is with conservatives and climate change - to take just one of your examples.
Conservatives believe the government should protect the environment, but subsequently fight against every attempt by the government to protect the environment while refusing to offer any alternatives. Is that the claim?
Posted on 9/29/26 at 2:32 pm to TheHarahanian
quote:These are the ways in which he is protecting the environment?
And providing global cheap (in some cases free) internet access, and employment for thousands, and the rescue of free expression from the left on Twitter/X. I’m sure I’m blanking on other areas he’s into.
quote:Do you live in New Orleans? Are you afraid to drink the water?
Not reliably. Boil water advisories are pretty common in NOLA.
quote:
As has already been pointed out, you’re making my point. Government isn’t to be trusted.
Agreed. What's the alternative?
Posted on 9/29/26 at 2:50 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
These are the ways in which he is protecting the environment?
That wasn’t in your post that started this back and forth. It was this:
quote:
why we don't try to come up with solutions that don't rely on government?
But, in answer, Tesla.
quote:
Do you live in New Orleans? Are you afraid to drink the water?
I spent most of my career in and around NOLA. I’ve seen the color of the water. I’ve heard the numerous news reports about boil water advisories. I won’t drink NOLA water.
quote:
Government isn’t to be trusted. Agreed. What's the alternative?
Stop thinking the government is the solution to everything. Don’t vote for new taxes or tax increases, and don’t send big government representatives to elected office. Voting blue will always result in bigger government, but there are plenty of people on both sides who’ll take more and more.
This post was edited on 9/29/26 at 3:01 pm
Posted on 9/29/26 at 3:11 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
Conservatives believe the government should protect the environment, but subsequently fight against every attempt by the government to protect the environment while refusing to offer any alternatives. Is that the claim?
Not the other poster, but going to go out on a limb and say no, that is not the claim they are making. Not even remotely close. In fact, i'd say your attempt here is closer to the exact opposite of the claim they are making.
This post was edited on 9/29/26 at 3:12 pm
Posted on 9/29/26 at 3:12 pm to deltaland
quote:
4cubbies
Didn’t read
Voted down
This is the way.
Posted on 9/29/26 at 3:13 pm to GoCrazyAuburn
Notice that I gave a very well-reasoned response regarding conservatives and environmentalists that she has chosen to completely ignore because it doesn’t work with her straw man narrative. 4cubbies is not a serious poster or thinker. She is just a gaslighting internet troll.
And for the record: no, I would not choose to drink the water in New Orleans, and I would advise others to avoid doing so whenever possible as well.
And for the record: no, I would not choose to drink the water in New Orleans, and I would advise others to avoid doing so whenever possible as well.
This post was edited on 9/29/26 at 3:14 pm
Posted on 9/29/26 at 3:17 pm to kingbob
quote:
4cubbies is not a serious poster or thinker. She is just a gaslighting internet troll.
Posted on 9/29/26 at 3:21 pm to Hawgnsincebirth55
The founder of Greenpeace has said climate change is a fraud.
Posted on 9/29/26 at 3:23 pm to kingbob
quote:For some reason, you can't stay away from my threads. Go have a serious conversation with a poster you deem serious about a serious topic.
4cubbies is not a serious poster or thinker. She is just a gaslighting internet troll.
Posted on 9/29/26 at 3:34 pm to 4cubbies
Straight from Google: “ A liberal is broadly defined as a person or view favoring personal freedom, individual rights, openness to new ideas, and social or political reform”.
Does that sound like any liberals you know? Everything they do and believe contradicts these things in some way, except maybe the reform part
Does that sound like any liberals you know? Everything they do and believe contradicts these things in some way, except maybe the reform part
Posted on 9/29/26 at 3:37 pm to 4cubbies
quote:Perhaps you could consider weeding out the floating signifiers, or at least trimming them down?
What alternatives to government have Conservatives proposed to protect the environment?
