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Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:12 pm to L.A.
Yeah, I love all of these evangelical preachers judging others because they are the most full of shite sinners on the planet. In my hometown, the Baptist Chuch largely runs shite since like maybe 1/3rd of the town attends it. One of the teenagers came out to the minister saying that he’s struggling with homosexual feelings and that he doesn’t want to go to hell, and the preacher repaid this confidentiality by outing him to the entire church saying we no longer feel comfortable with you being here.
Later my mother personally started a petition to make our county wet to sell alcohol (we were completely surrounded by wet counties, so simply lost tax revenue), and she got enough signatures for it to go to vote. Somehow the preacher got his hands on the petition (corruption) and he called out all the members of the congregation that signed the petition and said they also weren’t welcome in their congregation anymore.
Well a few months later, the preacher gets caught fricking his secretary, and then for whatever reason, he becomes all about forgiveness at that point and cries how he’s sinned and should be forgiven for it. Well he was fired, but that was pretty fricking eye opening for some of the bigger Bible thumpers I grew up with.
Later my mother personally started a petition to make our county wet to sell alcohol (we were completely surrounded by wet counties, so simply lost tax revenue), and she got enough signatures for it to go to vote. Somehow the preacher got his hands on the petition (corruption) and he called out all the members of the congregation that signed the petition and said they also weren’t welcome in their congregation anymore.
Well a few months later, the preacher gets caught fricking his secretary, and then for whatever reason, he becomes all about forgiveness at that point and cries how he’s sinned and should be forgiven for it. Well he was fired, but that was pretty fricking eye opening for some of the bigger Bible thumpers I grew up with.
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:13 pm to N2cars
quote:
Sin is all equal to God. Different worldly consequences, of course, but to God, a sin is a sin.
From a general human perspective, this is probably my biggest objection to the applicable Protestant Christian denominations. If one is saved through faith alone, all sin is equal in the eyes of god, and all people sin… that’s a pretty nasty recipe for hand waving some fairly horrific behavior.
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:18 pm to Pettifogger
quote:
I think any big church centered around a single big personality, regardless how wholesome or correctly focused, has a greater risk of issues like this.
Yep. Cult of personality is a real issue in any large church, especially the ARC (Healing Place, Church of the Highlands, Radiant, etc) churches that purposely look for a certain mold in a lead pastor.
It's a stench.
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:20 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
From a general human perspective, this is probably my biggest objection to the applicable Protestant Christian denominations. If one is saved through faith alone, all sin is equal in the eyes of god, and all people sin… that’s a pretty nasty recipe for hand waving some fairly horrific behavior.
Only if you don't actually understand the weight and cost of your sin. "He who is forgiven much, loves much."
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:21 pm to Joshjrn
quote:a lot of non Cathloic require a profession of faith
Protestant Christian denominations. If one is saved through faith alone
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:33 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
If one is saved through faith alone, all sin is equal in the eyes of god, and all people sin… that’s a pretty nasty recipe for hand waving some fairly horrific behavior.
Worldly punishments are not necessarily the same as our eternal judgement. Even in the Old Testament, God prescribed different worldly punishments for different offenses.
When it comes our salvation, He makes no such distinction because all sin separates us from Him, regardless of how we ourselves would evaluate it.
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:36 pm to AbitaFan08
quote:
Anyone who devotes themselves to any of these insane cult churches deserves to have their money taken…I mean tithed…from them.
quote:
AbitaFan08
Lmao
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:37 pm to Dadren
quote:
Worldly punishments are not necessarily the same as our eternal judgement. Even in the Old Testament, God prescribed different worldly punishments for different offenses. When it comes our salvation, He makes no such distinction because all sin separates us from Him, regardless of how we ourselves would evaluate it.
All fine and good. I’m simply explaining that, for those of us who are a bit more concerned about the here and now, it’s a perspective that’s a touch disconcerting.
This post was edited on 6/11/24 at 9:38 pm
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:38 pm to clamdip
quote:
Only if you don't actually understand the weight and cost of your sin. "He who is forgiven much, loves much."
Please expound?
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:45 pm to faraway
quote:
Paul's past was before he was converted and Paul was not an official church leader. that part matters a lot. church leaders who commit certain sins are disqualified as church leaders. it's a serious matter to God.
One is never disqualified from spreading the gospel of Christ, though. In case you are oblivious, Paul was a missionary. no disqualifications for that role except one needs to be a follower of Christ.
When you say “church leader” what do you mean? I’d say that the apostle Paul was a church leader considering his role in Acts.
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:45 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
All fine and good. I’m simply explaining that, for those of us who are a bit more concerned about the here and now, it’s a perspective that’s a touch disconcerting.
I would say that anyone who would make that argument has no biblical support, and anybody who actually believes this stuff and has given a little thought to their faith would recognize an argument like this as nonsense.
Hopefully that alleviates some of your concern.
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:48 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
Please expound?
Cheap Grace vs Costly Grace
Deitrich Bonnhoffer (sp) wrote a great book about how grace as perceived by the convert. Some look at it as very cheap because it costs us nothing, but others as costly because what it cost Christ.
The thought is that a deeply sinful and vile person when saved, and truly repents is often more zealous in their commitment than a child convert that hasn’t ever really felt like they were rescued while standing at the gates of hell.
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:49 pm to Dadren
Never heard of him.
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:50 pm to L.A.
Might have messed around with a little boy or something
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:50 pm to N2cars
quote:
Sin is all equal to God.
Different worldly consequences, of course, but to God, a sin is a sin.
If that were true there wouldn't be 10 commandments. There would be hundreds of commandments. Or none, depending on how you look at it.
God clearly thinks some sins are worse than others. Anyone with common sense knows that some sins are worse than others and I assume God has common sense. Would you want to live in a country where the punishment for murder was the same as the punishment for jaywalking? We are rational beings, made in the image of God. Surely God is a rational being. He would have to be irrational to believe that, say, the theft of a piece of bread was the same as rape or murder.
This post was edited on 6/11/24 at 10:15 pm
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:54 pm to sparkinator
quote:
Cheap Grace vs Costly Grace Deitrich Bonnhoffer (sp) wrote a great book about how grace as perceived by the convert. Some look at it as very cheap because it costs us nothing, but others as costly because what it cost Christ. The thought is that a deeply sinful and vile person when saved, and truly repents is often more zealous in their commitment than a child convert that hasn’t ever really felt like they were rescued while standing at the gates of hell.
That makes sense. With that said, I’m more referring to the already religiously professed more than I am the convert.
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:55 pm to L.A.
The higher your horse, the harder the fall.
Posted on 6/11/24 at 9:55 pm to L.A.
quote:
Is this a big of a deal as, say, Jimmy Swaggert's downfall?
I don't think any of them or a big deal, I assume most of them are doing something that could eventually catch up with them.
Posted on 6/11/24 at 10:04 pm to Dadren
quote:
I would say that anyone who would make that argument has no biblical support, and anybody who actually believes this stuff and has given a little thought to their faith would recognize an argument like this as nonsense. Hopefully that alleviates some of your concern.
I’ve very rarely found myself antagonistic towards the deeply religious; I may (and frequently do) fundamentally disagree with them on a litany of topics, but I respect where they are coming from on a philosophical level.
On the other hand, I frequently find myself antagonistic towards the facially religious, who are willing to forgive anything of themselves as one of the “faithful” while using their religiosity as a bludgeon against all others.
If the Christian god exists, I suppose there’s some solace to their having already received their reward in full, but that doesn’t act as much of a balm for those of us concerned about the here and now.
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