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re: Wisconsin Hospital Replaces All Anesthesiologists with CRNAs
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:11 pm to greenwave
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:11 pm to greenwave
quote:
Yeah idk you seem to be fear mongering. Like I have a heart attack and then will be sent to NP Tonya for diagnosis cause there are no more cardiologists? Is your practicing state independent?
I mean I sure hope that's not that case and NPs don't want that either
Not trying to fear monger, but the prospect of unqualified practitioners treating your family should concern you. It certainly concerns me.
My personal version of hell is when the unsupervised primary care NP consults the endocrine NP for management of diabetes and the cardiology NP for management of high blood pressure. But it’s already happening in independent practice states. Again, it’s going before the legislature soon in LA and will probably pass, knowing our state.
2
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:12 pm to greenwave
quote:
Lol and you are degrading CRNAs as a whole because of a few
if you think im degrading cRNAs at all you haven't read anything I posted or are just reacting emotionally. cRNAs are valuable, skilled, are very beneficial to have around and I respect the work. Doesn't change the fact a cRNA isn't qualified, nor legally able to use the title anesthesiologist. there is nothing wrong with that, unless they start misrepresenting themselves as such.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:14 pm to AMS
quote:
ats not a boom. despite nurse lobbying, data shows that midlevels do not flock to rural areas to underserved areas which was the main argument for their gaining independence. this is propaganda, not boom
I don’t disagree with them not flocking there. Just sad to see you types shite on “mid levels”
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:17 pm to cwil177
Lol so you really haven’t experienced this first hand
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:21 pm to AMS
quote:
Doesn't change the fact a cRNA isn't qualified, nor legally able to use the title anesthesiologist. there is nothing wrong with that, unless they start misrepresenting themselves as such
Lol again, majority do not.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:21 pm to greenwave
Yalls head would pop off if you saw the case I did today where the anesthesiologist was only present for 5 mins to place an iv. I induced and put in the aline.
I’m not saying I don’t need a doc. I left an independent practice bc the pay was shite for what I was responsible for. I like the act I practice in.
I’m not saying I don’t need a doc. I left an independent practice bc the pay was shite for what I was responsible for. I like the act I practice in.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:22 pm to cwil177
quote:
Not trying to fear monger, but the prospect of unqualified practitioners treating your family should concern you. It certainly concerns me.
This may apply to some NP’s who come out of substandard programs. I am not going to deny that I have some of these same concerns but to put this label on a CRNA, especially after the training I know I went through, this is where you lose the argument for me. We are well trained and board certified to practice within the full scope of our training and not having a physician anesthesiologist at a facility doesn’t necessarily make the care substandard. You might think it is but you don’t know anything about the CRNA’s that work at the facility.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:23 pm to Dragula
quote:
Physicians can only blame themselves.
The older generation sold us out. The newer generation is trying to right the ship and protect patients, and frankly the future of healthcare in this country.
quote:
Difficult to persuade medical students to venture into primary care anymore, thus the massive shortage and NPs are filling in the gaps.
That’s fine, but I still think care needs to be led by a physician with direct supervision. However, independent states like Oregon are seeing only 25% of all NPs going into primary care, despite the AANP claiming 75% as the norm. Workforce data shows NPs and MDs both prefer to work in the same areas. And the data out of Oregon, one of the states that has had independent practice the longest, shows they aren’t really going rural.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:25 pm to Success
quote:
Docs are worried about their bottom line too. That’s why rural care suffers. Not saying you don’t deserve x salary. But you drove yourself out of those areas on purpose. Now crnas and nps serve these areas and the pts couldn’t be happier or know the difference.
Rural MD here in a private office. If I didn’t fix a lot of frick ups from a handful of bad rural NPs that are undersupervised on a weekly basis, I may agree with you. This just isn’t my experience at all.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:26 pm to greenwave
quote:
I don’t disagree with them not flocking there. Just sad to see you types shite on “mid levels”
Brah, we've had people shite on MDs, DOs, NPs, and CRNAs. And the term mid-level provider was how they were known for many years. It isn't a pejorative term.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:28 pm to greenwave
quote:
I don’t disagree with them not flocking there. Just sad to see you types shite on “mid levels”
this is the problem. Even when 'us types' acknowledge Midlevels are valuable assets to medical care, they get offended if you discuss facts about the important distinctions and differences in training and qualification.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:28 pm to coondaddy21
quote:We need more people like you in this thread who can give some insight into these issues as a patient. Thanks for chiming in. Optometrists are also trying to increase their scope to include surgery. They didn’t go to medical school and they didn’t complete a residency. It’s dangerous. Vision is important.
