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Started By
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US steel industry YT rabbit hole
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:21 pm
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:21 pm
So watched a YT on the Indiana Bethlehem steel plant and it took me down the rabbit hole, including reading lots of comments.
It is a shame what happened to the steel industry here in America and to those impressive mills.
One interesting point, or sad really, is that the vast majority of the mills were bought by the Chinese who dismantled them and shipped then to China.
Any one have experience with the mills or insight on the industry in general. From what I gathered is that most mills were pre WW2 or built during WW2. Cheap imports cut margins and upgrades couldn't be afforded, industry went to the government for low interest loans to do upgrades and got the cold shoulder. It was the death nail for the industry in the US.
It is a shame what happened to the steel industry here in America and to those impressive mills.
One interesting point, or sad really, is that the vast majority of the mills were bought by the Chinese who dismantled them and shipped then to China.
Any one have experience with the mills or insight on the industry in general. From what I gathered is that most mills were pre WW2 or built during WW2. Cheap imports cut margins and upgrades couldn't be afforded, industry went to the government for low interest loans to do upgrades and got the cold shoulder. It was the death nail for the industry in the US.
This post was edited on 11/15/22 at 9:23 pm
13
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:24 pm to GREENHEAD22
frick China, man.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:25 pm to GREENHEAD22
Do the shipping/ship building industry next.
Also it's death *knell*
The sound of a bell
"For whom the bell tolls" yadda yadda
Also it's death *knell*
The sound of a bell
"For whom the bell tolls" yadda yadda
This post was edited on 11/15/22 at 9:30 pm
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:27 pm to OldHickory
I do agree, frick China and all the pos US politicians who lined their pockets with that commy cash and sold the US down the river.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:27 pm to GREENHEAD22
Nucor is still operating in Louisiana
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:29 pm to TheFlyingTiger
And then nuclear energy and realize so called environmentalists have supported coal and wood burning over much cleaner nuclear.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:32 pm to kingbob
quote:
Nucor is still operating in Louisiana
that plant is relatively new isn't it? nucor is all over the place in the US.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:32 pm to kingbob
Steel dynamics just completed a plant in Texas
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:35 pm to GREENHEAD22
So cheaper to make steel in China and ship than to manufacture in the states? Gotta wonder about the quality to a degree.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:35 pm to TheFlyingTiger
quote:
ship building industry
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:36 pm to cymark
quote:
Gotta wonder about the quality to a degree.
Chinese steel isn't allowed on many critical-service projects.
Unfortunately, their run of the mill quality is plenty good enough for the majority of uses.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:46 pm to DownshiftAndFloorIt
quote:
Chinese steel isn't allowed on many critical-service projects.
Also several Federal and State contracts require US made steel
quote:
Unfortunately, their run of the mill quality is plenty good enough for the majority of uses.
For your average piece of rebar or angle, sure.
Still a little bit amazing you can make a relatively low priced commodity so heavy across the globe and ship it here and still be competitive.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:46 pm to BlackPawnMartyr
No. After TMI in 1979, nuclear capital costs for unfinished units went up by a factor of 10, from $500/kw to $5000/kw. 50% of electricity in the 80-90s from Pennsylvania up through New England was generated by nuclear.
Midwest and southeast electric costs were $0.08/kWh compared to $0.12/kWh in the northeast. Union in the northeast vs. non-union in the south added more costs, negatively impacting northeast manufacturing including steel.
That’s what drove the acid rain debate and NOx emissions, requiring scrubbers and scrs on coal fired power plants, raising electricity costs in the Midwest and southeast from coal fired plants. Additionally, deregulation of generation was driven by these regional cost disparities.
For the record, Bethlehem Steel fabricated cannons for the Union in the Civil War, Bethlehem, PA. Ships and artillery for WW1. Steel for the Empire State Building in the 1930s, built in 11 months. Artillery and ship steel for WW2.
They went bankrupt in the 1980s. Remember billy Joel’s Allentown song. Production costs, vertical integration, and foreign steel contributed to its demise.
It’s now a casino. Sad. What a waste.
Midwest and southeast electric costs were $0.08/kWh compared to $0.12/kWh in the northeast. Union in the northeast vs. non-union in the south added more costs, negatively impacting northeast manufacturing including steel.
That’s what drove the acid rain debate and NOx emissions, requiring scrubbers and scrs on coal fired power plants, raising electricity costs in the Midwest and southeast from coal fired plants. Additionally, deregulation of generation was driven by these regional cost disparities.
For the record, Bethlehem Steel fabricated cannons for the Union in the Civil War, Bethlehem, PA. Ships and artillery for WW1. Steel for the Empire State Building in the 1930s, built in 11 months. Artillery and ship steel for WW2.
They went bankrupt in the 1980s. Remember billy Joel’s Allentown song. Production costs, vertical integration, and foreign steel contributed to its demise.
It’s now a casino. Sad. What a waste.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:48 pm to AndyCBR
You can cut down trees in the US, send the wood to China, make a roll of paper and send it back to the US cheaper then doing it here.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:55 pm to ColdDuck
quote:
You can cut down trees in the US, send the wood to China, make a roll of paper and send it back to the US cheaper then doing it here.
All while having the time to pack a couple containers full of coolers at hella cheap prices.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 9:55 pm to ColdDuck
quote:
You can cut down trees in the US, send the wood to China, make a roll of paper and send it back to the US cheaper then doing it here.
I would think most US paper mills would be closed by now then.
I appreciate your point but even lower priced commodities (like Toilet paper) are more advantageous to manufacture here as the fuel and transportation are a much larger percentage of their relatively low cost per unit volume.
Can't say the last time I've seen a package of TP that said "Made in China" but I'll have to look.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 10:06 pm to TheFlyingTiger
quote:
ship building industry
If it wasn’t for the Nips
Being so good at building ships
The yards would still be open on the Clyde.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 10:08 pm to DownshiftAndFloorIt
quote:
Chinese steel isn't allowed on many critical-service projects.
Unfortunately, their run of the mill quality is plenty good enough for the majority of uses.
homemade shed in the backyard? perfect.
skyscraper in NYC? it's shite.
Posted on 11/15/22 at 10:11 pm to GREENHEAD22
I’m convinced I was born I the wrong era. I have a fascination with abandoned buildings, specifically places like old schools, factories, hangers. I go crazy in historic areas of cities. Hell, the empty ghettos of Detroit and St Louis were a wonder. The ruins of Detroit in particular have always intrigued me. Fortunately, many of those places have been restored and are back open.
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