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2
Posted on 4/16/19 at 12:18 pm to Bigfishchoupique
(no message)
This post was edited on 5/11/19 at 9:44 am
Posted on 4/16/19 at 12:22 pm to East Coast Band
quote:
I'll feel bad for the guy if it's found he had a hearing impairment
The first thing he says is, "I heard you the first time"...
Then I think he says, "ugh"..
Posted on 4/16/19 at 12:33 pm to Mootsman
Bet you had a mental issue and wanted to commit suicide
Posted on 4/16/19 at 12:48 pm to Mootsman
"A trained law enforcement officer is pointing a live weapon at me. S/he has commanded me to drop my weapon in plain English no less than a dozen times. I know that failure to comply will in all likelihood result in me suffering grave bodily harm.
You know what, I think I'll just do everything except what I'm being told to do, and hope that somehow everything works out."
You know what, I think I'll just do everything except what I'm being told to do, and hope that somehow everything works out."
Posted on 4/16/19 at 1:08 pm to messyjesse
Why couldn't they shoot him in the knees?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Because your finger can still pull a trigger even after being shot in the knees.
Then why not shoot him in the finger?
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Because your finger can still pull a trigger even after being shot in the knees.
Then why not shoot him in the finger?
Posted on 4/16/19 at 1:16 pm to East Coast Band
quote:
I'll feel bad for the guy if it's found he had a hearing impairment
What does having a hearing impairment have to do with threatening people with a gun?
This post was edited on 4/16/19 at 1:17 pm
Posted on 4/16/19 at 2:04 pm to theenemy
She had the advantage with her firearm and her partners on this guy ready to pull the trigger. I think she could have killed the guy or "stopped the threat" had he turned the firearm towards her which he didn't. Had she waited 1 more second it appears that the guys life could have been spared. On the flip side of that you gotta think would he have went and killed an innocent person the next week when he got out of the mental hospital? Cheers to the officer for doing her job.
Posted on 4/16/19 at 2:27 pm to jbgleason
quote:
He was pulling a gun
Which he had to do to follow their instructions. The cops did a piss poor job here. I know it's a tough job with your life on the line, but that cop escalated that shite real quick. She should have stayed calm and told him to keep his hands up. "Put the gun down" makes sense if he's holding a gun, but he wasn't. To put it down, requires him doing exactly what he was doing.
I'm not saying the cop deserves to rot in jail for this, but she certainly shouldn't be a cop given how that played out.
Posted on 4/16/19 at 6:01 pm to Jester
(no message)
This post was edited on 5/11/19 at 9:44 am
Posted on 4/16/19 at 6:04 pm to Mootsman
Clean shoot. Should have done it sooner.
Posted on 4/16/19 at 7:04 pm to Oilfieldbiology
quote:
agree with all of this. Still think the guy did everything wrong too
My problem with that is I expect a lot more out of the trained professional than the random dude.
I don’t expect perfection out of either but as others mention- she could have done a lot of simple stuff to deescalate. Better position herself, better communicate, better plan his surrender. He obviously shouldn’t have been at BK with a gun and in an ideal world he communicates but for all she knows he’s mentally unwell, could have a speech disorder, any variety of ptsd that causes him to shut down. She’s a trained professional. At huge risk no doubt. But she also didn’t minimize that risk in a variety of ways.
Posted on 4/16/19 at 7:35 pm to brass2mouth
quote:
The cops did a piss poor job here.
No they didn’t.
Her communication was HORRIBLE. First, she ask him to show her his hands 15-20ft from the back of the car and the same distance from where she could have line of sight. What if he popped up from his crouch with the gun in his hand (she did not say to drop anything)?
Second, she gave three conflicting commands which do you follow first? Show me your hands, put the weapon down, drop the weapon. You can't both put a weapon down and drop it at the same time, they are mutually exclusive.
quote:
To put it down, requires him doing exactly what he was doing.
To put it down requires you to open our hand and let gravity handle the rest.
NO. When you tell a child to put down a plate are you suggesting they drop it or place it on the floor in a controlled manner? The fact you while reading this thread and responding in leisure time still confused the two should give you a clear insight into how these are examples of poor communication especially when lives are literally on the line.
In the end, the officer made a mistake when you look at the video he was complying, he was placing the gun down, holding it by the top of the slide, barrel pointed up his forearm with the grip down. Now the salient issue is whether one excuses the mistake or not, not whether there was one, that is clear IF you look at the video objectively.
The question of giving a pass based on the situation is wholly legitimate but shooting during the act of compliance is a mistake. As I said before it is like a ref viewing in real time vs fans looking in slow motion. Cops like refs make bad calls but rarely do either set out to do it and knowing they are human we can on occasion excuse the mistake but especially in the case of deadly force and cops we should acknowledge mistakes and work on procedures and training to prevent the mistakes while still being mindful of the safety of cops and bystanders.
Posted on 4/16/19 at 8:09 pm to marshallmadmen
quote:
She had the advantage with her firearm and her partners on this guy ready to pull the trigger.
True but if he moves to the passenger seat he then would have the advantage due to cover since the B pillar of the car is bulletproof.
quote:
I think she could have killed the guy or "stopped the threat" had he turned the firearm towards her which he didn't.
Problem is people dont die instantly when you shoot them. Once they get the gun up...it doesnt matter if you are first or not they are going to get rounds off.
quote:
Had she waited 1 more second it appears that the guys life could have been spared
That's looking at it in hindsight. She doesnt know if he is gonna come up shooting or not.
You follow your training...you dont take chances....you give loud commands and when you perceive the threat...you take appropriate action.
She did right...you dont roll the dice with your life or bystanders' lives.
If he had got a shot off and killed a bystander everyone would be asking why she hesitated.
This post was edited on 4/16/19 at 8:11 pm
Posted on 4/16/19 at 8:52 pm to theenemy
Good for her. I was leo for 5 years and would have done same. If the cop walks up and you are armed, put the weapon down immediately. Anything else is asking to get your dumb arse shot.
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