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How did the ancient Romans feel about the Roman Republic/Empire
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:37 pm
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:37 pm
I think sometimes that it's impossible for us to envision a world where the United States didn't exist, but it has only existed for around 242 years. This is a pretty paltry amount of time compared to how long some of the empires of the ancient world existed.
In particular, Rome with all of its power and influence in antiquity it fascinates me how Roman citizens particularly when Rome was at the height of its power could fathom a world where Rome as a nation did not exist and wonder just how much of a world ending catastrophe it did seem like when the barbarians sacked the capital and pretty much ended Roman influence in all of western Europe.
In particular, Rome with all of its power and influence in antiquity it fascinates me how Roman citizens particularly when Rome was at the height of its power could fathom a world where Rome as a nation did not exist and wonder just how much of a world ending catastrophe it did seem like when the barbarians sacked the capital and pretty much ended Roman influence in all of western Europe.
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:38 pm to BulldogXero
quote:
In particular, Rome with all of its power and influence in antiquity it fascinates me how Roman citizens particularly when Rome was at the height of its power could fathom a world where Rome as a nation did not exist and wonder just how much of a world ending catastrophe it did seem like when the barbarians sacked the capital and pretty much ended Roman influence in all of western Europe.
Wasn't as simplistic as you describe.
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:38 pm to BulldogXero
quote:
In particular, Rome with all of its power and influence in antiquity it fascinates me how Roman citizens particularly when Rome was at the height of its power could fathom a world where Rome as a nation did not exist and wonder just how much of a world ending catastrophe it did seem like when the barbarians sacked the capital and pretty much ended Roman influence in all of western Europe.
This is at least 4 sentences combined into one big string of nonsense
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:39 pm to BulldogXero
and i thought i was high
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:40 pm to BulldogXero
I believe they spent most of their time taking baths with hot naked men. So I imagine they felt pretty good about it.
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:40 pm to BulldogXero
Rome was already on the decline when it fell
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:41 pm to BulldogXero
In a world where trillhoging and pillaging was a legitimate threat, I'd imagine it was pretty awesome for them until the end.
They fricked everyone up and owned most of the known world.
They fricked everyone up and owned most of the known world.
This post was edited on 5/4/18 at 2:42 pm
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:42 pm to BulldogXero
They had long sticks with pointy things on the end
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:46 pm to BulldogXero
Just got done listening to the "History of Rome" podcast by Mike Duncan... great stuff if you haven't listened to it.
He does a great job of describing the day to day life of your average Roman throughout it's history. During Rome's height, your average Roman was not much different than you or I. They were concerned with their family and friends and had very little interest in the politics of Rome. The only time they would be pissed is if the monthly games were canceled or their monthly grain allotment was cut off. They were just people and the graffiti from the time backs that up.
Examples of Roman graffiti
He does a great job of describing the day to day life of your average Roman throughout it's history. During Rome's height, your average Roman was not much different than you or I. They were concerned with their family and friends and had very little interest in the politics of Rome. The only time they would be pissed is if the monthly games were canceled or their monthly grain allotment was cut off. They were just people and the graffiti from the time backs that up.
Examples of Roman graffiti
quote:
“Celadus makes the girls moan.”
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:48 pm to BulldogXero
The romans from fall of the republic era wouldn’t recognize the empire as it fell.
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:57 pm to BulldogXero
A few things.
By the time that Rome was sacked its power had been on the decline for quite a long time. And by that time One could argue that the power that was once centered in Rome transferred to the "East" at Constantinople.
As the Republic and later Empire expanded areas were "Romanized" to varying degrees. Some places identified with Rome more than others. While Rome may collect taxes and a Roman or Romanized elite would build buildings in a town many in the town might still cling to indigenous values and practices. Think Judea in the Bible.
The idea of a nation like the U.S. is modern. While the Imperial government collected taxes and provided a grain dole in Rome it had no where near the reach or affect on the lives of ordinary citizens as the U.S. gov't does today. Your average Roman knew very little about what was really going on outside of their town. They knew what the elite told them or whatever imperial propaganda was directed to them, or whatever the local cult priest told them.
Really the "Fall of the Roman Empire" is a theory. Some argue it never really fell it just turned into something else. Yes the city of Rome ceased to be the political and cultural center of the world but the people that felt the affect of that most were the people that actually lived in Rome and by the time that happened Rome's population was in decline.
By the time that Rome was sacked its power had been on the decline for quite a long time. And by that time One could argue that the power that was once centered in Rome transferred to the "East" at Constantinople.
