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Is it time to reconsider mandatory public high school education?

Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:01 am
Posted by LSUFanHouston
NOLA
Member since Jul 2009
37043 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:01 am
First off, let me say that I am a huge proponent of the idea that any child who wants to go to school and get a good education, should get the ability to do that, regardless of where they live, their parent situation, etc. At the full expense of the state. Education is the ONE way that poor students can pull themselves up.

Under current LA law, students are required to attend school until they turn 18 or graduate high school, whichever happens first.

With parental consent, 17 year olds can also drop out.

A significant amount time, resources, and attention is paid to a relatively small number of high school students who don't know how to act, don't want to act right, and in all reality, don't want to be in school. They don't want to go to class, do homework, play sports, join the band, etc. They are only there because they are forced to be there, and while they are there, they are screwing up things for the vast majority of kids who DO want to be there.

In most Louisiana public high schools, you can learn a trade if you want and get put on an alternative diploma path. So if the typical education pattern isn't right for them, they hafve options.

But these kids don't want that either. They don't want to be there. And due to state and federal law, they have to be. And most of these kids - and their idiot parent - now know how to get their kid on a "behavior plan" and despite that sounding like a good idea, it's basically a get out of jail free card. It's insanely hard - due to state and federal law - to punish a kid on a behavior plan, much less kick them out.

Something has to give.

As a society, we need to change our focus. We need to focus on the 90 percent of kids who WANT to be in school and want to be successful. Tell the 10 percent to shape up, or they can get out.

If a kid doesn't want to attend school after 8th grade and that kid is doing nothing but causing trouble, let them go.
Posted by beerJeep
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2016
34966 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:03 am to
We need to change it up and realize that not everyone needs to go to college. You pretty much know by middle school who is cut out for college or not. If not, starting in middle school they diverge down the trade path, with classes focused on financial literacy and life skills into specialized trades by high school.
Posted by brewhan davey
Audubon Place
Member since Sep 2010
32782 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:07 am to
quote:

It's insanely hard - due to state and federal law - to punish a kid on a behavior plan, much less kick them out.


This is very true. I have so much respect for the teachers and school leaders who have to put up with poorly behaved kids with IEPs. They have more patience than I will ever have.
Posted by LSUFanHouston
NOLA
Member since Jul 2009
37043 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:07 am to
quote:

We need to change it up and realize that not everyone needs to go to college. You pretty much know by middle school who is cut out for college or not. If not, starting in middle school they diverge down the trade path, with classes focused on financial literacy and life skills into specialized trades by high schoo


We are getting better at that. Sure there is room for improvement.

But there are some kids that don't seem to want that, either.
Posted by Gaston
Dirty Coast
Member since Aug 2008
38945 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:09 am to
Parents have to work…who’s going to watch the kids?
Posted by jaytothen
Member since Jan 2020
6404 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:11 am to
quote:

child who wants to go to school and get a good education, should get the ability to do that


Most don't want that and the parents don't give a shite as long as they get that free daycare service and meal plan.

quote:

At the full expense of the state


The state can't trim a tree properly.

quote:

A significant amount time, resources, and attention is paid to a relatively small number of high school students who don't know how to act, don't want to act right, and in all reality, don't want to be in school


This is why the above shouldn't happen.

I'm all for kids education but honestly the school system currently is broken. More focus should be on trades and life skills.

TBF a lot of the problems are on the parents as well. This isn't just an education system problem.
Posted by LSUFanHouston
NOLA
Member since Jul 2009
37043 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:11 am to
quote:

who’s going to watch the kids?


They are in high school, they can watch themselves.
Posted by LSUFanHouston
NOLA
Member since Jul 2009
37043 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:13 am to
quote:

TBF a lot of the problems are on the parents as well. This isn't just an education system problem


Ultimately it's almost all on the parent(s).

The best school system in the world can't make up for crappy parenting.

We need to stop trying to do so, especially if the kid / parent doesn't want that.

We are screwing thre 90% of kids who do want to be there.
Posted by tide06
Member since Oct 2011
11151 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:13 am to
I believe students who do not show any interest in academic pursuits by freshman year of high school and who are chronically causing trouble should be diverted to a trade school where they can at least learn a functional skill rather than disrupt those who are trying to learn.

Those who are chronically violent or gang affiliated shouldn't be in a school at all.
Posted by SantaFe
Baton Rouge
Member since Apr 2019
6532 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:14 am to
quote:

You pretty much know by middle school who is cut out for college or not.


I could tell by the time they finish 3rd grade.

I taught here in BR in the inner city schools for 22 years and I have been saying that something drastic needs to happen with public education for some time now.

If a child can not master the multiplication tables up to 12 and do long division by the 5th grade then they are not quality university material ,sorry if I stub some toes there.
Posted by Wtodd
Tampa, FL
Member since Oct 2013
67482 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:14 am to
quote:

Is it time to reconsider mandatory public high school education?

Get rid of the Dept of Ed and the unions and the problems go away.
Posted by BourreTheDog
Member since May 2016
2309 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:14 am to
TRADE SCHOOLS IF FAILING PROFICIENCY AFTER 9th GRADE
This post was edited on 8/21/23 at 9:17 am
Posted by Salviati
Member since Apr 2006
5518 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:19 am to
We generally don't give minors the authority to make important decisions concerning their lives.

I don't think it's appropriate to give them that authority on this issue.
Posted by momentoftruth87
Member since Oct 2013
71409 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:19 am to
quote:

I believe students who do not show any interest in academic pursuits by freshman year of high school and who are chronically causing trouble should be diverted to a trade school where they can at least learn a functional skill rather than disrupt those who are trying to learn.


I get what you’re saying but that would be abused. Take away tax dollars to schools and make it a choice for parents. If a juvenile gets in trouble when they should be in school, or as a minor, charge the parents.

We don’t punish criminals yet wonder why we have accountability issues in our country.
Posted by LSUFanHouston
NOLA
Member since Jul 2009
37043 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:19 am to
quote:

Get rid of the Dept of Ed and the unions and the problems go away.


That's lazy talk.

Yes, there is overregulation in schools, it's a big problem, but a lot of that comes from the fact that school admins, left to their own devices, would be even worse.

And the unions... outside of a few major urban districts, the unions have no pull these days. And these problems aren't being caused by teachers / union members anyways, they are being caused by misbehaving teenagers.
Posted by LSUFanHouston
NOLA
Member since Jul 2009
37043 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:21 am to
quote:

We generally don't give minors the authority to make important decisions concerning their lives.

I don't think it's appropriate to give them that authority on this issue.


Then require parental consent. Don't parents know best?

And if the parents don't consent, and the kid continues to be a problem, no more IEP. Throw the kids out.
Posted by momentoftruth87
Member since Oct 2013
71409 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:21 am to
Regulation should be handled by the elected school board. We are way over regulated.
Posted by GetCocky11
Calgary, AB
Member since Oct 2012
51262 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:21 am to
quote:

Get rid of the Dept of Ed and the unions and the problems go away.



It is so easy! All those failing students will magically turn around and start becoming involved and productive once the Federal Dept of Education and teachers unions are eliminated!
Posted by GrammarKnotsi
Member since Feb 2013
9329 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:21 am to
quote:

Tell the 10 percent to shape up, or they can get out.



got a link to these stats ?
Posted by Swagga
504
Member since Dec 2009
16133 posts
Posted on 8/21/23 at 9:21 am to
Trade schools and military are the solution, but at some point it all comes back to parenting.
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