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re: We need to have a discussion about the militarization of police
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:36 am to CaptSpaulding
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:36 am to CaptSpaulding
quote:
See, the thing is, these things always start out with people making points like this, and always circle back around to people acknowledging the need for police (even a heavy police presence like that picture in certain situations). A lot of people in Birmingham would have liked to see one of those rolling in about midnight last night.
Only because we’ve made it virtually illegal to defend your own property with force and those people are law abiding. Let people shoot motherfrickers destroying or taking their shite and no need for cops in tanks
1
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:36 am to The Maj
quote:
anything, these riots actually justify the militarization of the police
True
The real complaint in terms of militarization you should focus on day to day tactics used by the police
But situations like what's going on right now are pretty much the definition of why they need some military type capabilities in certain situations
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:37 am to anc
It’s a defensive people carrier that the average person can buy. What’s wrong with that?
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:37 am to NineLineBind
Every state should be deploying pepper spray, tear gas, rubber bullets, and fire hoses the minute that the protesters get unruly. It is like these fricktards forgot how effective those measures are at dispersing a crowd.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:39 am to anc
Citizens should be able to own whatever types of weapons the 'civilian' police own.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:39 am to anc
I agree but have a down vote for triggering me with the “we need to have a discussion” phrase
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:41 am to Beessnax
Our Police Forces are inept.
If you don't think that ANTIFA hasn't studied the tactics of the Police ...you watch too much TV and have no idea what you are seeing.
There is a serious lack of Police on rooftops or overhead to provide information to the ground. Even battle field commanders know they need overhead views of what is taking place.
Our Police stand in a straight line, behind pretend barricades and focus all of their attention on keeping the bad guys on the other side of the line. Nothing more. One military tactic that should be used is divide and conquer.
Watching Philadelphia a few nights ago ...The only commendation to the cops ...Apparently the questions in their application is "Did you ever play dodge ball in school?" "Good, hired" Front white line hands up.....back thugs throwing bricks and rocks ....Custer lost his command watching arrows rain down from above. The Spartans fought in the shade.
It's easy to stage a few dozen cops from behind the protestors and start to close ranks. But it requires military tactics ...not stand and watch.
If you don't think that ANTIFA hasn't studied the tactics of the Police ...you watch too much TV and have no idea what you are seeing.
There is a serious lack of Police on rooftops or overhead to provide information to the ground. Even battle field commanders know they need overhead views of what is taking place.
Our Police stand in a straight line, behind pretend barricades and focus all of their attention on keeping the bad guys on the other side of the line. Nothing more. One military tactic that should be used is divide and conquer.
Watching Philadelphia a few nights ago ...The only commendation to the cops ...Apparently the questions in their application is "Did you ever play dodge ball in school?" "Good, hired" Front white line hands up.....back thugs throwing bricks and rocks ....Custer lost his command watching arrows rain down from above. The Spartans fought in the shade.
It's easy to stage a few dozen cops from behind the protestors and start to close ranks. But it requires military tactics ...not stand and watch.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:44 am to anc
A war zone where innocent people are being beaten, and business destroyed...looted
Requires "a stiff response" to anyone not being peaceful.
I still can't believe the amount of restraint we're seeing
Requires "a stiff response" to anyone not being peaceful.
I still can't believe the amount of restraint we're seeing
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:44 am to Dawgfanman
quote:
Only because we’ve made it virtually illegal to defend your own property with force and those people are law abiding. Let people shoot motherfrickers destroying or taking their shite and no need for cops in tanks
If I’m a business owner, and I get on twitter and see my business being looted by a mob in the middle of the night, I’m not grabbing my gun and rushing down there. My taxes pay for cops, and I expect them to handle it.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:44 am to anc
SO you expect the police to be made up of Barney Fifes walking around out there with a single bullet in their front pocket after what has been on display?
Go sign up and do a couple of ride alongs with one of the bigger cities on just regular weekend nights and report back your findings.
Go sign up and do a couple of ride alongs with one of the bigger cities on just regular weekend nights and report back your findings.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:44 am to anc
I don’t have a problem with much of the equipment they have that is typically complained about by some posters. The rub comes in how it is misused at times. Like shielding those two Bubba Roys going to raid a Texas jujke joint for COVID violations .
This post was edited on 6/1/20 at 8:54 am
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:45 am to Moustache
quote:
Hell, why do you think the white people all love with a 45-55 minute commute these days in major cities like LA and Atlanta?
A lot more white people live within the Atlanta city limits then they did 30 years ago, and a lot of black people have headed to the burbs here as well.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:45 am to The Maj
quote:
If anything, these riots actually justify the militarization of the police...
quote:
I support law enforcement, but we as a society should demand a higher bar for entry into the profession. Too many roided out billy badasses making it in there.
Two different discussions here...
Not really whenever SWAT teams are used to serve warrants on a daily basis.
quote:
SWAT team use has spiked from around 3,000 strikes per year in 1980 to as many as 80,000 raids a year now. A battering ram or other forced-entry device is used in two-thirds of these raids, nearly 80 percent of which target private homes like Cady's. The great bulk of SWAT raids are in service of the drug war, though nearly four out of 10 find no contraband at all.
