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Message
re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict
Posted on 2/6/24 at 7:38 pm to Harry Rex Vonner
Posted on 2/6/24 at 7:38 pm to Harry Rex Vonner
quote:
Washington D.C., December 12, 2017 – U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s famous “not one inch eastward” assurance about NATO expansion in his meeting with Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev on February 9, 1990, was part of a cascade of assurances about Soviet security given by Western leaders to Gorbachev and other Soviet officials throughout the process of German unification in 1990 and on into 1991, according to declassified U.S., Soviet, German, British and French documents posted today by the National Security Archive at George Washington University (LINK ; The Ukraine boys don't want to hear facts
You didn’t link a treaty or even an international written agreement. Baker’s statements stopped having any weight to them the day WJC took the oath of office in 1993.
0
Posted on 2/6/24 at 7:52 pm to Harry Rex Vonner
quote:
The Ukraine boys don't want to hear facts
I’ve negotiated many agreements and contracts. Offers were made, offers were rejected and accepted.
But at the end of the day the only thing that mattered was what was put in writing in the signed contract or agreement. Nothing else.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 8:11 pm to doubleb
I agree with this mostly, but you have to admit a lot of things happen in politics that are not written down and signed.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 8:15 pm to ticklechain
quote:
agree with this mostly, but you have to admit a lot of things happen in politics that are not written down and signed.
Perhaps, but if it’s that important and a key to a treaty wouldn’t you think it would be written down?
And everyone knows our SOS can say something, but only a president can make it binding with the blessing of the Senate.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 8:20 pm to doubleb
Definitely would have to written down for that kinda promise
Posted on 2/6/24 at 8:45 pm to doubleb
This is what Cry Babies do. The Ronulans and Putin are the biggest cry babies around. We even had a "don't taze me bro" one in LA. BTW, he was/is a grant writing consultant for Federal grants. Oh the irony. He even looks somewhat like Harvey Updyke, the famous Bama fan.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 8:52 pm to ticklechain
quote:
a lot of things happen in politics that are not written down and signed.
None that are binding nor that have the force of policy.
Its worth remembering that Baker may well have advocated for a non-Eastward drift. He was a highly political SOS by Republican standards; he was back as WH Chief of Staff before the end of the Soviet era. By the time of the Trilateral Statement, at best he represented a single policy advocacy group within the Republican Party, but never a plank in the party platform, nor even an official white paper position of the Congressional Republican caucus.
Baker discussing it and advocating for it never gave it force of law, treaty, or international agreement. It gives it the force of a policy position one camp in the Elder Bush administration chose to try to advocate for-- nothing more and nothing less, unlike the Trilateral Agreement which actually was on paper, and actually was ratified, and that actually exists beyond dispute.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 8:52 pm to Harry Rex Vonner
quote:
"Washington D.C., December 12, 2017 – U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s famous “not one inch eastward” assurance
So according to your brilliant logic, the Trump administration would be duty bound to abide by any oral assurances made by Hillary Clinton as Secretary of State for Obama. the poliboard is not sending us their best and brightest, ladies and gentlemen.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 9:47 pm to REG861
ISW Update
quote:
Key Takeaways:
America’s European and Asian allies have significantly ramped up their efforts to support Ukraine. As European partners continue to increase their support for Ukraine, US aid provision in the near to medium-term remains vital to help Ukraine build its defense industrial base (DIB).
The US Army plans to significantly increase US domestic production of 155mm artillery shells and shell components for Ukraine in 2024 and 2025, should the proposed Congressional supplemental appropriations bill pass.
Russian authorities are reportedly paying Iran roughly $4.5 billion per year to import Iranian Shahed drones to use in Ukraine.
Russia is reportedly unfreezing North Korean assets and helping North Korea evade international sanctions in exchange for missiles and artillery ammunition for Russia to use in Ukraine.
Russian Security Council Secretary Nikolai Patrushev emphasized on February 6 that Russia needs to protect its strategic facilities as Russian authorities continue to voice concerns about external and internal threats to Russian infrastructure.
