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re: One reason why I am against the wage increase to $15/hour
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:03 pm to Tarik One
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:03 pm to Tarik One
Cut back on immigration, keep the economy humming, maybe improve skills training.. when labor becomes a scarce commodity employers will pay up with or without min wage hikes. Conservative business interests are/were just as big a reason for uncontrolled immigration as liberals
0
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:07 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:The minimum wage in 1979 was $2.90, which I believe is about $10 in today's dollars. What happens to that 3% earning minimum wage today if you lump in everyone making up to $10?
In 1979 almost 14% of workers made min wage. Today it's less than 3% if you count teens.
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:11 pm to mdomingue
quote:Your chart starts in 1979, and seeing as how the min wage has been dropping since then (inflation adjusted), it should be no surprise that fewer people make the minimum.
In terms of percentage of minimum wage earners, we are at an all time low or nearly so.
However, it kind of makes the point that we are overdue for a minimum wage hike.
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:12 pm to Centinel
quote:Is every single politician out there running on a platform of increasing all of our current entitlements?
Because every single politician out there will run on a platform of increasing the UBI.
And eventually you run out of other people's money.
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:13 pm to mindbreaker
quote:
Listen. Less than 2% of adults over the age of 21 work for min wage. It's really a non factor
So therefore raising the minimum wage would be insignificant to the overall cost of anything. Glad to have you on board.
But minnimum wage employees arent the only ones who wages have to be raised.
It's a ripple effect.
The raise has to move throughout the work force but it decreases as it goes up resulting in the middle class getting squeezed with only a small to no raise but still having the increase in COL.
You squeeze a large portion of individuals that are applying themselves to benefit a small number of people who arent
This post was edited on 4/23/19 at 12:14 pm
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:16 pm to Korkstand
quote:
Is every single politician out there running on a platform of increasing all of our current entitlements?
Our current entitlements aren't universal.
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:17 pm to theenemy
quote:That's kind of the point.
But minnimum wage employees arent the only ones who wages have to be raised.
It's a ripple effect.
quote:Do you have any evidence to back up the claim that a min wage hike hurts the middle class?
The raise has to move throughout the work force but it decreases as it goes up resulting in the middle class getting squeezed with only a small to no raise but still having the increase in COL.
You squeeze a large portion of individuals that are applying themselves to benefit a small number of people who arent
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:19 pm to Korkstand
quote:
The minimum wage in 1979 was $2.90, which I believe is about $10 in today's dollars. What happens to that 3% earning minimum wage today if you lump in everyone making up to $10?
Not sure, you can look it up though.
You couldn't buy anything if you did have a job
quote:. Many metro areas had 20% unemployment and interest rates were over 10%
Inflation which had averaged 3.2% annually since World War II had more than doubled after the 1973 oil shock, to a 7.7% annual rate. Inflation reached 9.1% in 1975, the highest rate since 1947. Inflation declined to 5.8% the following year but then edged higher. By 1979, inflation reached a startling 11.3% and in 1980, it soared to 13.5%
Most people took that time to improve themselves rather that wait for a gubment raise, which is why fewer people began living on min wage.
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:20 pm to Korkstand
quote:
it should be no surprise that fewer people make the minimum.
So the ole Argument that industry will pay as little as possible can be confirmed as quackery. The market did a fine job
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:22 pm to Centinel
quote:So? UBI isn't so "universal" either once you factor in the taxes used to pay for it. There obviously has to be a crossover point in income where raising the UBI is no longer beneficial for an individual.
Our current entitlements aren't universal.
It essentially works the same way as current entitlement programs, which are "universal" in the sense that anyone can qualify if they make less money. Main difference is UBI is cleaner and cheaper to administer, and it solves some of the major problems with other programs.
If you call an idea "idiocy", you kind of have to explain why it's worse than what it would replace.
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:22 pm to Tarik One
quote:I am all for setting minimum wage anywhere a locale determines.
One reason why I am against the wage increase to $15/hour
This is advocated mainly by older adults. Most of whom have families to support, and have underachieved in life.
Local models can serve as laboratories for the rest of us. So if Seattle wants to go with a $15/hr min wage, more power to them. Their concomitant homeless problem may well be a secondary and unexpected result. Let them work it out. OTOH, regional COL differences render a high nationwide minimum wage less appealing.
The same thesis applies with socialized medicine models. E.g., I was pleased when Vermont announced it would try "universal healthcare" (because it would have failed in a huge way). I was disappointed when they balked.
Anyway, I'd happily encourage locales that want to experiment to do so. Some may succeed unexpectedly. They can serve as lights to a new way. Similarly, if they fail while others propose similar approaches, we can avoid falling for a losing proposition.
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:23 pm to eScott
quote:
Most of those restaurants automatically add 20% to your bill and the servers don't see the full 20% that they would have in the forum of a tip.
Most places that I know of where the gratuity is collected by the buisenss either through an automatic gratuity or a built in menu price system pay the server about 12-14% of their sales. It’s basically a commission payout. So for a typical shift if you sell $2k you make your hourly and then $260.
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:25 pm to Korkstand
quote:
If you call an idea "idiocy", you kind of have to explain why it's worse than what it would replace.
I didn't say it was worse.
UBI and our current system are both utter shite that should never see/have seen the light of day.
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:25 pm to Korkstand
quote:
Main difference is UBI is cleaner and cheaper to administer,
Yep, but it's not truly universal as it's means tested.
I would tie it to education or training. Even longevity at a job
This post was edited on 4/23/19 at 12:26 pm
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:26 pm to Korkstand
quote:
Your chart starts in 1979, and seeing as how the min wage has been dropping since then (inflation adjusted), it should be no surprise that fewer people make the minimum. However, it kind of makes the point that we are overdue for a minimum wage hike.
Que?
Why hike something that is clearly happening on its own?
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:27 pm to Korkstand
quote:
Your chart starts in 1979, and seeing as how the min wage has been dropping since then (inflation adjusted), it should be no surprise that fewer people make the minimum.
The specific data only started being gathered in 1979.
quote:
However, it kind of makes the point that we are overdue for a minimum wage hike.
Does it? You could argue that it makes the point that the private sector and demand do a better job than the government mandate do. I'm not sure that's accurate either, more data would be needed to reach either conclusion.
It's also important to note it looks at Federal minimum wage data only so if a state has a higher minimum that the feds do, that entire state's minimum wage group would not show up on this chart.
FTR the minimum wage in 1979 was $2.90 which translates to $10.15 in current dollars, so I can see your argument if you assume that wage was the right number and the current on isn't.
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:32 pm to Centinel
quote:Well you were the one who brought up UBI wondering why no on else had yet, and calling it "idiocy", and then basically conceding that it might be an improvement on the current state of shite... I'm just a little confused at your angle is all.
I didn't say it was worse.
UBI and our current system are both utter shite that should never see/have seen the light of day.
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:34 pm to Korkstand
quote:
However, it kind of makes the point that we are overdue for a minimum wage hike.
When the market is clearly moving people off mandated min wage?
Posted on 4/23/19 at 12:34 pm to Korkstand
quote:
Do you have any evidence to back up the claim that a min wage hike hurts the middle class?
Just my observations over the last twenty years.
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