re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

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Pro Russian take on the counter offensive

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Interesting take. I agree with some of the points and disagree with others, but I think that guy fails to mention Ukraine's two biggest mistakes in planning this offensive:

1) Giving the new NATO equipment to brand-new units and expecting green troops to lead the offensive, and

2) Waiting too long to start. Everyone originally expected the offensive to start in April, and it ended up being June, and that gave Russia more time to fortify its positions.

That said, I am much more optimistic about Ukraine's chances today than I was five days ago, mainly because I think that what's happening in South Kherson is going to change the whole picture.

I thought that Nuland was in Niger which Russian media pronounces with a second G

You are a coach at “FCS East”. Your first game of the season is against Notre Dame. You have, sarcastically, been told the only way you keep your job is win this game.

You have an old friend at Alabama who reaches out to you and offers a consultant to help you plan and strategize. Plus, Alabama hates Notre Dame and would love to see them lose to FCS east.

The consultant at Alabama tells you they have some grey shirts that didn’t work out; highly sought after but have academic problems. A couple of WRs and DBs.

Here’s the rub: you’re a triple option team. You have always been a triple option team. The consultant at Alabama says you have no chance running the TO and need to air it out against ND and tells you to redo your offensive philosophy…in a month. They’re from alabama, so you listen.

Game day arrives and your offense gets one good TD in and then is completely shut down. Linemen aren’t used to blocking in the new scheme and don’t know how to protect a pocket. Your WRs from bama are fast but none of your running schemes work because they don’t block, and you can’t even get them the ball because of the OL problems.

The DBs are doing great and the only reason you’re still in the game. You have an epiphany: alabamas schemes work because they have Alabama players at every position and have had that offensive scheme installed for awhile.

It’s halftime and you’re down 17-7. What do you do? Do you keep going 3 and out on offense the rest of the game or do you revert back to what your players and coaches are used to running?

My favorite part is when you state a factoid and then draw a conclusion without actually connecting the factoid to your assertion.

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How much do you make in the Troll farm?

Your moniker is a dead giveaway, though politards will eat up everything you post

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The USA sent $113 Billion to Ukraine in 2022 alone,

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Please link to proof that the US sent 113 B in cash to Ukraine in 22.

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You certainly can when you sell it half off to someone else.

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1. Ukraine may have made a strategic mistake in putting too much emphasis and resources in Bakhmut while allowing the Russians time to build up those defence lines in the south. To me, the Russian objective in Bakhmut now is clear, it gave them time to prepare and get ready in the South. They sacrificed Wagner while allowing their army to get ready in the South.



2. They were pressured into this offensive while not being given the entire arsenal needed for it to be successful by administrations in western Europe and the US that never were committed totally to a Russian defeat.

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1. Ukraine did not have the assets to go on an offensive earlier this year. Ukraine was still in the process of having 17 brigades in NATO training at the time the Russians were advancing on Bakhmut. That is why Ukraine was having to use territorial defense forces with less than a months training to slow the Russian assault of Bakhmut. It's only options were to fight for Bakhmut and keep up morale or fall back. If Ukraine had fallen back without a fight it would have been a major morale blow at the same time Russian missile attacks were very close to crippling the country's energy infrastructure.

2. Ukraine was absolutely pushed into an offensive before it was ready. My sauce(s) in Ukraine told me that Ukraine was planning on starting an offensive in August and September after receiving more mine removal equipment and more importantly finishing mine removal training for a large group of troops. However, Ukraine found a small weak spot in Russian defenses in late May and that Zelensky was told by SecDef Austin if he did not launch the counteroffensive against that weak spot they would reassess sending M1A2s to Ukraine which would have caused Germany to reassess its Leopard 1 and Leopard 2 commitments to Ukraine. So Ukraine launched the offensive early while half of the planned mine clearing equipment had not arrived to the front and half of the planned troops for mine clearing operations were still in training. Granted this all rumors that I overheard on my last trip to Ukraine and from what my buddy has passed on.

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It took the Russians months to take very little ground. Why is it surprising to see the Ukrainian offensive churn out similar results? The Ukrainians were asked to take on something that NATO armies would never be required or asked to do.

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It is not surprising. I followed this thread while I was in banland and I wished I could log on and that simple question so many times. A lot of people in the west and most of the people in this thread drank too much of the western MBT kool aid. I remember GOPTiger and a few others were so excited when the first 30 or so Leopards got to Ukraine. I wanted to ask how much help they realistically thought 30 western MBTs were going to be to Ukraine when it faced extensive fortifications and hundreds of Russian tanks. The Leopards are better than anything Russia has but when Russian tanks outnumber them 20 to 1 they are not that much of a difference maker. Now when Ukraine receives all of the T72s, T80s, AMXs, Challengers, Abrams, Leopard 1s, and Leopard 2s it has been promised from NATO then and only then will they be a difference maker.

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I can now see the possibility of western support being curtailed and even greater pressure on Ukraine to end this/make concessions of territory and if that is the case what was the point of spending all of those billions if you were not willing to win? I think that the Ukrainian people are going to be screwed over again.

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It is a legit possibility. However, I hope that Ukrainian pilots finally starting training on F-16s is a sign that western officials are realizing that half measures are not going to be enough and that they cannot force victories in this war to boost their popularity (Biden and Macron).