The Kremlin continues to set informational conditions for possible hybrid provocations against the Baltic states and Georgia.
Russian-Israeli relations are likely continuing to decline against the backdrop of Russia’s increasingly anti-Israel stance on the Israel-Hamas war.
Russian forces recently made confirmed advances near Bakhmut, Avdiivka, and southwest of Donetsk City amid continued positional engagements along the entire frontline.
Russian authorities are reportedly paying roughly $4.5 billion per year to import Iranian Shahed drones to use in Ukraine.
The Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs (MFA) continues efforts to integrate occupied Ukraine into Russia and to seek international recognition of Russia’s illegal occupation of Ukraine.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 9:48 pm to ticklechain
quote:
Definitely would have to written down for that kinda promise
Even if one dude said something, that doesn’t have the force to forever bind a nation of more than a hundred million people. If Putin thinks it does, he’s a moron.
Posted on 2/7/24 at 12:39 am to StormyMcMan
Heckn pumped about Tucks interview, lads 
Posted on 2/7/24 at 2:51 am to WeeWee
quote:
It wasn’t a formal treaty. It was a verbal agreement between the GHWB administration and the USSR. By 1997, the USSR ceased to exist and there was a new POTUS. There was nothing binding about the agreement. However the Budapest Accords are binding and Putin violated that.
You live off half truths it seems
It was an agreement with Gorbechev, the President of the Soviet Union, and Boris Yeltsin, the President of Russia
So your 9th grade civics point is without merit
Surely you understand that both Gorby and Yeltsin were in power of their own spheres at the same time, right?
But you don't, or you wouldn't have posted that stupid shite.
quote:
the Budapest Accords
This post was edited on 2/7/24 at 2:59 am
Posted on 2/7/24 at 3:11 am to REG861
quote:
So according to your brilliant logic, the Trump administration would be duty bound to abide by any oral assurances made by Hillary Clinton as Secretary of State for Obama. the poliboard is not sending us their best and brightest, ladies and gentlemen.
So according to your, something?, American Democrats or American Republicans only make global agreements that go as far as domestic American politics?? Holy shite you're an idiot. So if rabid leftist freak doesn't like James Baker's views on gun control or abortion, then that renders James Baker null and void on global agreements?
How embarrassing for you that you would even post that out in the open, wow.
Please take "Vanderbilt" off of your fan insignia, Vanderbilt should cancel you
Posted on 2/7/24 at 3:27 am to trinidadtiger
quote:
Translation "We have a huge money dump coming and have to get rid of the honest fellas who keep trying to rat us out". I thought he cleaned out all the honest folks with the last two purges. Maybe even the ones left are sickened at all they have to kill to thief even more.
frick'n A
Posted on 2/7/24 at 3:41 am to SirWinston
quote:
Heckn pumped about Tucks interview, lads
For that interview -
Where are the secret US biolabs?
This post was edited on 2/7/24 at 3:44 am
Posted on 2/7/24 at 3:54 am to StormyMcMan
quote:
LINK
Your OTL case law doesn't include anything said to Yeltsin, so you're just as uninformed as the other guy I talked to about that
Posted on 2/7/24 at 3:55 am to StormyMcMan
quote:
LINK
Your OTL case law doesn't include anything said to Yeltsin, so you're just as uninformed as the other guy I talked to about that
Posted on 2/7/24 at 3:56 am to ticklechain
quote:
Sorry never saw a discussion. Legit question. Why was it unenforceable?
He refused to answer your question
Posted on 2/7/24 at 4:02 am to Chromdome35
quote:
Do you understand the difference between a conversation and a formal treaty?
So conversations between United States Secretaries of State with presidents of other nations should be understood as complete and utter folly?
Posted on 2/7/24 at 4:10 am to Harry Rex Vonner
quote:
So conversations between United States Secretaries of State with presidents of other nations should be understood as complete and utter folly?
Sometimes. Especially when the president of Russia assures a secretary of state (and the rest of the world) that he is not about to invade Ukraine.
Even Macron eventually figured out that random verbal promises are completely meaningless.
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