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Started By
Message
re: Pilot Of Doomed Amazon Air Flight Had Poor Training Record, Seemed Confused Before Crash
Posted on 12/20/19 at 12:05 pm to RedRifle
Posted on 12/20/19 at 12:05 pm to RedRifle
According to the article the captain had also failed the initial training for the 767 and had been on a remedial monitoring program back in 2015-16. So two shitty pilots flying that thing. If Atlas and some of these other carriers payed industry standard they’d be able to attract better pilots. But no one cares if a bunch of boxes and a couple of pilots burn up in a fiery crash.
4
Posted on 12/20/19 at 12:05 pm to RedRifle
Man talk about bad timing for that pilot that was just catching a ride.
Posted on 12/20/19 at 12:09 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
If Atlas and some of these other carriers payed industry standard they’d be able to attract better pilots. But no one cares if a bunch of boxes and a couple of pilots burn up in a fiery crash.
A lot of the smaller airlines dont make a bunch of money so they cut cost where they can ..... sadly salaries are usually the easiest to cut.
Posted on 12/20/19 at 12:11 pm to tigerfoot
quote:
Thank God they only killed them selves
Tell that to the Mesa pilot (who just got hired on at United) that was catching a ride to Houston.
Posted on 12/20/19 at 12:15 pm to Cosmo
quote:
Reading articles is for clowns
Posted on 12/20/19 at 12:15 pm to RedFoxx
quote:Yeah no shite. That guy had just been called up to the big leagues and had a young family at home and got killed by these two clowns.
Tell that to the Mesa pilot (who just got hired on at United) that was catching a ride to Houston.
Posted on 12/20/19 at 12:30 pm to RedRifle
If...
then why was he anywhere near the cockpit of an airplane?
quote:...
The NTSB says that the first officer failed proficiency evaluations during his training at Atlas Air, which operates Amazon Air flights,
then why was he anywhere near the cockpit of an airplane?
Posted on 12/20/19 at 12:36 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
Pisses me off the worst when people plant flyable airplanes. This crash, the Savannah C-130 crash, Jalalabad C-130J crash. The FO in this crash was especially lacking in airmanship. I can’t imagine reacting to an unexpected pitch up by shoving the column to the instrument panel and fighting the guy in the left seat to keep it there. What a joke.
Posted on 12/20/19 at 12:40 pm to RedRifle
quote:
Amazon
Nothing shocks me when it comes to them and transportation accidents/crashes/death.
They hire the worst of the worst to drive for them locally, hire horrible tractor trailer drivers for their OTR routes, and now they hire tremendous pilots for their air service.
Eventually Bezos will get his arse sued, and they will come for him and his company big time. Luckily for him, some states still protect companies from their responsibilities.
Posted on 12/20/19 at 12:59 pm to ManBearTiger
quote:
What did he know about the Clintons?
That they had more impeachments in the family than the Trumps. He didn't live long enough for the Trumps to catch up.
Posted on 12/20/19 at 1:03 pm to tigerfoot
(no message)
This post was edited on 9/25/20 at 10:31 pm
Posted on 12/20/19 at 1:05 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
If Atlas and some of these other carriers payed industry standard they’d be able to attract better pilots. But no one cares if a bunch of boxes and a couple of pilots burn up in a fiery crash.
I'd be pretty bummed if I missed out on GAINZ because my order of whey protein ended up in a swamp somewhere.
Posted on 12/21/19 at 5:13 pm to HerkFlyer
This is copilots training record. He was the one at the controls who nosedived the plane into the water for no apparent reason.