As the Republic and later Empire expanded areas were "Romanized" to varying degrees. Some places identified with Rome more than others. While Rome may collect taxes and a Roman or Romanized elite would build buildings in a town many in the town might still cling to indigenous values and practices. Think Judea in the Bible.
The idea of a nation like the U.S. is modern. While the Imperial government collected taxes and provided a grain dole in Rome it had no where near the reach or affect on the lives of ordinary citizens as the U.S. gov't does today. Your average Roman knew very little about what was really going on outside of their town. They knew what the elite told them or whatever imperial propaganda was directed to them, or whatever the local cult priest told them.
Really the "Fall of the Roman Empire" is a theory. Some argue it never really fell it just turned into something else. Yes the city of Rome ceased to be the political and cultural center of the world but the people that felt the affect of that most were the people that actually lived in Rome and by the time that happened Rome's population was in decline.
Posted on 5/4/18 at 2:59 pm to Dire Wolf
I'm currently reading Mike Duncan's "The Storm before the Storm The Beginning of the End of the Roman Empire".
The first surprise was the detailed list of people involved 2000 years ago, all their names and their jobs and how long they could hold a job. Then comes the economy tied to those jobs....and what the masses expected as entertainment, even from those who had had jobs in non-lucrative destinations.
The situations were complex, and the movement of personalities within the government were also complex. ;
To answer the OP question, this book would give a feel for the sense of place at the time. Only a photographic memory could keep all the people straight (or even remembered in the next chapter.)
Lots of the political and military decision making is, at least, conceivable to me. Coming to the book remembering only the very basics, I've found this much more interesting that the history books had it in school (much less what littel Latin I and II mentioned.)
The first surprise was the detailed list of people involved 2000 years ago, all their names and their jobs and how long they could hold a job. Then comes the economy tied to those jobs....and what the masses expected as entertainment, even from those who had had jobs in non-lucrative destinations.
The situations were complex, and the movement of personalities within the government were also complex. ;
To answer the OP question, this book would give a feel for the sense of place at the time. Only a photographic memory could keep all the people straight (or even remembered in the next chapter.)
Lots of the political and military decision making is, at least, conceivable to me. Coming to the book remembering only the very basics, I've found this much more interesting that the history books had it in school (much less what littel Latin I and II mentioned.)
Posted on 5/4/18 at 3:00 pm to BulldogXero
The republic was weak and bloated and lots of people were on welfare and then Julius Caesar took over and made Rome great again
Posted on 5/4/18 at 3:06 pm to BulldogXero
What does Dan Carlin say? He is the history expert you heard me
Posted on 5/4/18 at 3:08 pm to BulldogXero
That's an interesting question.
A leading factor in decline of Roman rule was not growing its Navy to keep pace with its conquest, impaired the ability to supply and control the area's being conquered.
The continuing decline of the government and citizenry could have been either the cause or effect...... ?
A leading factor in decline of Roman rule was not growing its Navy to keep pace with its conquest, impaired the ability to supply and control the area's being conquered.
The continuing decline of the government and citizenry could have been either the cause or effect...... ?
Posted on 5/4/18 at 3:08 pm to Ancient Astronaut
quote:
What does Dan Carlin say? He is the history expert you heard me
Dan Carlin in the GOAT but Mike Duncan is the resident expert on all things Rome
Posted on 5/4/18 at 3:22 pm to lake chuck fan
One could also argue that the eroding of Roman Republican values, ignoring traditional Polical restraint/decorum in pursuit of power by elites, and the watering down of military requirements and in turn watering down the Roman army was the cause of the “fall” of Rome
Posted on 5/4/18 at 3:31 pm to BulldogXero
quote:
In particular, Rome with all of its power and influence in antiquity it fascinates me how Roman citizens particularly when Rome was at the height of its power could fathom a world where Rome as a nation did not exist and wonder just how much of a world ending catastrophe it did seem like when the barbarians sacked the capital and pretty much ended Roman influence in all of western Europe.
Nailed it
Posted on 5/4/18 at 3:32 pm to BulldogXero
Cultcha was their downfall.
Posted on 5/4/18 at 3:33 pm to Oilfieldbiology
I believe that the rise in the Catholic church and the Bishop of Milan, Ambrose, had a great deal to do with the fall of Rome. Although the Roman empire was a shell of itself by the time Ambrose rose to power, he proved that the people in charge had no real power and challenged them at every turn with no real consequences. It also set the precedent for the power that the church as today. If he had not stood up to the weak Roman emperors of the time like he did with no consequence the church would not have as much power as it does today.
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