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re: Greatest you saw play LIVE and in person in the big 4
Posted on 2/1/11 at 1:51 pm to H-Town Tiger
Posted on 2/1/11 at 1:51 pm to H-Town Tiger
it amazes me how many people in this thread are not very well rounded sports fans. only been to one nba game, never been to an nhl game, etc..
it's fricking weird.
p.s. just responded to you because you are the last post
it's fricking weird.
p.s. just responded to you because you are the last post
2
Posted on 2/1/11 at 1:54 pm to OWLFAN86
Nolan Ryan
Drew Brees or Joe Montana
Chris Paul or Kobe
Drew Brees or Joe Montana
Chris Paul or Kobe
This post was edited on 2/1/11 at 1:55 pm
Posted on 2/1/11 at 1:55 pm to rockchlkjayhku11
I don't live in an NHL city, otherwise I'd probably have gone to a game. I dated a woman from Dallas who was a big Stars fan and had tickets with a group of friends, but they cancelled one season and we broke up before the next or I probably would have gone to one 
Posted on 2/1/11 at 2:16 pm to H-Town Tiger
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Its way in the favor of Mays and if you think it isnt then you know nothing about the game.
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this is the classic argument used by people who know they can't make a rational argument and just lash out at someone who has a different view, that you know is correct, well done
Id say you started the classic argument to this effect when calling people who differ with your opinion "stupid"
quote:
Bonds came up in the NL when it had several pitchers parks, like the Astrodome.
Bonds didnt exactly hit a ton of homers then either.
quote:
He wasnt allowed to jack up on steroids and hang over the plate wearing body armour.
quote:
ah, back when guys were men and we know that NO ONE ever "cheated" in the "good old days" right?
Do you have a Mays/steroid link Im not aware of?
Its a fact that Bonds hung over the plate. He wore armour down the right side of his body and pitchers dont pitch inside like they did in Mays game. If Bonds played then, especially as a black player he would have been hit in his huge head hundreds of times.
I still think its Willie, Bonds could have been a very good ballplayer on his own. He's a fricking cheater though so I discard some of them I guess.
His numbers stack up though so if thats all one goes by I guess an argument can be made for Bonds. Even with the numbers, he wasnt the 5 tool player Mays was.
Posted on 2/1/11 at 2:24 pm to bomber77
quote:
Its a fact that Bonds hung over the plate. He wore armour down the right side of his body and pitchers dont pitch inside like they did in Mays game. If Bonds played then, especially as a black player he would have been hit in his huge head hundreds of times
different eras, differnt umps, different "rules"
if mays played now, he wouldve worn armor and hung out over the plate too.
quote:
He's a fricking cheater though so I discard some of them I guess.
i love when people bring up the "cheater" argument when it comes to baseball and bonds. out of all the major sports, baseball is ALL about cheating. spit balls, greenies, stealing signs, corked bats, scuffed balls.......
quote:
Even with the numbers, he wasnt the 5 tool player Mays was.
really???? he wasnt as good a fielder as mays, but he was an above average outfielder for the majority of his career.
Posted on 2/1/11 at 2:34 pm to rutiger
quote:
Even with the numbers, he wasnt the 5 tool player Mays was.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
really???? he wasnt as good a fielder as mays, but he was an above average outfielder for the majority of his career.
Hitting for average - Mays
Hitting for power - Bonds
Base running - Mays
Fielding - Mays
Arm - Mays
Posted on 2/1/11 at 2:39 pm to bomber77
quote:He lead the league in HR in 1993 and was top 5 in HR every year from 1992-1997. So, he sort of did hit a lot of home runs.
Bonds didnt exactly hit a ton of homers then either.
quote:He's admitted to using greenies, like most players of his era. Amphetemines helped him keep his energy in a 162 game schedule. Damning current players while promoting players of the past requires us to be outraged over one drug and not bothered at all by another.
Do you have a Mays/steroid link Im not aware of?
Posted on 2/1/11 at 2:47 pm to bomber77
quote:
Hitting for average -
wash .302 (mays) .298 (bonds)
Hitting for power -
Bonds- true
Base running -
bonds (514 sbs vs. 334 for mays)though "base running" is kind of subjective.
