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Started By
Message
re: Lady Declines To Design Lesbian Wedding Cake - Court Upoholds $135,000 Lawsuit
Posted on 1/4/18 at 3:28 pm to TurkeysAndBees
Posted on 1/4/18 at 3:28 pm to TurkeysAndBees
Sounds like someone should start a gofundme so they can reopen. Whether or not you agree or disagree, losing a business because of a reason like this is absolutely ridiculous.
0
Posted on 1/4/18 at 3:31 pm to TurkeysAndBees
It is illegal to compel a business owner to make a certain type of good
That isn't even what the language of the CRA isn't about. The CRA says you cannot PEOPLE a service. It doesn't compel you to make whatever a customer wants
If I'm the cake maker, I'm going to get a bunch of dirt and dead moths and give it to them
That isn't even what the language of the CRA isn't about. The CRA says you cannot PEOPLE a service. It doesn't compel you to make whatever a customer wants
If I'm the cake maker, I'm going to get a bunch of dirt and dead moths and give it to them
Posted on 1/4/18 at 3:32 pm to TurkeysAndBees
What if they were a black straight couple?
Posted on 1/4/18 at 3:38 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
quote:
If I'm the cake maker, I'm going to get a bunch of dirt and dead moths and give it to them
I'm pretty sure you'd have to be offering the dirt and moth cake package to other customers.
Compelling the cake makers to go out of their way and do something that they don't provide other customers is not equivalent to providing them something offered to everyone else.
Posted on 1/4/18 at 3:41 pm to BlackCoffeeKid
quote:
Oregon
And here's your sign...
Want to be Christian/Jewish baker, don't operate on the West coast where you are an evil nazi.
Hopefully, they moved, I'm sure a Southern/Midwest bank will give them a new start-up loan...And I hear new business taxes are pretty good this time of year.
Posted on 1/4/18 at 3:42 pm to TigerGman
quote:That doesn't violate religious conscious.
What if they were a black straight couple?
A similar case was argued in the supreme court in december and no judgement has been rendered yet. The defense (cake decorator) is that the owner is constitutionally protected from being compelled or forced to create something that violates their religious conscious. The gay couple argues that it is hateful to not produce a good for their wedding. It's worth noting that the owner has also turned away halloween business and off color bachelor/bachelorette cakes as well.
Posted on 1/4/18 at 3:46 pm to TurkeysAndBees
Why would a Christian live in Oregon?
Posted on 1/4/18 at 3:47 pm to TurkeysAndBees
Maybe or maybe not
This post was edited on 6/8/20 at 4:21 pm
Posted on 1/4/18 at 4:07 pm to TurkeysAndBees
quote:
It says that Avakian’s order didn’t deny the Kleins their free-speech rights, partly because the baker duo “made no showing that the state targeted them for enforcement because of their religious beliefs,” and that a business can’t turn away customers whose sexual orientation is at odds with the owner’s personal belief system.
In a statement, Avakian says the appellate ruling “sends a strong signal that Oregon remains open to all,” while the Bowman-Cryers are celebrating it as an “important victory” and blow against “a sweeping license to discriminate.” But the Oregonianadds that the fallout hasn’t been minor for Avakian — it says that his fateful order will likely go down as “the most controversial ruling” in his nearly ten years as labor commissioner. He’s decided not to run for reelection when his term ends next year.
Nonetheless, the Kleins’ brouhaha isn’t even the highest-profile anti-gay cake case around. That distinction belongs to Masterpiece Cakeshop v. Colorado Civil Rights Commission, the one Colorado’s evangelical baker Jack Phillips got appealed up to the Supreme Court. Phillips also refused to bake a gay couple’s wedding cake, leading Colorado courts to rule that he must, and him to voluntarily exit the wedding-cake business.
LINK
Posted on 1/4/18 at 4:08 pm to JETigER
quote:excellent beer, wine and weed
Why would a Christian live in Oregon?