From this article which got its numbers from a Washington Post article that's behind a paywall.
They are connected. Just because you actually need the heavy vehicles and tactics now doesn't mean it's a good thing to have that mentality for every police activity.
Look at all the small towns that have an armored vehicle.
No-knock warrants aren't good.
The number of war veterans that end up going to the police could be an issue as well, when it comes to tactics and issues dealing with threats and stress.
This is an issue that has nothing to do with race. It's a problem all citizens in this country should be concerned about.
What's the saying? "If you're a hammer, everything looks like a nail."
This post was edited on 6/1/20 at 9:00 am
Posted on 6/1/20 at 8:50 am to anc
OP is obviously a snowflake. Get back on your moped and head west to Cali soi boi.
Stop attacking our police.
Stop attacking our police.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:15 am to Sasquatch Smash
quote:
The number of war veterans that end up going to the police could be an issue as well, when it comes to tactics and issues dealing with threats and stress.
I’ve seen this sentiment a lot lately on here about that it’s bad that veterans become cops and I fail to see how it’s an issue. To me it plays into the “crazy veteran” narrative that’s become so prevalent in our country since Vietnam. In my platoon in the Marine Corps 5 of the guys I served with became cops or state troopers and they’re all good honorable guys who were outstanding Marines. Wouldn’t you want people serving in law enforcement that have some concept of discipline, both physical and emotional that you learn in the military? I’d rather a cop who was a vet that has really had serious life experience than some 21 year old kid who still lives at home and his only life experience is going to college.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:46 am to ChanceOfRainIsNever
quote:
ve seen this sentiment a lot lately on here about that it’s bad that veterans become cops and I fail to see how it’s an issue. To me it plays into the “crazy veteran” narrative that’s become so prevalent in our country since Vietnam. In my platoon in the Marine Corps 5 of the guys I served with became cops or state troopers and they’re all good honorable guys who were outstanding Marines. Wouldn’t you want people serving in law enforcement that have some concept of discipline, both physical and emotional that you learn in the military? I’d rather a cop who was a vet that has really had serious life experience than some 21 year old kid who still lives at home and his only life experience is going to college.
I did say COULD BE, not will be or always is. It's not about military discipline, it's about realizing you're policing American citizens and not potential insurgents or militants on foreign soil, where they are not nearly as likely to face small arms fire or bombs.
Are they disciplined enough to face a "normal" interaction with a citizen as something other than an interaction they might have had in a combat area?
Vets absolutely need jobs and likely do well in the police force, with an easy conversion. Just a thing to consider when discussing the militarization of police at all levels.
Military equipment with military minds could result in issues.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:24 am to anc
We are going to have to address what the war on drugs has done to what we ask of law enforcement in this country. We should be ashamed of ourselves as a nation for placing policemen in the position they are in. We do not provide the tools and the support they need to do their job....and then ask them to wage a war against civilians. I wouldn't do the job for any amount of money.
They don't need APCs and tactical gear....they need training, they need to paid enough to attract qualified candidates and they need to be screened before hiring to make certain, as much as possible, that they do not suffer from irrational fears that would lead them to kneel on a mans neck until he is dead. If they had the support WE owe them they would not protect the bad apples among them because doing so only makes their job infinitely harder...who wants to be in the streets fighting a mob???? No one who is sane. But we hire them and forget about them unless they frick up....and so the only people they can rely on are other cops...and that includes the bad ones who they would readily rid of their midst if they had any option.
They don't need APCs and tactical gear....they need training, they need to paid enough to attract qualified candidates and they need to be screened before hiring to make certain, as much as possible, that they do not suffer from irrational fears that would lead them to kneel on a mans neck until he is dead. If they had the support WE owe them they would not protect the bad apples among them because doing so only makes their job infinitely harder...who wants to be in the streets fighting a mob???? No one who is sane. But we hire them and forget about them unless they frick up....and so the only people they can rely on are other cops...and that includes the bad ones who they would readily rid of their midst if they had any option.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:32 am to anc
Radley Balko has a great book on this.
Civil asset forfeiture and the war on drugs are the financiers of this madness.
Civil asset forfeiture and the war on drugs are the financiers of this madness.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:33 am to anc
Many people are calling on Trump to use military intervention 
What type of equipment to you think they will be using to roll into your town?
What type of equipment to you think they will be using to roll into your town?
This post was edited on 6/1/20 at 11:35 am
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:35 am to saints5021
quote:
Every state should be deploying pepper spray, tear gas, rubber bullets, and fire hoses the minute that the protesters get unruly. It is like these fricktards forgot how effective those measures are at dispersing a crowd.
They pretty much are and have... but now you have the "oh shite, I lost my eye to a rubber bullet" narrative, and the "mean old cops shot me with hot pepper balls" narrative, and the "tear gas makes people cough and spread covid-19" narrative...
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