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Started By
Message
Please help me figure out how my roux separated! (with pics)
Posted on 12/2/19 at 12:30 pm
Posted on 12/2/19 at 12:30 pm
Chefs of the F&DB, please help me figure out why my roux separated.
So this happened to me once a couple years ago and after looking stuff up, I thought it was caused by adding cold stock to a hot roux. I always used hot stock since and I've never had it happen again ...until this time.
After happening twice, I need to figure out why it occurred and figured there's no better place to do that than the F&D Board.
Roux: 1:1 Duck fat to flour
Made a dark roux
Added Veggies
Slowly added HOT stock while stirring. It looked like it was incorporating fine. Kept stirring, and as more stock was added, it started separating. I started having nightmare flashbacks from the first time this happened.
I spooned out some for a better look.
Then I tried using an immersion blender to see if that would work...it didn't. It just made it extremely gritty.
Luckily I only wasted a jar of duck fat, an hour of my time stirring, and some frozen trinity but I'm struggling to figure out how exactly this happened so it doesn't happen again.
I know there's the easy way to not deal with it again by "removing the roux from the pot, letting it cool, and adding it back to the pot like you would a jarred roux." That or just use jarred roux or dry roux made in an oven.
That's fine and all but doesn't answer the question of why it happened in the first place. Any help would be very much appreciated!
ETA:
Yes, frozen veggies were cooked for a while until they were hot and moisture was gone.
Yes.
One theory I have is that it's related to the type of fat used. The first time was with turkey fat and this time was with duck fat and both times were using the method above. I've had no issue with a turkey fat roux when I cool it down and add it to the stock later.
So this happened to me once a couple years ago and after looking stuff up, I thought it was caused by adding cold stock to a hot roux. I always used hot stock since and I've never had it happen again ...until this time.
After happening twice, I need to figure out why it occurred and figured there's no better place to do that than the F&D Board.
Roux: 1:1 Duck fat to flour
Made a dark roux
Added Veggies
Slowly added HOT stock while stirring. It looked like it was incorporating fine. Kept stirring, and as more stock was added, it started separating. I started having nightmare flashbacks from the first time this happened.
I spooned out some for a better look.
Then I tried using an immersion blender to see if that would work...it didn't. It just made it extremely gritty.
Luckily I only wasted a jar of duck fat, an hour of my time stirring, and some frozen trinity but I'm struggling to figure out how exactly this happened so it doesn't happen again.
I know there's the easy way to not deal with it again by "removing the roux from the pot, letting it cool, and adding it back to the pot like you would a jarred roux." That or just use jarred roux or dry roux made in an oven.
That's fine and all but doesn't answer the question of why it happened in the first place. Any help would be very much appreciated!
ETA:
quote:
You said frozen veggies, did you bring them back up to hot before adding stock?
Yes, frozen veggies were cooked for a while until they were hot and moisture was gone.
quote:
Did you try high heat rolling boil to see if it would re-incorporate?
Yes.
One theory I have is that it's related to the type of fat used. The first time was with turkey fat and this time was with duck fat and both times were using the method above. I've had no issue with a turkey fat roux when I cool it down and add it to the stock later.
This post was edited on 12/2/19 at 1:03 pm
19
Posted on 12/2/19 at 12:33 pm to NDA13112
You’re using too much oil
Posted on 12/2/19 at 12:36 pm to NDA13112
You said frozen veggies, did you bring them back up to hot before adding stock?
Posted on 12/2/19 at 12:51 pm to NDA13112
I have still never had this happen, and would never even know it was a thing if it were not for this board. I always use room temp stock too.
Posted on 12/2/19 at 12:51 pm to NDA13112
quote:
Slowly added HOT stock while stirring. It looked like it was incorporating fine. Kept stirring, and as more stock was added, it started separating.
Did you try high heat rolling boil to see if it would re-incorporate?
Posted on 12/2/19 at 1:15 pm to NDA13112
A friend recently had this happen and a chef friend of his said it was a result of having old flour. How old is the flour you used??
Posted on 12/2/19 at 2:26 pm to NDA13112
I’ve had this happen a few times but never to that degree. I did a seafood gumbo this Saturday for the game and while I was adding hot stock to the roux it separated a bit. But after letting it simmer with the lid off for 1-1.5 hours it incorporated again and everything worked out fine. Interesting about the flour though because I believe every time its separated was when I ran out of good flour and had to use this organic flour crap my wife buys.
