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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:04 pm to
Posted by Errerrerrwere
Member since Aug 2015
44412 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:04 pm to
I did hear about Captain Cargo Pants very sad speech about the world leaving him behind.

This is what happens when you lie in bed with the USA.
Posted by Dr RC
The Money Pit
Member since Aug 2011
61475 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:06 pm to
quote:

What does the US produce now more than they did in the 70-80's?


Social media posts?
Posted by Errerrerrwere
Member since Aug 2015
44412 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:08 pm to
quote:

What do sensible people think about the EU giving Ukraine $50b next month? Or Germany (and Germany ALONE) giving Ukraine $8b in military aid in 2024?


See? Now you are speaking my language. I can get on board with this.

As long as it's not a single Us Tax dollar OR one of our boys; I couldn't care less.

Does this still make me a Putin apologist. Or is there some other ad hominem attack out there for people like me?
This post was edited on 11/16/23 at 7:17 pm
Posted by Errerrerrwere
Member since Aug 2015
44412 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:14 pm to
quote:

Lima Whiskey is either an American veteran who has turned traitor and is working for the FSB or an FSB agent pretending to be an American veteran. Either way he is working for the FSB.


I figured you guys out. When stuck and cant defend the Ukraine or absurdity of this foreign policy; You immediately precipitate into ad hominem attacks against the people with a different view from yours. It's not so much immature and childish as it's a complete unacceptance of the deep deep deep cognitive dissonance you are going on in your brains about.

I actually pity all of you really.
This post was edited on 11/16/23 at 7:15 pm
Posted by trinidadtiger
Member since Jun 2017
19963 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:18 pm to
quote:

What do sensible people think about the EU giving Ukraine $50b next month? Or Germany (and Germany ALONE) giving Ukraine $8b in military aid in 2024?


Well since its their continent, and the laundromat is not part of NATO, they should have picked up our 100 billion as well. Or sent us that 58 billion to fix our border.

Posted by CitizenK
BR
Member since Aug 2019
15666 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:18 pm to
Remember when the Allies were finished and their best armies defeated. Remember Dunkirk

LINK
Posted by Errerrerrwere
Member since Aug 2015
44412 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:21 pm to
Remember the Alamo?

None of this shite is the same.

You had women in the factories producing for the war.

You had children lying about their ages and fighting in trenches.

These two things are definitely not the same.

You have middle aged men on the front line in the Ukraine.
This post was edited on 11/16/23 at 7:22 pm
Posted by Tantal
Member since Sep 2012
19821 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:26 pm to
quote:

Russian industrial production just dwarfs ours.

You're smoking crack if you believe this. Russia's population is only 43% of the U.S. population.....and that's not including the populations of the rest of NATO. Plus, they're all inefficient alcoholics.
Posted by Warfox
B.R. Native (now in MA)
Member since Apr 2017
3832 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:26 pm to
quote:

Were these the sensible people who thought Ukraine would fall within two weeks, or the sensible people who assumed Russian equipment worked? [quote]

There is a huge difference between people being wrong about Ukraine falling to Russia within two weeks, and the people who thought Ukraine ever had a chance in hell to withstand the long-war against Russia.

[quote] Or the sensible people who didn't believe Putin killed 80% of the VDV in the first month of the conflict?


I can’t speak to that, but this is War(and with Russia, at that). IMO Anyone who believes that Russia would show mercy on its enemies is a fool.

quote:

What do sensible people think about the EU giving Ukraine $50b next month? Or Germany (and Germany ALONE) giving Ukraine $8b in military aid in 2024?


Money cant(and ultimately won’t) buy Ukraine - and the Western power-bloc - out of defeat. It will take substantial outside manpower to solve this, and that would almost certainly lead to nuclear war.

This post was edited on 11/16/23 at 7:54 pm
Posted by Errerrerrwere
Member since Aug 2015
44412 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:28 pm to
quote:

Plus, they're all inefficient alcoholics.


Imagine a world where this is a point or your argument.
Posted by trinidadtiger
Member since Jun 2017
19963 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:35 pm to
This whole mess stops when the US funding stops, the EU themselves said they cant support them with out the worlds piggybank. Translation, they dont see Russia as a threat and they will not sacrifice their social programs to fund Ukraine.

Face it fellas its over. Mother Russia will have what is mother Russia's and no amount of hand wringing will change that.


Posted by trinidadtiger
Member since Jun 2017
19963 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:40 pm to
quote:

The bitter hindsight is that the peace deal they were offered in April of 22 was their best option. And by refusing to bend, they will ultimately lose more and more territory.

They've had the moral victories, hitting the shipyards in Crimea for example, but even that comes at a cost, because the Russians will conclude, if they haven't already, that they will have to take Odessa to keep Crimea safe.