For example, what do you have in mind when referencing "government alternatives." Government owned or fully funded efforts? Solyndra? Tax & Regulation? Selective funding of private companies?
The same question would hold regarding "protecting the environment." Which environment? New Orleans? The US? Global? Does that "protection" include Climate Policy in our current Ice Age?
Posted on 9/29/26 at 3:49 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
First, let's get clear about what neoliberalism is. It's an actual political and economic philosophy that favors free-market capitalism, privatization, deregulation, and a reduction in government.
I know youve always been slow on the uptake, but neoliberalism? Dayum!!
I'll just leave these right here
Neoliberalism is dying: what’s next? - Jan 2026
How Neoliberalism Failed, and What a Better Society Could Look Like - Aug 2024
Neoliberalism is Dead … Long Live Neoliberalism! - Ape 2013
Neoliberalism is dead, long live national security - Aug 2024
Neoliberalism is dead: we need a new political story - Jun 2016
Ending Neoliberalism - Aug 2024
Neoliberalism Is Dead: What World Are We In Now? - Feb 2026
The Rise and Fall of Neoliberalism - July 2023
Palantir and the New Order: Neoliberalism is dead. - Apr 2026
Posted on 9/29/26 at 3:55 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
I also wonder why the American right embraced neoliberalism (or the modern version of it) and not the American left?
The left believes in control.
That’s it.
That is the answer you are looking for.
Posted on 9/29/26 at 4:01 pm to ShrimperDan
quote:
Trump would be the most likely person to do so
Why?
Ideologically he's basically a Carter-era Southern Democrat.
Posted on 9/29/26 at 5:18 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
Conservatives believe the government should protect the environment, but subsequently fight against every attempt by the government to protect the environment while refusing to offer any alternatives.
But that is not true and has been shown to be false IN THIS THREAD. I’m not going to find it for you, because you surely read the explanation about protecting species and habitat.
BTW, Trump and the Republicans stripped away the subsidies for wind and solar but left in place the carbon capture and sequestration subsidies which had just been expanded.
Posted on 9/29/26 at 5:22 pm to TheHarahanian
quote:solutions to social ills like pollution.
That wasn’t in your post that started this back and forth. It was this:
quote:You responded that Elon Musk was solving environmental crises. Elon Musk purchased Tesla.
But, in answer, Tesla.
quote:you’ve been to New Orleans at points over the course of your life and have determined the water is not safe to drink for anyone ever. Noted.
I spent most of my career in and around NOLA. I’ve seen the color of the water. I’ve heard the numerous news reports about boil water advisories. I won’t drink NOLA water.
quote:
Stop thinking the government is the solution to everything.
Can you point to an example of me claiming the government is the solution to anything?
You think Elon Musk, who spends a lot of time and money buying politicians, is the savior of the world
Posted on 9/29/26 at 5:44 pm to JimEverett
quote:
Sure. But what about his policies were neoliberal that separated him from A. those before him; and B those after him, particularly people to the left of him?
I think it’s fair to give him credit for championing neoliberal policies like school vouchers. He talked about dismantling the Dept of Education (reducing government). He championed major tax cuts and deregulation. These aren’t uniquely Reagan-esque and I can’t explain why he gets so much adulation from the right.
Posted on 9/29/26 at 6:55 pm to 4cubbies
It's kind of short sighted to broadly follow one economist's philosophy. There's a lot of things that have changed since these old right and left leaning academics were around.
For example, Freedman's theory about the velocity of money would remain stable forever definitely turned out to not be true. He also thought nepotism would go away in free markets.
A big tenant of his philosophy is that people chasing profit would act rationally as a whole and while many do, there's definitely a large amount who don't.
For example, Freedman's theory about the velocity of money would remain stable forever definitely turned out to not be true. He also thought nepotism would go away in free markets.
A big tenant of his philosophy is that people chasing profit would act rationally as a whole and while many do, there's definitely a large amount who don't.
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