re: Here's Another Cop Thread to Debate: Wichita Kansas No Knock Raid

quote:

---

so we are talking less than 1% of all raids

---

How can you say that when the FBI director admitted to not having reliable data?

The map I posted is data collected ONLY from local news sources, and there are still that many incidents shown. Because LE policies are so non-transparent, I guess we're left to infer on how many more went unreported.

And I'm sorry, even if your error rate is approximately 1%, that's not good enough. Not when the 1% affected are innocent civilians ending up deceased or disabled. And 100% of that 1% is entirely preventable if the no-knock was not utilized in the scenario.

But I know what is <1%..the amount of LE's held as criminally responsible in any of the botched raids on that map.

I don't hate cops. I sure don't think they are all stupid. In fact, I blame administrators and trainers far more than the average cop. You're just doing what you're taught, which in these days seems to be self-preservation above all else. To Protect and Serve be damned. When you are basically given free reign to shoot anyone you perceive to be even the slightest threat (knife, rock, cell phone, imaginary handgun), and not be criminally punished for it, it's difficult to give you credit for "laying your life on the line everyday".

quote:

---

Im not sure if yall know this or not but a no knock warrant is not the easiest thing to get a judge to sign. they are only used when circumstances such as officer safety and the protection of evidence is at hand.

---

Even though they transfer most of the danger to the possibly completely innocent inhabitants of the home and away from the heavily armed group of relatively highly trained policemen who will be breaking into the home, they are wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong in ANY circumstance other than those where any Good Samaritan would be justified in kicking in the door... ie you are just about 100% sure that some grave harm will come to innocents inside if you don't break in.

Y'all are 100% wrong and assholes for breaking into homes to look for drugs.

Also, why do these always seem to have to happen at night?

quote:

---

im not trying to argue but how many judges do you work with on a daily basis?

also if you don't like the judge you can vote them out

---

A fair question and the answer would be "0".

That said, when I see all the issues with no-knock warrants, I would hope judges would use more discretion before granting them.

I don't see that happening.

And let's be honest, judges do in fact put the word of an officer over an average citizen.

ETA:
LINK

Mr. Keane, in his Chronicle article, offered two major reasons the police lie so much. First, because they can. Police officers “know that in a swearing match between a drug defendant and a police officer, the judge always rules in favor of the officer.” At worst, the case will be dismissed, but the officer is free to continue business as usual. Second, criminal defendants are typically poor and uneducated, often belong to a racial minority, and often have a criminal record. “Police know that no one cares about these people,” Mr. Keane explained.

quote:

---

maybe you're right. but until you wear the uniform. you'll never know

---

Until you're the victim of overzealous police officers, you'll never know. Stupid, self righteous statement like this just piss the populace off to no end. I have friends that are cops, and I know they aren't all shite bags, but he makes sure to do everything by the book and has multiple times been in trouble with his own force for being honest instead of toeing the company line.

yea well smoke drugs and the cops come knocking stupid kids shoulda just drank anyway

"Pay for mistakes".

So police are held liable for breaking and entering, assault, etc when no evidence is found during no knock warrants?

quote:

---

yea well smoke drugs and the cops come knocking stupid kids shoulda just drank anyway

---

what? Is this missing some crucial punctuation?

quote:

---

So police are held liable for breaking and entering, assault, etc when no evidence is found during no knock warrants?

---

Of course not.

Not even when they do a no-knock raid for someone who doesn't even live in the home and permanently disfigure a toddler's face in the process. They won't pay the toddler's medical bills or try to help the kid out in any way, either.

quote:

---

I'll gladly take 1,000 flushed bags of dope over one dead homeowner or maimed child.

---

I agree. IMO, if the dope can be flushed quickly, it's probably not enough weight to be spending a lot of time and resources on.