Posted on 1/4/18 at 4:10 pm to jlovel7
quote:
1, as a business owner why you would turn away business is confusing.
As a business owner, I can tell you that I turn away business for one reason or another often.
Posted on 1/4/18 at 4:30 pm to TurkeysAndBees
quote:
If a Jewish couple demanded a Muslim owned bakery to design their wedding accessories.. and the Muslims opted to pass, would the court have upheld this same suit?
If the Muslim owned bakery designed wedding accessories as part of their business then, yes, they'd have to do that for a Jewish couple, a Christian couple, an atheist couple or even a gay couple.
quote:
If the Consitution guarantees religious liberty..
It does not guarantee unlimited liberties. Christians have to respect the boundaries of other groups, too. They're not the only ones who have liberties. When their religious liberties conflict with the civil liberties of others, civil liberties always win.
That's the only way we can have a democratic republic. Otherwise, we'd be living in a theocratic republic like Iran, Saudi Arabia or many other Muslim states.
This post was edited on 1/4/18 at 4:32 pm
Posted on 1/4/18 at 4:34 pm to lsu13lsu
quote:
As a business owner, I can tell you that I turn away business for one reason or another often.
You have the right to refuse service to anyone. However, when the reason is because the customer is a member of a group or community, especially a protected class, then that's illegal discrimination.
Posted on 1/4/18 at 4:41 pm to TurkeysAndBees
quote:
claiming they were "mentally raped".
America is becoming such a sad place.
Posted on 1/4/18 at 4:43 pm to keakar
The law they're proceeding under is an Oregon law which makes gays a protected class, which is not the case under federal law.
Posted on 1/4/18 at 4:51 pm to jlovel7
quote:
There's two sides. 1, as a business owner why you would turn away business is confusing. 2, as a customer, why would you give business to someone who's opposed to your way of life like that? I don't think legally you should be able to force someone to provide a service to you, but that doesn't mean we can't shame or boycott the store owners. But I just don't get why the lesbian couple would want to buy their cakes here in the first place.
Exactly. There's no need for men with guns to tell the other people how to act. The market solves this problem without the gov't.
Posted on 1/4/18 at 4:53 pm to TurkeysAndBees
Mental Rape is a thing?
Posted on 1/4/18 at 5:00 pm to TurkeysAndBees
While I don't really agree with a business denying service to people just because they don't agree with their views, if I were the person who was being declined, I would just proudly go take my business to someone who would be happy to have it.
The downside of living in a free country is that you will come across people who don't agree with the same shite as you do. I think that is a fair price to pay.
Personally, if a business was forced to serve everyone, but I knew they didn't like something about me or will not be happy about the fact they have to serve me, I wouldn't want to use them.
If I was in some small town and I wanted to go to a bar that was for the locals, being a new face, they would probably give me a few signals that I was not welcomed there. Should I sue them because they made it clear, without actually saying it, that they don't really want me there and they didn't give me the same type of service as they gave everyone else.. No. You just find another bar to go to.
The downside of living in a free country is that you will come across people who don't agree with the same shite as you do. I think that is a fair price to pay.
Personally, if a business was forced to serve everyone, but I knew they didn't like something about me or will not be happy about the fact they have to serve me, I wouldn't want to use them.
If I was in some small town and I wanted to go to a bar that was for the locals, being a new face, they would probably give me a few signals that I was not welcomed there. Should I sue them because they made it clear, without actually saying it, that they don't really want me there and they didn't give me the same type of service as they gave everyone else.. No. You just find another bar to go to.
Posted on 1/4/18 at 5:01 pm to OweO
let me know how many people read and finish your entire post. 
Posted on 1/4/18 at 5:01 pm to CarRamrod
What a joke with that judgement, they don't deserve $135K.
It's time to offer China The West Coast, NY, Massachusetts, and Tejas, clear out debt, and actually put trillions into our coffers.
It's time to offer China The West Coast, NY, Massachusetts, and Tejas, clear out debt, and actually put trillions into our coffers.
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