re: Bert Jones jersey to be retired

Long overdue… The Ruston Rifle was a great one !

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shite what about Faneca? Or Mawae too

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Both decent options. I don't know if you can argue that either are "more deserving" than Jones. But it's always going to be harder for o-linemen to get the recognition.

Faneca was a consensus all-American.

Mawae unfortunately only had 1 first team all-SEC and 2 second team. Don't think he meets the "national recognition" component.

Given that the nomination form gives no mention to post-LSU careers, while both Faneca and Mawae are in the NFL HoF, Big Ben Wilkerson is actually a better candidate than both as a consensus AA and Rimington award winner.

As I've said since they started this in earnest in 2009, LSU has lagged in this process as there are several no-brainers. While you can easily run the risk of over doing it, I think a retirement every 2 years to get those that are most deserving honored would be a decent pace.

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So the question is was Jones's career AT LSU (not in the NFL) rare and special relative to many players at LSU who just so happen to not play QB?

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He was a consensus all-American and Sporting News National Player of the Year. You can say LSU has a "lack of talented QBs" but he's one of 3 to earn the honor of 1st Team all-American and while the other two won the Heisman, Jones did finish in the top 5 of voting.

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Guys who were national award winners and multi time All American?

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The number of players at LSU that meet this criteria may be smaller than you think. Only 40 players have been consensus all-Americans and only 5 of them twice. 3 of the 5 have already received the honor of jersey retirement.

The inclusion of Bert Jones doesn't diminish the threshold any more than Jerry Stovall.

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So the question is was Jones's career AT LSU (not in the NFL) rare and special relative to many players at LSU who just so happen to not play QB? Guys who were national award winners and multi time All American? I think there is a basis for reasonable debate there because if so, you potentially run the risk of diluting what should be a very rare achievement/designation.

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This is an astute point to raise. My opinion is being LSU's first All-American quarterback and 4th in the Heisman race is notable and special for the significance of both accolades and that he's receiving this very special recognition serves to emphasize how important the quarterback position is relative to other positions in this sport, especially as it relates to this school's history.

That said, I do believe that due to those honors, the historic 1972 Ole Miss game, and probably his elite albeit short professional career, he became a slow-burner LSU football icon after the fact relative to when he wore the purple and gold, a folk hero after the fact. Unless I'm totally mistaken.

Compared to those whose numbers the flagship already retired

Billy Cannon - goes without saying, Heisman winner, the iconic Halloween game against Ole Miss, what he did to help us win the title in 1958, you don't really need to stretch to argue why his number is retired and never worn again

Jerry Stovall - probably should've won the Heisman in 1962, was the same level in terms of acclaim and athleticism as Cannon was in the 50s just they didn't win the natty during his time, truly elite 2-way player in the days of one-platoon football

Tommy Casanova - 2x consensus all-American for great Tiger teams, 3x first-team all-SEC all 3 years on the varsity, plus one of the great names of all-time, no argument here

Charles Alexander - set records for LSU at RB, won SEC POY, 2x All-American, he's a legend primarily due to what he did at LSU

So I get the argument for Bert having his number retired at the school as I do against and this is obviously nothing personal against him but I think it might largely be attributed to his heavily acclaimed short pro career that made him a Louisiana football icon moreso than his breakthrough senior year at LSU

Then again, he was named Sporting News POY for 72 so what do I know? Glad I don't make this decision to set precedents.

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My opinion is being LSU's first All-American quarterback and 4th in the Heisman race is notable and special for the significance of both accolades and that he's receiving this very special recognition serves to emphasize how important the quarterback position is relative to other positions in this sport, especially as it relates to this school's history.

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That's a reasonable opinion.

But in doing so does that mean Tommy Hodson should have his jersey retired too? No, he didn't have the one remarkable season like Jones. However, his overall LSU career is better than Jones's. Hodson is the LSU career leader in completions and passing yards. He second only to Burrow in career TD passes (for context, Jones has only one more in his career - 28- than Max Johnson had in one season - 27) and third only behind Burrow and Daniels in career YPG average. He won more games as a starting QB than anyone in LSU history. He led LSU to two SEC championships...its only two SEC championships between 1970 - 2001. Two more than Jones. 3x All SEC

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obviously nothing personal against him but I think it might largely be attributed to his heavily acclaimed short pro career that made him a Louisiana football icon moreso than his breakthrough senior year at LSU

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Which kind of creates a slippery slope because the list of guys LSU's careers comparable to Jones, if not much better, in terms of individual achievement over the course of a career starts to get someone long.

That's not to say Jones was a bad player. It just that if having your jersey retired is the highest honor an LSU player can achieve is Jones more worthy than many other great LSU players? That's a reasonable debate.

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maybe he won't be so bitter to LSU now

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I've seen him at games plenty of times over the years. IIRC he was also a color commentator on Tigervision when it was a thing.

Neither of these teams look like they could stay on the field against a modern college team, but Nebraska has two or three guys who look like they could compete in the modern era. LSU looks like a bunch of middle schoolers physically. TImes sure have changed.

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That's not to say Jones was a bad player. It just that if having your jersey retired is the highest honor an LSU player can achieve is Jones more worthy than many other great LSU players? That's a reasonable debate.

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Exactly, it is a reasonable debate and I think both sides can definitely be argued in good faith.

I wasn't around when he played for LSU and shined in that breakthrough season. I know of Bert Jones for having been the LSU quarterback, having been the LSU quarterback during that famous 1972 Ole Miss game, finishing 4th in the Heisman Trophy voting that year, and for his very elite short pro career - he's probably the greatest quarterback of all-time if you boiled it all into a very small window, maybe the most talented

I don't know how big a player Bert Jones was when he had that great 1972 season. In my opinion, I think his rise to LSU icon status and getting his number retired was more a slow burn speculatively enhanced by his elite short pro career and that legacy more than his LSU career. Obviously, I don't know the discussions that went on in deciding this.

That said, he is one of only 3 of our quarterbacks in program history to be a consensus first-team All-America, he finished 4th in the Heisman voting, and he was Sporting News POY. If you're a quarterback of a big-time college football team and you receive those accolades, that's top tier special elite level status. Those are big-time accolades. I'm personally a fan of his and glad he's a Tiger.

If I really had to make a decision, I would not say retiring his number dilutes this honor. He is very unique in our program's history, regardless of whether his pro career was factored into this decision, he's the Ruston Rifle, legendary player at both college and pro levels.

He deserves it.....

Awesome