I have agreed with pretty much everything you've said. My only experience with the medical field is that I'm 45 and have lived long enough to know that if I've got seasonal allergies that have hung around long enough to get a secondary infection then going to the local NP or DO to get a shot is fine. I can tell them what the problem is and what i need. FOR ALL OTHER ISSUES I'm going to an MD. I wouldn't trust the NP or DO to correctly identify a rash. Heck they're 0 for 1 on recognizing shingles on my back. So if I have an issue that requires any type of diagnosis I'm going to an MD. I'm fine with waiting a little longer. That goes for my eyes too. My (now former) optometrist missed a retina tear. If my wife hadn't insisted I go see an ophthalmologist the same day I'd likely be blind in one eye.
quote:
am not sure why someone would want to pay 500k to someone, when the job can be done equally as safe for 200k
This is just disingenuous because I’ve already presented published studies in this thread about how CRNAs do worse when shite hits the fan and have worse dispositions post surgery.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:29 pm to greenwave
quote:You show up to an urgent care and that is exactly what will happen. Not all heart attacks are the classic elephant sitting in chest, sweats, left arm pain, etc.
Like I have a heart attack and then will be sent to NP Tonya for diagnosis
Unless you have the sniffles or an earache, going to an NP is stupid. If your MD only lets you see their NP or PA, switch doctors because they are frickheads.
This post was edited on 4/7/21 at 5:36 pm
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:30 pm to greenwave
quote:
Lol again, majority do not.
lol again?
the fact is enough do that a state supreme court got involved. Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:31 pm to cwil177
How come we don’t see patients dying at lallie kemp and ochsner st anne all the time? Not an anesthesiologist in sight.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:31 pm to coondaddy21
quote:
This may apply to some NP’s who come out of substandard programs. I am not going to deny that I have some of these same concerns but to put this label on a CRNA, especially after the training I know I went through, this is where you lose the argument for me. We are well trained and board certified to practice within the full scope of our training and not having a physician anesthesiologist at a facility doesn’t necessarily make the care substandard. You might think it is but you don’t know anything about the CRNA’s that work at the facility.
By the time I get out of medical school, I will have 10x the clinical hours and a more rigorous education than an NP. When do you think I should be able to practice with the same degree of independence as an NP? An anesthesiologist after residency might have upwards of 10,000 clinical hours. What should be the effective difference between a CRNA and a anesthesiologist?
The clinical hours alone isn't a great argument, and I personally think we should more rigorously control and reorganize medical education in this country, as there is a lot of overlap due to peculiar American professional traditions, so that the responsibilities and purview are clear for everyone.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:32 pm to AMS
Ah so one state and one case. Yeah we have a nationwide problem of CRNAs saying they are physicians. Give me a break
And I’m against this NP independent care BS.
And I’m against this NP independent care BS.
This post was edited on 4/7/21 at 5:33 pm
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:33 pm to coondaddy21
quote:Because you are paying for the real expertise in those 5 of 6 cases per year where the shite hits the fan and the potential malpractice payout is a few million or more when the nurse doesn't know what to do.
You’re right! I am not sure why someone would want to pay 500k to someone, when the job can be done equally as safe for 200k. Especially when the one making 500k isn’t even doing the anesthetic.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:34 pm to cwil177
quote:
We need more people like you in this thread who can give some insight into these issues as a patient.
This guy equated an NP with a DO, which makes me feel terrible for my friends who happened to have one small thing wrong with their application and went to DO schools and might get stigmatized for inane reasons. The only place I seem to hear any anti-DO stuff is this board in particular. It's weird as hell, and no one has been able to explain it clearly for me.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 5:34 pm to Jake88
quote:
real expertise in those 5 of 6 cases per year
Y’all really do live in a dream world.
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