Preach on brother, preach on. This is the sad truth that many cant accept. Should have taken the deal then, better to lose some than be in the position they are in now with nothing to bargain with, sugar daddy has left the building.
Posted by notiger1997
Metairie
Member since May 2009
61723 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:44 pm to
quote:

I'm here for the melt as it finally comes to light y'all have been lied to the whole time


Tell us more oh wise one.
Posted by Errerrerrwere
Member since Aug 2015
44412 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 7:53 pm to
quote:


Tell us more oh wise one.


We've been trying for 20 long months.

It's just not your generation's WWIII. It's just not the single most important conflict of your lifetimes.

I mean CitizenK did his tour In Country in Ukraine. But he was born a hero.
Posted by StormyMcMan
USA
Member since Oct 2016
4669 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 8:58 pm to
When this many poliboard folks are posting it normally means good news for Ukraine just happened or is about to happen.

For what it's worth here is Putin rejecting early peace deals
In April 2022 because, per Putin, Ukraine staged Bucha and wanted security guarantees.

In Feb 2022 where, supposedly, Ukraine agreed to not join NATO, but Russia advanced anyway

Anyway ISW Update

quote:

Russian forces conducted a series of missile and drone strikes against Ukraine on the night of October 15 to 16. The Ukrainian General Staff reported that Russian forces launched 18 Shahed-131/136 drones of which Ukrainian forces destroyed 16.

Russian Security Council Secretary Nikolai Patrushev announced on November 16 that Russian authorities are strengthening Russian air defense over Russia’s Central Federal Okrug, likely in response to Ukraine’s recently implied intent to conduct an interdiction campaign against Russian supply routes in rear areas during the winter. Patrushev also announced that Russian authorities have organized patrols to protect critical infrastructure facilities to prevent attacks and that the Russian government is funding the creation of “territorial defense lines” for oblasts bordering Ukraine.[5] Patrushev added that Russian authorities are updating a list of all critical infrastructure facilities – including fuel and energy facilities and important transportation objects – that require protection from unspecified threats

Russian milbloggers continued to criticize actors in the Russian information space for distorting the reality of the Russian war effort, highlighting an emerging cyclical dynamic in the Russian information space in which the majority of Russian sources coalesce around a particular predominant narrative and, in turn, a subset of different sources coalesces to criticize the majority’s prevailing opinion. A prominent Russian milblogger claimed on November 16 that Russian state media may have falsely convinced the Russian people that “everything is fine” in Russia’s war in Ukraine.[10] The milblogger claimed that he does not understand why Russian state media devotes so much time to promoting narratives about the “imminent collapse of Ukraine" and portrays the Russian war effort so positively that Russian viewers think that signing a military service contract is unnecessary. Another Russian milblogger who previously served throughout the front in Ukraine and correctly assessed Russia’s foundational problems in Kharkiv Oblast in spring 2022 criticized several unnamed Russian milbloggers for their recent overly positive reporting about Russian counterattacks on the east (left) bank of Kherson Oblast.

Russian President Vladimir Putin awarded a prominent Russian milblogger who was previously critical of Russia’s military performance during its full-scale invasion with a prestigious state honor, continuing the Kremlin’s long-standing effort to coopt milbloggers and make them loyal to the Kremlin. Putin awarded founder of Rybar Telegram channel, Mikhail Zvinchuk, the Russian Order of Merit of the Fatherland Second Class for his efforts supporting the Russian full-scale invasion of Ukraine on November 16

Ukraine stated that the continued Russian occupation of the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant (ZNPP) has resulted in equipment and maintenance failures that threaten the plant’s security. Ukrainian nuclear energy operator Energoatom reported on November 16 that Russian ZNPP authorities transferred reactor no. 5 to a hot shutdown state from a cold shutdown state in violation of Ukraine’s nuclear regulatory orders, resulting in a leak of a boric acid solution that entered all the reactor’s steam generators.[20] Energoatom reported that Russian ZNPP authorities’ “incompetence” in bringing reactors from cold shutdowns to hot shutdowns has resulted in a radioactive coolant leak from the first to second circuit of reactor no. 4 and a similar situation involving reactor no. 6

The International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) has not yet commented on these incidents but expressed concern on November 13 over the extent and effectiveness of maintenance on ZNPP safety systems and its own ability to monitor ZNPP operations.[24] The IAEA reported that these maintenance issues became apparent in July and August 2023 when the steam generator of reactor no. 4 experienced a leak that contaminated the reactor’s safety systems that had to be recleaned

The Ukrainian and IAEA reports indicate that Russia’s presence and exclusive control over the ZNPP is increasing, suggesting that similar failures may escalate under continued Russian occupation. The IAEA announced on November 13 that its staff visited a Russian training center for the ZNPP on November 7 and that Russian nuclear regulatory agency Rostekhnadzor is establishing a permanent presence at the ZNPP

Cyprus has reportedly been complicit in helping Russian elites, sanctioned for supporting the Russian invasion of Ukraine in 2014 and 2022, launder money. The International Consortium of Investigative Journalists (ICIJ) reported on November 14 that Russians who have been under Western sanctions since 2014 owned or controlled almost 800 companies and trusts secretly registered in various countries and territories including Cyprus, Lichtenstein, the British Virgin Islands, and Hong Kong

