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Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:01 am to FooManChoo
quote:
of those things result(ed) in fewer people drinking and doing drugs. That’s the nature of the law. Some people don’t want to break the law and risk being arrested so they don’t do what the law prohibits. When you make drugs and alcohol legal, more people will be willing to do those things, which is my point.
Prohibition may have deterred some, but it created the original organized crime syndicates. It effectively created a problem that we couldn't solve. Prior to prohibition, you just had small groups of hustlers who could be caught rather easily.
It was a failure, so much so that 20th Amendment had to be abolished.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:05 am to volod
quote:You have missed my point. Generally speaking, when you outlaw something, you will get less of that thing. When you legalize something, you will get more of that thing. If you want to talk about other consequences, go ahead. My point stands. I’m not concerned about an abortion mafia starting up.
Prohibition may have deterred some, but it created the original organized crime syndicates. It effectively created a problem that we couldn't solve. Prior to prohibition, you just had small groups of hustlers who could be caught rather easily.
It was a failure, so much so that 20th Amendment had to be abolished.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:08 am to Jack Bauers HnK
quote:
You know how one solution to illegal immigration is to heavily punish employers of illegals so they are not motivated to hire them? Make sure that mothers face the responsibility of raising their offspring and aren’t given a free escape via abortion and they will be motivated to prevent unwanted pregnancies.
I agree. But there's one difference. An employer can be sued and fired if they hire II. The mother will keep her kid PLUS whatever welfare benefits the federal government offer her. The state can kick and scream about it all day.
You have to go all out one way or the other.
-stop abortion, and be prepared for more welfare.
-stop abortion, and fix the welfare state to a manageable level.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:10 am to Muthsera
According to the Guttmacher Institute, about half of all women having abortions have had one previously. We could instantly reduce abortions by almost 50% just by making forced sterilization a requirement for getting an abortion. Libs can continue to act without regard for consequences and, conservatives can have fewer murdered babies on their conscience. Seems like a win-win.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:11 am to crazyatthecamp
quote:
So you are for abortion because it rids society of the lowest common denominator.
Ok.
Are you for or against a larger Welfare/Social Program State in this country?
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:13 am to Jake_LaMotta
It is insane. They have no real solutions to the problem. Their go to is everyone needs to follow the bible
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:18 am to Possumslayer
This post was edited on 5/15/19 at 8:19 am
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:20 am to Muthsera
quote:
So why not attack those root causes?
If that is your argument, why stop short? Why not just go whole hog and offer $1,000,000 cash to the mother on the day the child is born?
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:21 am to Possumslayer
quote:
Offer free voluntary sterilization.
I agree
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:25 am to FooManChoo
quote:
It used to be that the stigma was so great around unwed pregnancy that people would get married to avoid it. That was better for children and for the parents in different ways. That rarely happens anymore and abortion has replaced marriage in those situations.
Sin is the problem and more sin is not the solution.
Some form of social stigma is needed in our society. I see that frequently when I notice just how large the single motherhood rate is.
However, the old way of social stigma (forcing marriage) has arguably not made the problem any better. What you end up with is alot of unhappy marriages where spouses are bitter and normally some form degenerate behavior (cheating, alcoholism, etc.) takes place.
Coltaine on YouTube put it best in his series analyzing birth control, marriage, and social influences. People look at the pre 1970s as a golden age of marriage, but that's through rose-tinted glasses. In truth many of those marriages were a disaster.
And if social norms are the only thing keeping divorce from happening instead of love and commitment, then it wasn't better, just marketed well.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:26 am to Muthsera
quote:Points (3) and (4) might have some effect. The other two are just nanny state posturing.
If Alabama was actually serious about lowering abortions...
- Pass mandatory paid maternity and paternity leave
-Expand Medicaid so low income women feel confident in their ability to receive medical care
-Teach comprehensive sex ed in middle school and high school, educate students about Plan B and the morning after pill
-Allow and promote adoption by homosexual couples. Streamline the process and become the most adoption friendly state in the country.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:28 am to volod
You could also hold the fathers accountable for the kids they are producing. You must work to take care of your kids. If that means a “work camp” to pay for the welfare going to your kid and baby mama, then so be it.
Responsibility works two ways. Women are not getting themselves pregnant. You want to hold people accountable you hold both parties accountable. Stop giving women welfare and men an out by giving women welfare, and you might start seeing some changes.
Responsibility works two ways. Women are not getting themselves pregnant. You want to hold people accountable you hold both parties accountable. Stop giving women welfare and men an out by giving women welfare, and you might start seeing some changes.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:29 am to volod
quote:
In truth many of those marriages were a disaster.
Which also leaves us with in truth many of those marriages were wonderful.
I never get why progs phrase the way they do.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:43 am to gatorrocks
quote:
Hence the reason you want government intervention
Your feelings are understood. But as a conservative we should fight for the LEAST amount of government possible. This board is becoming Liberal-lite and not realizing it.
Think of it this way, banning abortion at the state level WILL NOT STOP WELFARE AT THE NATIONAL LEVEL. You're not going to see a decrease in the behaviors you dont like.
Honestly, I want states to ban abortion, keep a metric on how things have changed over 10 years, and then get back to us.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:48 am to AUCE05
quote:
They have no real solutions to the problem. Their go to is everyone needs to follow the bible
I’d guess most of the people’s goal with regards to this legislation is fewer babies killed.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:49 am to roadGator
quote:
Which also leaves us with in truth many of those marriages were wonderful.
It wasnt a mutually exclusive statement. I'm sure some people learned to love each other. I guess it boils down this:
Is it worth risking keeping two people together just because they had a kid and may not legitimately love each other?
There isnt really a right or wrong answer to this. Even with kids, you still have to assume that the two people will at least do right by them.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:53 am to Muthsera
quote:
If Alabama was actually serious about lowering abortions
Like all Republicans, they're not. But their religion demands they ban the medical procedure.
Posted on 5/15/19 at 8:53 am to Muthsera
They could just stop giving welfare out to lazy people that don’t want to work . Maybe if they work then they wouldn’t have so much time to make babies to kill .
Posted on 5/15/19 at 9:23 am to Muthsera
quote:
As I said to another poster, show me one time in history when puritanical legislation prevented people from having sex.
I’m not talking about any legislation to prevent sex. I am talking about personal responsibility and dealing with the consequences of one’s own actions.
Obviously rape, incest, health/life of mother are exceptions to that.
This post was edited on 5/15/19 at 9:25 am
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