Fielding -
Mays- true
Arm -
Mays- true
This post was edited on 2/1/11 at 2:50 pm
Posted on 2/1/11 at 2:53 pm to rutiger
The five tools are also a fairly poor way to evaluate players. I mean, according to the five tools, Cesar Izturis is a better player than Babe Ruth, given his advanatge in speed, fielding, and arm strength. "Toolsy" is synonomous with "bust".
Posted on 2/1/11 at 3:07 pm to Baloo
quote:
He lead the league in HR in 1993 and was top 5 in HR every year from 1992-1997. So, he sort of did hit a lot of home runs.
His first 6 years, 142 total, 23.6 average. Not alot of home runs sort of.
His second 6 years, 232 total, 38.7 average
His last 7 years, 329 total, 47.0 average
He really must have started working out! Its amazing the power that he added throughout his career!
I normally see some good reasoning in your posts but to compare some speed to steriods as far as preformance goes is a huge stretch.
Homers for Mays,
First 6 years, 226, 37.7 average
Second 6 years, 263, 43.8 average
Third 6 years, 141, 23.5 average
Kind of the way a great career is supposed to go.
This post was edited on 2/1/11 at 3:08 pm
Posted on 2/1/11 at 3:08 pm to rockchlkjayhku11
quote:
it amazes me how many people in this thread are not very well rounded sports fans. only been to one nba game, never been to an nhl game, etc..
So your litmus test on being well rounded is attending games in all sports? Pretty ridiculous. You can be just as much of a fan watching on the tube as you can in the arena.
Posted on 2/1/11 at 3:09 pm to Baloo
quote:
Baloo
Do you think Bonds was a better baseball player than Mays?
BTW, the 5 tools are a way to rate great baseball players. To be considered in this catagory one has to be a good player already.
Its not used to compare a short stop that hits for a 195 average to a fat slob who is a DH power hitter.
This post was edited on 2/1/11 at 3:17 pm
Posted on 2/1/11 at 3:21 pm to bomber77
Why is it that some have to hijack a decent thread arguing about Mays vs Bonds?
start a thread on that why don't cha?
BTW Bonds couldn't hold Mays jock, sorry
start a thread on that why don't cha?
BTW Bonds couldn't hold Mays jock, sorry
This post was edited on 2/1/11 at 3:22 pm
Posted on 2/1/11 at 3:25 pm to stapuffmarshy
quote:
Why is it that some have to hijack a decent thread arguing about Mays vs Bonds?
My fault quote:
BTW Bonds couldn't hold Mays jock, sorry
Posted on 2/1/11 at 3:32 pm to bomber77
Just to add, steroids or greenies have little effect, IMO, on plate discipline and knowing the strike zone. I think Bonds average could have been higher if they'd pitched to him more. Don't want to go there any further.
Baseball: Nolan Ryan
Basketball: Pete Maravich with the Jazz
Football: Live? Willie Roaf
Hockey: Never been to NHL, don't travel out of town this time of year. Thus....Jeff "Laser" Lazaro, fastest man in hockey.
Baseball: Nolan Ryan
Basketball: Pete Maravich with the Jazz
Football: Live? Willie Roaf
Hockey: Never been to NHL, don't travel out of town this time of year. Thus....Jeff "Laser" Lazaro, fastest man in hockey.
Posted on 2/1/11 at 3:48 pm to OWLFAN86
baseball: andruw jones, when he was in his prime... but soon to be jason heyward 
basketball: jordan (even though i saw him with the wizards), kobe is next
hockey: ovechkin
football: mike vick...soon to be cam newton
basketball: jordan (even though i saw him with the wizards), kobe is next
hockey: ovechkin
football: mike vick...soon to be cam newton
This post was edited on 2/1/11 at 3:49 pm
Posted on 2/1/11 at 3:48 pm to OWLFAN86
Clemens at George Cole Field
Dickerson at Texas Stadium
Jordan at Chicago Stadium
Roy The Arena/Checkerdome
Dickerson at Texas Stadium
Jordan at Chicago Stadium
Roy The Arena/Checkerdome
Posted on 2/1/11 at 3:56 pm to stapuffmarshy
quote:
BTW Bonds couldn't hold Mays jock, sorry
ignorance is bliss!
the thing i love about baseball is arguments like this, but to say bonds and mays aren't in the same league is just plain dumb.