Gazprom Media Holdings, a subsidiary of Russian state-owned energy company Gazprom, announced on November 16 that it acquired the majority share of a large Russian blogger agency, likely in an effort to expand its already extensive control over the Russian media space. Gazprom Media Holdings announced that it bought 51 percent of shares in Insight People, reportedly the largest blogging agency in Russia.[33] Gazprom Media Holdings already owns Russian video streaming platform RuTube, Russian social media network VKontakte, and several prominent Russian TV channels and radio stations

Russian authorities discovered former Russian 6th Air Force and Air Defense Army Commander Lieutenant General Vladimir Sviridov dead in his home in Stavropol Krai on November 15. Russian sources reported that authorities found Sviridov dead with a woman, likely his wife, and suggested that the couple likely died around November 9. Russian sources reported that Russian authorities have not yet determined Sviridov’s and the woman’s cause of death but have ruled out carbon monoxide poisoning and “violent” deaths.[37] Sviridov reportedly resigned from his position as commander of the 6th Air Force and Air Defense Army in 2009
Posted by StormyMcMan
USA
Member since Oct 2016
4669 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 8:58 pm to
quote:

Key Takeaways:

Russian forces conducted a series of missile and drone strikes against Ukraine on the night of October 15 to 16.

Russian Security Council Secretary Nikolai Patrushev announced on November 16 that Russian authorities are strengthening Russian air defense over Russia’s Central Federal Okrug, likely in response to Ukraine’s recently implied intent to conduct an interdiction campaign against Russian supply routes in rear areas during the winter.

Russian milbloggers continued to criticize actors in the Russian information space for distorting the reality of the Russian war effort, highlighting an emerging cyclical dynamic in the Russian information space in which the majority of Russian sources coalesce around a particular predominant narrative and, in turn, a subset of different sources coalesces to criticize the majority’s prevailing opinion.

Russian President Vladimir Putin awarded a prominent Russian milblogger who was previously critical of Russia’s military performance during its full-scale invasion with a prestigious state honor, continuing the Kremlin’s long-standing effort to coopt milbloggers and make them loyal to the Kremlin. 

Ukraine stated that the continued Russian occupation of the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant (ZNPP) has resulted in equipment and maintenance failures that threaten the plant’s security.

The Ukrainian and IAEA reports indicate that Russia’s presence and exclusive control over the ZNPP is increasing, suggesting that similar failures may escalate under continued Russian occupation.

Cyprus has reportedly been complicit in helping Russian elites, sanctioned for supporting the Russian invasion of Ukraine in 2014 and 2022, launder money.

Gazprom Media Holdings, a subsidiary of Russian state-owned energy company Gazprom, announced on November 16 that it acquired the majority share of a large Russian blogger agency, likely in an effort to expand its already extensive control over the Russian media space.

Russian authorities discovered former Russian 6th Air Force and Air Defense Army Commander Lieutenant General Vladimir Sviridov dead in his home in Stavropol Krai on November 15.

Russian sources continued offensive operations along the Kupyansk-Svatove-Kreminna line, near Bakhmut, near Avdiivka, west and southwest of Donetsk City, in the Donetsk-Zaporizhia Oblast border area, near Robotyne, and northeast of Vasylivka and advanced near Avdiivka.

The Russian Ministry of Education issued a draft order establishing a course called “Fundamentals of Security and Defense of the Motherland” for Russian middle and high school students starting in September 2024.

The Russian government and Russian occupation authorities continue to forcibly deport children in occupied Ukraine to Russia under the rubric of educational programs.


Posted by Darth_Vader
A galaxy far, far away
Member since Dec 2011
73585 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 9:06 pm to
quote:

What does the US produce now more than they did in the 70-80's?


Dysfunctional weirdos
Blue-haired morbidly obese freaks
Trannys
Beta soy boys
Sheeple
Meth heads
Radical leftists
Radical feminists
Posted by Mr Happy
Member since May 2019
2682 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 9:20 pm to
I've given up on the full ISW update and now just read the Key Points.
Posted by Tantal
Member since Sep 2012
19821 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 9:48 pm to
quote:

Imagine a world where this is a point or your argument.

Think about what Russia actually exports to the world. Second rate weapons systems going to 3rd World shitholes that can't afford Western weaponry and raw commodities. That's pretty much it. Nobody buys Russian cars, passenger jets, heavy machinery, or electronics. They drill and mine for petroleum and minerals, then ship them somewhere else to be turned into actual goods.
Posted by trinidadtiger
Member since Jun 2017
19963 posts
Posted on 11/16/23 at 10:06 pm to
Face it fellas, its over. No amount of attacking the realists on this thread will change that, another 60 billion wont change that, talking about the weaknesses of Russia wont change that.

The world has grown tired of this laundromat. If Europe wants to continue let them, we have far more important things to worry about than funding the wife of zelenskys next shopping trip.
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