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re: Voddie Baucham explains the looming catastrophe of CRT in the church
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:10 pm to pawpoints19
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:10 pm to pawpoints19
quote:
complex scholarly legal theory
0
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:10 pm to Mike da Tigah
CRT will destroy every institution that accepts it.
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:10 pm to the808bass
He started here in late June. He began life here in the general milley crt thread.
This is a DU plant.
This is a DU plant.
This post was edited on 7/7/21 at 12:17 pm
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:10 pm to pawpoints19
quote:
Which CRT scholar says this?
Choose your fighter, really
But for example, LSU's new president has co-authored an article where he attempts to build on the concept that race is the central and controlling factor in matters of inequality.
quote:
This goes back to the good samaritan example. You as a christian have the obligation to help irrelevant to your role in why that person is on the side of the road. How does this conflict with your understanding (in my opinion misplaced) of CRT?
First, my obligation comes from Christ's teachings. It has nothing to do with my sociopolitical status as a white person needing to atone for whiteness, which is what CRT instructs. And very little if anything in CRT has anything to do with white people helping a person on the side of the road or some other humanitarian/charitable endeavor. To the contrary, that is a liberalistic view of race and charity and particularly under attack by/at odds with CRT, which teaches that white efforts in this regard have always been part of a larger effort to help themselves (Delgado and Stefancic).
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:13 pm to pawpoints19
quote:
They have explicity stated that they aren't CRT scholars. You are doing exactly what Rufo set out to do by lumping them all together.
i'm not an ordained, degreed minister, but i still tell people about Jesus.
quote:
I do have a problem with them being told they’re responsible and culpable today for legitimate problems facing the black community,
That's not what CRT teaches.
CRT specifically puts all people into oppressor and oppressive camps. Race Theory is the viewing of laws, politics, etc. specifically through a lens of race. You're acting like that's a jump. If you had said "anti-racism doesn't teach that, CRT does." i'd buy it as a fair argument.
I don't think all CRT or anti-racist ideas are bad. far far from it. there's legitimate critiques of society and what's happened since slavery was introduced, ended, and jim crow was founded and ended as well that can be valuable. far too many people throw the baby out with the bath water on these issues.
CRT and Anti-racism both find salvation/redemption in something outside of Jesus at the end of the day, so i just can't endorse them being taught from the pulpit, same as conservative or liberal ideas.
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:14 pm to pawpoints19
quote:
And yet no one can tell me how that changes what I will be hearing in the pews on Sunday that will go counter to the gospel. Cans someone give me a concrete example?
In short, Ephesians 2 explains that we have been reconciled to God and one another. We are one body in Christ. He has destroyed the enmity that separated us. CRT preaches that we are not reconciled to God or one another because of the sin of racism. The blood of Christ did not conquer this sin and forgiveness if possible at all can only be attained via political and social justice means. In CRT, Christ and the gospel are no longer sufficient.
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:17 pm to pawpoints19
quote:
They have explicity stated that they aren't CRT scholars. You are doing exactly what Rufo set out to do by lumping them all together.
Yeah shame on Rufo for using Kendi's own words against him
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:19 pm to the808bass
quote:
Lol. You’re not smart enough for what you’re trying to pull off.
Kendi explicitly says he's inspired by CRT but isn't a CRT scholar. I don't get how that's a difficult concept.
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:20 pm to pawpoints19
quote:
pawpoints19
Go away. Take that huckster, Kendi, with you too.
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:21 pm to pawpoints19
That’s a distinction without a difference.
If I’m inspired by Adam Smith’s economic theories and I subscribe to them, it doesn’t matter if I self-label myself as a capitalist.
If I’m inspired by Adam Smith’s economic theories and I subscribe to them, it doesn’t matter if I self-label myself as a capitalist.
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:22 pm to pawpoints19
quote:
Kendi explicitly says he's inspired by CRT but isn't a CRT scholar. I don't get how that's a difficult concept.