Posted on 2/1/11 at 5:20 pm to OWLFAN86
Baseball- Nolan Ryan with Astros and Rangers numerous times. There are some that have the opinion that Josh Hamilton is the greatest player that they've ever played with, and I've seen him several times, too. Cal Ripken, Jr. and Ken Griffey, Jr. against the Rangers.
Football- Emmitt Smith (actually saw him break the record vs. Seattle); Staubach/Aikman, too; saw Tom Landry is probably the best coach I've ever gotten to see live. Watched the NFC Championship with Favre vs. Aikman, Smith, Irvin, and Sanders on the field at the same time.
Basketball- Shaq vs. Dirk; actually went to Lebron's 21st birthday party with business partners in Phoenix, AZ. Wished I could have found bookie the next day, because I knew beyond certainty that the Cavs would not cover the next day
Hockey- Gretzky vs. Modano (front row against the glass for a face off; puck flew over my head smacked the woman's mouth right behind my wife and me...Modano skated by and smiled at us and tapped his false teeth with his finger)
hmmm...all Dallas teams. Never saw Dickerson play live at SMU, though.
[not too shabby]
Football- Emmitt Smith (actually saw him break the record vs. Seattle); Staubach/Aikman, too; saw Tom Landry is probably the best coach I've ever gotten to see live. Watched the NFC Championship with Favre vs. Aikman, Smith, Irvin, and Sanders on the field at the same time.
Basketball- Shaq vs. Dirk; actually went to Lebron's 21st birthday party with business partners in Phoenix, AZ. Wished I could have found bookie the next day, because I knew beyond certainty that the Cavs would not cover the next day
Hockey- Gretzky vs. Modano (front row against the glass for a face off; puck flew over my head smacked the woman's mouth right behind my wife and me...Modano skated by and smiled at us and tapped his false teeth with his finger)
hmmm...all Dallas teams. Never saw Dickerson play live at SMU, though.
[not too shabby]
Posted on 2/1/11 at 5:37 pm to bomber77
quote:
Id say you started the classic argument to this effect when calling people who differ with your opinion "stupid"
touche', I'll retract, but my intial comment was that Bonds was better (directed at another poster) you responed with
and a bunch of >>>>>>, which implies you think its no contest. There is certainly a case for either one, to suggest its no contest in favor of one or the other is wrong. quote:
Bonds didnt exactly hit a ton of homers then either.
define "tons". He hit 16 his rookie year in 86 in a little over 400 AB's. In 88 he was 9th in NL with 24, in 90 he hit 33 which was 4th, in 92 he hit 34 which was 2nd. In 93 hit he 46 which was 1st. He was 3rd in 94 with 37, 4th in 95. That was all before he was alleged to have started juicing. Basically from 1990 on he was one of the top HR in the NL.
quote:
Do you have a Mays/steroid link Im not aware of?
nope, but steriods aren't the only way to cheat. corked bats, spit balls, etc. I'm not saying Mays "cheated", i have never heard any such thing, but I hate when people (not saying you are in this group btw) act like the past was the golden age of integrity. If anything, it was dirtier in the past.
quote:
He wore armour down the right side of his body and pitchers dont pitch inside like they did in Mays game. If Bonds played then, especially as a black player he would have been hit in his huge head hundreds of times.
I would imagine he would have adjusted and not stood on the plate lest he get hit in the head 100 times. Players regardless of era will do things to their advantage.
quote:
Bonds could have been a very good ballplayer on his own. He's a fricking cheater though so I discard some of them I guess.
Bonds was an all time great long before he was alleged to have used. We had a long thread on steroids and Bonds last week, if you'd like to comment, here's the LINK
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