Posted on 12/2/19 at 2:36 pm to NDA13112
I’m not sure if flour would be it or not. My wife has celiacs and I’ve had to switch over to gluten free flour and I have never had it separate even still.
Posted on 12/2/19 at 6:57 pm to NDA13112
How hot was your brother?
Too hot brother can lead to issues too.
Too hot brother can lead to issues too.
Posted on 12/2/19 at 7:09 pm to NDA13112
You touched yourself last night
Posted on 12/2/19 at 8:43 pm to NDA13112
Could be any number of factors...
Do you let your roux-veg mixture cool a bit before adding the stock? It doesn't need to be cold, just not so hot that the liquid sizzles when added in.
Buy some new flour and give it a try.
Add the hot liquid into the cooled roux in 2-3 cup increments, stirring each addition of liquid until it is completely incorporated before adding more liquid. Do this slowly while increasing the heat and stirring constantly.
As someone mentioned, sometimes simmering it for a couple of hours will fix a broken roux.
Do you let your roux-veg mixture cool a bit before adding the stock? It doesn't need to be cold, just not so hot that the liquid sizzles when added in.
Buy some new flour and give it a try.
Add the hot liquid into the cooled roux in 2-3 cup increments, stirring each addition of liquid until it is completely incorporated before adding more liquid. Do this slowly while increasing the heat and stirring constantly.
As someone mentioned, sometimes simmering it for a couple of hours will fix a broken roux.
Posted on 12/2/19 at 8:44 pm to NDA13112
It’s all about how you stir the roux! Do you make circles? Or do you go back and forth or up and down from bottom to top?
Posted on 12/3/19 at 6:08 am to NDA13112
quote:
Slowly added HOT stock while stirring
This!
Use room temperature stock.
Posted on 12/3/19 at 6:36 am to NDA13112
I googled and saw this:
quote:
10. To help prevent the roux from breaking or separating in your finished dish, make sure the roux and the liquid (water or stock) are at similar temperatures. Don't add cold roux to hot liquid or vice versa. Also, gradually add one to the other, whisking constantly between additions. Allow the roux to absorb the liquid from each addition by cooking it for about 20-30 seconds. If you're cooking on the fly and not from a recipe, make sure you have the proper ratio of roux to liquid, because too much liquid can also cause a roux to separate.
Posted on 12/3/19 at 6:56 am to NDA13112
This is from John Folse’ Encyclopedia of C&C Cuisine. It should help.
Posted on 12/3/19 at 7:45 am to NDA13112
Already mentioned a few times, but I'll reiterate the 'old flour' theory.
I've had a roux separate twice. Both times, I was using flour that I just managed to find on hand and knew it was fairly old. Have made sure to use fresh flour every time since, and have not had any problems; all other variables remained the same.
I've had a roux separate twice. Both times, I was using flour that I just managed to find on hand and knew it was fairly old. Have made sure to use fresh flour every time since, and have not had any problems; all other variables remained the same.
Posted on 12/3/19 at 8:27 am to NDA13112
It’s happened to me when I burned the roux ever so slightly trying to get it even darker.
Posted on 12/3/19 at 3:59 pm to NDA13112
question for OP: did you add any flour after you had already started to cook the roux?
Posted on 12/4/19 at 8:39 am to NDA13112
quote:
Please help me figure out how my roux separated!
Happened to me two times in a row a few years back. I linked it back to using self rising flour instead of just plain flour and never happened again. Maybe that was the reason or maybe that flour was old or bad or whatever but that's all I could figure is what happened.
Posted on 12/4/19 at 11:34 am to NDA13112
If the flour is saturated with water it will not absorb the oil and this separation will occur.
The flour can only absorb so much oil, which is why you have skim the oil from the top of the gumbo after its been simmering for a bit. The flour can only hold so much oil and released the rest into the gumbo. If some of the flour is saturated with water it will not absorb much oil, as the flour particles are already coated with water ('water wet') which naturally repels oil
The flour can only absorb so much oil, which is why you have skim the oil from the top of the gumbo after its been simmering for a bit. The flour can only hold so much oil and released the rest into the gumbo. If some of the flour is saturated with water it will not absorb much oil, as the flour particles are already coated with water ('water wet') which naturally repels oil
This post was edited on 12/4/19 at 11:47 am
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