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Message
re: How can one abuse "Unlimited PTO"?
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:16 am to upgrayedd
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:16 am to upgrayedd
quote:
That's exactly what this is. Tech companies started doing this and found that people actually took less PTO because they were afraid of being seen as abusing it. Another added benefit is that of you leave or get terminated, they don't have to pay you shite.
DINGDING
This is one of the biggest reasons, it saves companies a shitload of money on average
1
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:17 am to Bard
quote:
Standard work year is 2080 hours. I would say going below 90% of that (208 hours, or 5.2 5-day work weeks) would be cause for management to take notice, going below 85% (312 hours, or 7.8 5-day work weeks) would be getting into the abusive territory.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:19 am to Fun Bunch
quote:
it saves companies a shitload of money on average
Isn't that only if the PTO is earned. If it is granted, I don't believe they don't have to pay it out.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:22 am to upgrayedd
quote:
Another added benefit is that of you leave or get terminated, they don't have to pay you shite.
That depends on several things but is often the case.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:29 am to LSUfan4444
quote:
Isn't that only if the PTO is earned. If it is granted, I don't believe they don't have to pay it out.
What's the difference?
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:30 am to WhiskeyThrottle
Talk about a hr minefield. Better hope they’re consistent.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:36 am to WhiskeyThrottle
Peer pressure would be intense. You can bet co workers are keeping up with it.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:37 am to WhiskeyThrottle
quote:
In the world of ambiguity, does this cross over to "abuse" in your mind? And what would you interpret as "abuse" if this were the policy where you worked?
Abuse meaning you're out so much you're not getting your job done. We have it at my current job and had it at my last job as well. I probably still took off ~2-3 weeks.
This post was edited on 8/7/23 at 11:38 am
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:39 am to WhiskeyThrottle
I like having a set number of days. I get 28 days per year at this point. Nobody can call me out for abusing taking days that I earned per corporate policy. Plus I can rollover a good bit.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:44 am to LSUfan4444
quote:
Bring it. Let the lazy-asses out themselves.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:44 am to WhiskeyThrottle
quote:
The company did this undoubtedly for their benefit.
The unused PTO doesn't show up as a liability on the balance sheet.
Some companies do this to dress up the books prior to being sold.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:47 am to LSUfan4444
quote:
Isn't that only if the PTO is earned. If it is granted, I don't believe they don't have to pay it out.
PTO = Paid Time Off. If they aren't paying it out then it's UTO (Unpaid Time Off).
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:48 am to fallguy_1978
Here you go, this is paid time off
planned vacation
Planned drs appt
Sick(Dr. Excuse)
Death in family
Go out of state for any unexpected good reason
Any diaster(car accident, hurricane, etc)
If you are in good standing, you could actually put in early for ex. for a friday off because you're going to the lsu/florida game in florida, possibly also.
I assume if ur taking "last minute" days off here and a day there, they may consider it abuse because they "are still paying" you for being off. Understandable.
My dad worked in the Oilfield for a major company for 35 yrs. He always had 2 weeks of paid vacation per year. He worked 7/7. So he would be off for his regular 7 days off, then he would have his week vacay off, then had his regular week off again. So in reality he had 2, 3 week vacations per year. He did this for 3 decades. He would never miss otherwise....
Im an OT baller , i own a health club, so off or not, im always on vacation.
planned vacation
Planned drs appt
Sick(Dr. Excuse)
Death in family
Go out of state for any unexpected good reason
Any diaster(car accident, hurricane, etc)
If you are in good standing, you could actually put in early for ex. for a friday off because you're going to the lsu/florida game in florida, possibly also.
I assume if ur taking "last minute" days off here and a day there, they may consider it abuse because they "are still paying" you for being off. Understandable.
My dad worked in the Oilfield for a major company for 35 yrs. He always had 2 weeks of paid vacation per year. He worked 7/7. So he would be off for his regular 7 days off, then he would have his week vacay off, then had his regular week off again. So in reality he had 2, 3 week vacations per year. He did this for 3 decades. He would never miss otherwise....
Im an OT baller , i own a health club, so off or not, im always on vacation.
This post was edited on 8/7/23 at 11:57 am
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:51 am to 3nOut
quote:
one of the companies i resell with has unlimited PTO as long as you're meeting QBR numbers. most of them don't seem to abuse it, but one of my peers met his year end goals early in the year and went on vacation all the time with very strict "no contact" emails.
He gets paid by the task.
In most jobs they need you to be present.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:52 am to 3nOut
quote:
one of my peers met his year end goals early in the year and went on vacation all the time with very strict "no contact" emails.
Sounds like a guy who’s content to do just enough to avoid getting fired. Businesses tend to frown on that.
I’m not saying you have to be a total company man, but companies generally hire people TO BE THERE.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 11:59 am to WhiskeyThrottle
OP, I have experienced this from the other side, as first-line manager of a department whose employees received "unlimited PTO."
Our HR department was adamant about the benefit being real and the "unlimited" description being accurate. When I had people (in my opinion) abusing the situation, I was told that it wasn't really our call to make (referring to me and the middle manager for whom I worked).
A hypothetical example I asked about was "what if an employee uses her 'unlimited PTO' to extend paid maternity leave beyond its usual duration?". Basically, what if someone submits for maternity leave and also for an additional 2-3 weeks of "unlimited PTO" immediately after?
I was told this was 100% kosher and that it wasn't my role to question it.
As a result, I had to be extremely diligent about 1) documenting poor performance when actually working; and 2) enforcing the rules we could enforce, about things like giving me advance notice for PTO.
This all sounds pretty bad for a manager, and it was, but frankly it was no worse than the issues created by old-timers with lots of PTO blocking off big vacations months in advance. That's equally infuriating for someone trying to meet deadlines.
Our HR department was adamant about the benefit being real and the "unlimited" description being accurate. When I had people (in my opinion) abusing the situation, I was told that it wasn't really our call to make (referring to me and the middle manager for whom I worked).
A hypothetical example I asked about was "what if an employee uses her 'unlimited PTO' to extend paid maternity leave beyond its usual duration?". Basically, what if someone submits for maternity leave and also for an additional 2-3 weeks of "unlimited PTO" immediately after?
I was told this was 100% kosher and that it wasn't my role to question it.
As a result, I had to be extremely diligent about 1) documenting poor performance when actually working; and 2) enforcing the rules we could enforce, about things like giving me advance notice for PTO.
This all sounds pretty bad for a manager, and it was, but frankly it was no worse than the issues created by old-timers with lots of PTO blocking off big vacations months in advance. That's equally infuriating for someone trying to meet deadlines.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 12:03 pm to WhiskeyThrottle
I'd use the same math as dating girls younger than you.
Dating: 1/2 your age + 7yrs
Unlimited PTO: #weeks vacation prior to Unlimited + 7days.
Dating: 1/2 your age + 7yrs
Unlimited PTO: #weeks vacation prior to Unlimited + 7days.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 12:53 pm to WhiskeyThrottle
I’d say a logical definition would be if you take so much time off that it causes a drop in productivity
However, to me it seems like a way to get rid of employees they don’t like since they’re leaving it subjective.
However, to me it seems like a way to get rid of employees they don’t like since they’re leaving it subjective.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 12:54 pm to TigerGman
quote:
What's the difference?
Earned is accrued through the year. Granted is available all on jan 1 to take but not "earned" during pay periods.
Posted on 8/7/23 at 12:56 pm to WhiskeyThrottle
This is why unlimited PTO is bad
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