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re: DLine Shift causing false start is a DLine penalty now
Posted on 7/16/25 at 3:23 pm to Reda LSU
Posted on 7/16/25 at 3:23 pm to Reda LSU
quote:
The definition of a false start has forever been action that simulates the snap
If this is how they're defining it, then hard counts and the QB simulating the snap with movement should be a penalty too.
0
Posted on 7/16/25 at 3:35 pm to Reda LSU
quote:
TLDR: if the Dline all shifts to the left or right and the Oline moves for what is normally a false start, it is now a defensive penalty. This is stupid AF
So they basically can’t do it at all now. Cause if I’m an OL, I’m jumping every time
Posted on 7/16/25 at 3:36 pm to Schmelly
Just another way for the SEC to leverage officials to rig games. Amazingly stupid but not surprising whatsoever.
This post was edited on 7/16/25 at 3:37 pm
Posted on 7/16/25 at 3:45 pm to Reda LSU
That's not what was said during the conference or reported in the linked article.
The two defensive lineman on the left can move in connection ("stemming").
What is illegal is the lineman on the right moving his arm in connection with his teammates stemming:
Here's a Tiktok showing a split screen view with the video referenced during the talk.
This shows the movement which will be called a defensive delay of game.
The two defensive lineman on the left can move in connection ("stemming").
quote:
That action by the two that are stemming on our left legal,
What is illegal is the lineman on the right moving his arm in connection with his teammates stemming:
quote:
but you can see in concert with that, we have a tackle between the right guard and right tackle who's flinching. He's simulating action at the snap, and it works. It makes the right guard move here. This is action that has now been written into the rules, codified that it's illegal, it's what we call delay of game defense.
Here's a Tiktok showing a split screen view with the video referenced during the talk.
This shows the movement which will be called a defensive delay of game.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 3:47 pm to Reda LSU
Wasn’t this a penalty last yearn
What annoys me is this is a penalty, but hard counts aren’t?
It should go both way. the offense doesn’t need any extra advantages. they know the fricking snap count.
What annoys me is this is a penalty, but hard counts aren’t?
It should go both way. the offense doesn’t need any extra advantages. they know the fricking snap count.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 3:55 pm to Alt26
quote:
I don't like when teams do things for the sole purposes of drawing a penalty.
So, is it your opinion the offense can't do hard counts either?
Posted on 7/16/25 at 3:56 pm to Alt26
quote:
the ONLY reason for that sudden and coordinated shift if to draw a penalty against the OL
I hear where you're coming from but it's not true. Defensive movement pre-snap is the same as offensive motion. The whole point of DL movement is to make the QB make gap reads, communicate with his center, and then change it so they have to adjust, or snap the ball anyway if the play-clock is low. Different stunts and assignments are run out of different gap techniques and the movement disguises it. Same as a safety creeping down into the box after coming out in a 2-high set or otherwise.
Also, neutral zone infractions already exist. It's the offense's job not to start before the ball is snapped. The defense, at every other position but DL apparently, can move freely pre-snap so long as they don't cross the line of scrimmage.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:02 pm to FlyingTiger06
quote:
So, is it your opinion the offense can't do hard counts either?
The QB gets penalized if he makes a sudden physical movement while doing a hard count
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:06 pm to Reda LSU
The biggest problem with this is that it creates another gray area with no bright line rule that will get interpreted differently from crew to crew.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:06 pm to BilbeauTBaggins
quote:
The exact same thing but it was called "disconcerting signals", which was any attempt to draw the offense into a false start by simulating anything that could result in them to snap the ball.
Yeah, it was when defensive players were clapping their hands.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:07 pm to Alt26
quote:
The QB gets penalized if he makes a sudden physical movement while doing a hard count
Dude, the QBs bob their head all the time and don't get called. But, that's still ignoring the fact that the sole reason for the hard count is to get the defense to jump. So my question was regarding the comment that you didn't like any effort to just purposely draw a penalty instead of executing the play.
This post was edited on 7/16/25 at 4:08 pm
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:17 pm to Reda LSU
So, one apparent effect of this is that the D-line will basically be forced to identify the front pre-snap to the offense. Makes O-line play incredibly easier.
Let’s hand more advantages to the offense.
Let’s hand more advantages to the offense.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:22 pm to Clyde Tipton
quote:Came to post this, it’s not all about simulating a snap
could confuse the offense on specific blocking assignments
As the OLs mentally adjusting they miss the blitzing Mike and 3 seconds later the QB is on his arse
This post was edited on 7/16/25 at 4:24 pm
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:23 pm to Reda LSU
Looking less and less like football. Gonna be 7 on 7 before long.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:30 pm to ProjectP2294
quote:
If it's only a penalty now, what in the hell did they keep calling on us last year?
Right. We either did this completely wrong or constantly got screwed by officiating, because it never seemed like the penalty after the shift went our way. Completely banning it is a net positive for us.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:38 pm to putt23
It was mostly when defensive linemen would slide and smash the ground, which somehow simulated a "clap"
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:44 pm to Ryan3232
This was my question too. It appears it only applies the the whole line shift, not an individual player. What if only 1-2 players shift or just half the line?
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:47 pm to yadaddy
This will result in more flags and make games longer.
Does the clock stop on this penalty? Or does it reset immediately and continue running?
Does the clock stop on this penalty? Or does it reset immediately and continue running?
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:57 pm to jasonbr1975
It was said above, but Shifting is NOT a penalty. Flinching to try and draw an offensive lineman to jump is.
My issue is that if a QB does a hard count, and the NT flinches and doesn't go into the neutral zone is this now a penalty on the defense?
My issue is that if a QB does a hard count, and the NT flinches and doesn't go into the neutral zone is this now a penalty on the defense?
Posted on 7/16/25 at 4:57 pm to FlyingTiger06
quote:
So, is it your opinion the offense can't do hard counts either?
The difference is, if the defense flinches, it is not a penalty. It is only a defensive penalty if the defense crosses into the neutral zone(and ball snapped or they touch an OL). They are allowed to flinch.
The issue with the DL doing the sudden motions, whose only point is to draw a penalty, is that if an OL blinks heavy, it is a false start.
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