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3
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:30 pm to John Barron
Trump- zelensky started the war where Russia invaded Ukraine and shouldnt expect out support
Maga following- the US deep state started the war by installing our puppet, and they shouldn't expect our help for a war they started..
Reality- Russia started the Ukrainian war and doesn't believe in Ukrainian sovereignty.
Maga following- the US deep state started the war by installing our puppet, and they shouldn't expect our help for a war they started..
Reality- Russia started the Ukrainian war and doesn't believe in Ukrainian sovereignty.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:32 pm to John Barron
stupid comment by Trump.
If only the Soviet Union hadn't dissolved - so actually it's Reagan's fault for setting the table. These former SSRs have been nothing but trouble - except those who prefer vassal status and understand their true place in the world.
If only the Soviet Union hadn't dissolved - so actually it's Reagan's fault for setting the table. These former SSRs have been nothing but trouble - except those who prefer vassal status and understand their true place in the world.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:32 pm to NawlinsTiger9
"yeah Russia invaded but look what Ukraine was wearing. They asked for it"
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:34 pm to Mason Dixon Swine
quote:
"yeah Russia invaded but look what Ukraine was wearing. They asked for it"
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:34 pm to John Barron
Lots of people here caught up in the "start a war" language.
I think Trump's point stands 100% even if Russia "started the war". There was an opportunity for this not to escalate into the conflict that it did. Trump was all over the issue way back then. It should have been handled diplomatically with the assistance of the international community then.
Instead, Zelensky chose to fight and did so with the reality that it could only do so with the assistance from the United States (or others). And, there was no guarantee that was going to occur perpetually.
Zelensky isn't completely at fault. The Biden administration definitely deserves a lot of the blame. Boris Johnson and the UK played a large part in escalating the situation as I'm sure the rest of the EU backed.
I think Trump's point stands 100% even if Russia "started the war". There was an opportunity for this not to escalate into the conflict that it did. Trump was all over the issue way back then. It should have been handled diplomatically with the assistance of the international community then.
Instead, Zelensky chose to fight and did so with the reality that it could only do so with the assistance from the United States (or others). And, there was no guarantee that was going to occur perpetually.
Zelensky isn't completely at fault. The Biden administration definitely deserves a lot of the blame. Boris Johnson and the UK played a large part in escalating the situation as I'm sure the rest of the EU backed.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:36 pm to SirWinston
I get along with SFP on most issues, but can't stand him on Ukraine. The one point I will give him -- and I disagree with most people on this board -- we didn't install Z at first. If you watch the Oliver Stone movies, I seem to remember the second one ends very hopeful as Z ran on peace to get elected. The problem is that the neo-nazi douchebags and State Dept got to him, so he went along with them so as not to be killed or something.
Merkel and Hollande have admitted the Minsk II agreements were basically a scam to build up Ukraine's forces. So, that's yet another piece of how this conflict was provoked.
Loading Twitter/X Embed...
If tweet fails to load, click here. Merkel and Hollande have admitted the Minsk II agreements were basically a scam to build up Ukraine's forces. So, that's yet another piece of how this conflict was provoked.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:37 pm to oklahogjr
By these comments, Trump is giving up any leverage he has with Russia to get some sort of ceasefire..
Never read his books but does he address being a 3rd party or negotiator in "Art of the Deal"? He certainly isn't doing it well in this instance. What works when he is one of 2 parties may not work as a 3rd.
Disappointing and frustrating to hear him to support Putin's position. Ukraine doesn't have the strongest negotiating position but Trump has been undermining what they do have with these statements.
Never read his books but does he address being a 3rd party or negotiator in "Art of the Deal"? He certainly isn't doing it well in this instance. What works when he is one of 2 parties may not work as a 3rd.
Disappointing and frustrating to hear him to support Putin's position. Ukraine doesn't have the strongest negotiating position but Trump has been undermining what they do have with these statements.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:39 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Why would they need to replace their purported puppet?
Because he was turned by Russia.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:46 pm to NawlinsTiger9
quote:Of course it's relevant.
Irrelevant
If you insulted my sister, and I warned you not to do it again or there would be corporal consequences, then when you repeated the insult and woke up in the hospital you'd know why. You might be able to press charges, but you'd know you brought the situation on yourself. Whether you "started it" might be open to question, but whether you could have avoided it would not be.
This post was edited on 4/14/25 at 1:47 pm
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:48 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
Could Ukraine have avoided the war?
Your implication that not actively avoided the war is tantamount to starting it is baloney. It’s mental gymnastics to avoid admitting Trump is lying on this one.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:48 pm to notsince98
quote:
when he killed ethnic russians
Another load of bullshite.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:50 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Why would they need to replace their purported puppet?
Why did they need to replace HW with Clinton?
Why was Trudeau replaced with Carney?
Do you think all deep state leaders serve until death? What a silly argument.
This post was edited on 4/14/25 at 1:51 pm
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:52 pm to Mason Dixon Swine
quote:
Did zelensky move those tanks across the border?
Nope but the USA and Soro's ilk did.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:52 pm to NawlinsTiger9
Are you finally catching up?
We live in a world where facts don't matter and we have been for quite a while.
Trump had Russian hookers pee on him.
Brett kavanaugh was a rapist.
The vaccine stopped the spread of COVID.
Kyle Rittenhouse killed a bunch of black protesters.
Climate change models can predict the future.
Biden was mentally competent to be president.
And on and on.
We live in a world where facts don't matter and we have been for quite a while.
Trump had Russian hookers pee on him.
Brett kavanaugh was a rapist.
The vaccine stopped the spread of COVID.
Kyle Rittenhouse killed a bunch of black protesters.
Climate change models can predict the future.
Biden was mentally competent to be president.
And on and on.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:54 pm to NawlinsTiger9
quote:
Irrelevant
Question is who started the war, as in who invaded
Things aren't as simple as you want them to be. Russia invaded. That's true. If that's the depth of your analysis, then obviously you will reach one conclusion.
Of course, that line of thought resulted in hundreds of thousands dead (at minimum), the evacuation of millions, and the destruction of large parts of the country.
It was avoidable. But, people like you who have zero to personally lose didn't see the value.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:54 pm to Penrod
Before the war as I remember Ukraine was bombing areas east near the border with Russia where Ukrainian ethnic Russians were operating. Who was doing what to who and why I don't know
.
.
Posted on 4/14/25 at 1:55 pm to John Barron
So the new alternate reality for MAGA
acolytes is that Ukraine started the war?
That is Alice through the Looking Class
craziness…
acolytes is that Ukraine started the war?
That is Alice through the Looking Class
craziness…
Posted on 4/14/25 at 2:02 pm to moneyg
quote:
Lots of people here caught up in the "start a war" language.
It’s worse than that. The “start a war” comment was a throwaway hypothetical.
I swear people didn’t read what he actually said.
The actual contention Trump made is that Ukraine and the Biden administration could have prevented it and didn’t.
Furthermore, he explicitly stated that Putin started the war: “that’s a war that should never have been allowed to start. Biden could have stopped it and Zelenskyy could have stopped it and Putin should never have started it.”
Posted on 4/14/25 at 2:07 pm to SlowFlowPro
Because the Deep State never trades up and trades out. This never happens.
I'm sure this point is irrelevant though.
I'm sure this point is irrelevant though.
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