I'm really interested in how this distinction, which arises from banal talking points you've heard about distinguishing CRT origins (Bell, Crenshaw etc.) from CRT in practice (Kendi, Diangelo, etc.) relates to your original query about CRT themes in churches?
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:23 pm to pawpoints19
quote:
And yet no one can tell me how that changes what I will be hearing in the pews on Sunday that will go counter to the gospel. Cans someone give me a concrete example?
Technically, we are admonished in Ephesians 3 by Paul that, in Christ, there is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, etc. Seminaries should be teaching the pre-eminence of the relationship of the believer to Christ rather than identarian politics.
Besides, white people and white culture don't owe American blacks a thing. It is preposterous for the Church to look at the current state of the black community and claim that whites have something for which to atone. I'm not going to go into all of the data or anything, but suffice it to say the number one message needed for Black America is "repent."
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:24 pm to pawpoints19
Why did Kendi say “my critical race theory” then?
Who do you believe you are fooling here?
Who do you believe you are fooling here?
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:24 pm to 3nOut
quote:
I don't think all CRT or anti-racist ideas are bad. far far from it. there's legitimate critiques of society and what's happened since slavery was introduced, ended, and jim crow was founded and ended as well that can be valuable. far too many people throw the baby out with the bath water on these issues.
CRT and Anti-racism both find salvation/redemption in something outside of Jesus at the end of the day, so i just can't endorse them being taught from the pulpit, same as conservative or liberal ideas.
I think this is a very fair context to view it from. Yes, ideally pulpits shouldn't have "conservative" or "liberal" ideas, but we live in the time and place where it happens so the question then becomes what to do about it.
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:28 pm to roadGator
quote:
Why did Kendi say “my critical race theory” then?
His interpretation of CRT.
I'm not saying they aren't in anyway connected that would be silly. An analogy would be that neuroscience is CRT and a pediatrician is Kendi/antiracism.
They are 2 separate fields of study but in the end they are related and connected.
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:28 pm to pawpoints19
quote:
about a complex scholarly legal theory
CRT is not any more complex or scholarly than flat earth theory.
Both are completely made up and fly directly in the face of objective truth.
This post was edited on 7/7/21 at 12:29 pm
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:30 pm to pawpoints19
3NOut is wrong.
There’s nothing to be gained for the Christian from CRT. One could dump it on the ash heap of civilization and move on to more productive efforts in life without missing a beat.
It’s a garbage theory built on an explicitly Marxist foundation. And that Marxist foundation is explicitly anti-church and anti-Christ. And that Marxist foundation is responsible for death and destruction everywhere it has taken root.
There’s nothing to be gained for the Christian from CRT. One could dump it on the ash heap of civilization and move on to more productive efforts in life without missing a beat.
It’s a garbage theory built on an explicitly Marxist foundation. And that Marxist foundation is explicitly anti-church and anti-Christ. And that Marxist foundation is responsible for death and destruction everywhere it has taken root.
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:30 pm to HabaneroBuck
quote:
Besides, white people and white culture don't owe American blacks a thing. It is preposterous for the Church to look at the current state of the black community and claim that whites have something for which to atone.
as a conservative and mostly reformed guy i'm going to fall on the other side of that one.
while white PEOPLE don't owe black Americans a thing, the church regardless of color does have an edict to try and love those amongst us that have had a harder run of things.
which does lead to...
quote:
the number one message needed for Black America is "repent."
to this i have no argument against as long as we have fingers pointing back at our own communities for our shortcomings of glorifying Christ.
far too many ministries are worried about social justice and not enough about Biblical justice. They'll do all the things in the world to help worldly needs (not saying that's bad,) but if repenting and coming to know Christ is not the end goal, then it's in vain.
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:31 pm to pawpoints19
quote:
They are 2 separate fields of study but in the end they are related and connected.
They are not fields of study. Theosophy is more a more substantive and serious field of study than CRT and anti-racism.
Posted on 7/7/21 at 12:32 pm to Mo Jeaux
I’m gonna get a Masters in Alchemy.
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