quote:
Training Incompetency and Failures -
Resigned from CommutAir for failing DHC-8 initial 8/13/12
- Resigned from Air Wisconsin for failing CRJ initial 4/22/14
- Failed EMB-145 Oral at Trans State Airlines 5/11/14 -
-Failed EMB-145 Type Rating at Trans States Airlines 5/17 -
Failed EMB-175 Upgrade Attempt at Mesa Airlines 5/17 -
-Nearly failed FO Requal after failing upgrade attempt at Mesa Airlines 7/27/17
- Failed B-767 Oral at Atlas Air 8/1/17 -
Unsat Judgement/Situational Awareness during FBS-1 at Atlas Air 8/5/17
- Failed DBS-5 at Atlas Air 8/11/17
- Almost Failed FFSI-1 at Atlas Air 8/31/17
- "Regression of Situational Awareness" during FFSI-3 at Atlas Air 9/22/17
- Failed B-767 Type Rating for "Very Low Situational Awareness", incomplete procedures, and exceeding limitations at Atlas Air
Past Training Notes (directly quoted from the NTSB Docket) Air Wisconsin CRJ Initial Failure - "They were conducting the emergency procedure cabin altitude ... where they are at FL350 or so, and he gives the students a cabin altitude message requiring an emergency descent to 10,000 feet" ... "Conrad then goes to descend the simulator. He was not sure of Conrad's background, but instead of descending on the autopilot, Conrad disengaged the autopilot and abruptly pitched down well below horizon. They got stick shaker and overspeed alert together. He was not sure if it was an extreme nose down, but remembered that it was abrupt input on the controls"
Mesa Airlines ERJ-175 Upgrade Failure (Instructor 1) - "He had previously failed simulator lesson 2 with different instructor, and he had requested a different instructor. She was conducting his retraining for lesson 2. She said his performance was a "train wreck" and he performed very poorly in this lesson. In the briefing room he did well, and explained things well. However, in the simulator and something he wasn't expecting happened he got extremely flustered and could not respond appropriately to the situation." ... "When asked about her comment in her notes about Conrad's "lack of understanding of how unsafe he was," she said he was making very frantic mistakes, lots and lots of mistakes, and did a lot of things wrong but did not recognize this was a problem. He thought he was a good pilot never had any problems and thought he should be a captain. he could not evaluate himself and see that he did not have the right stuff."
Mesa Airlines ERJ-175 Upgrade Failure (Instructor 2) - "He first met Conrad Aska during a recurrent checking event in March 2016. That session went ok and nothing stood out. He did have some trouble with the stall series. The problems were with his attitude control, and he had a hard time getting the airplane back to level flight" ... "He said when Conrad would make a mistake in training he had an excuse for everything"
The quote that stands out the most to me in this second Mesa instructor interview is, "When asked if Conrad would get startled in the simulator, he said that during one stall recovery, Conrad pitched down about 40 degrees for recovery, then a pitch up about 20 degrees. His flight path was all over the place."
This post was edited on 12/21/19 at 5:15 pm
Posted on 12/21/19 at 5:32 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
How was he able to remain a pilot with that record?
Posted on 12/21/19 at 5:34 pm to Pettifogger
Man do you ever misquote/interpret.
ETA: I’m talking to three guys on here, one of which is in this thread and is a highly experienced pilot. The other two are flying an F-15 and C-130 and are qualified to fly for the airlines.
ETA: jerk dude is also here
ETA: I’m talking to three guys on here, one of which is in this thread and is a highly experienced pilot. The other two are flying an F-15 and C-130 and are qualified to fly for the airlines.
ETA: jerk dude is also here
This post was edited on 12/21/19 at 5:39 pm
Posted on 12/21/19 at 5:46 pm to 777Tiger
quote:
After the 2009 Colgan Air crash, Congress required the Federal Aviation Administration to set up a clearinghouse including FAA and employer records on pilots to aid carriers in vetting them, but it has yet to complete the process.
God save us from the federal government. That sounds like it should take about a week (at most) to get going. This country is toast.
If Congress said they have to do it and they haven't (after 10 fricking years) someone should go to prison.
This post was edited on 12/21/19 at 5:47 pm
Posted on 12/21/19 at 5:51 pm to SeeeeK
quote:
Amazon
Nothing shocks me when it comes to them and transportation accidents/crashes/death.
I’m not trying to protect them, but they are a low cost company for the most part, what should we expect? You can’t ship a ton of cheap shite and pay well. That’s not how capitalism works. Same with Walmart.
I mean I’m not sure what people really expect? If you want crap cheap costs have to be cut.
Posted on 12/21/19 at 5:55 pm to baldona
I hadn’t seen the video until now. Man they were headed straight down and very, very fast.
Video in link if you want to see it.
Video in link if you want to see it.
Posted on 12/21/19 at 6:08 pm to SSpaniel
quote:
then why was he anywhere near the cockpit of an airplane?
Meanwhile some guy that blew .11 on Labor Day weekend 20 years ago is desperately trying to get his license back.
I bet those FAA fricktards have the system that tracks that running like a well-oiled maching
Posted on 12/21/19 at 6:09 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
Holy shite. All those failed initials and still had a job? The pilot shortage really is bad I guess.
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