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re: If the goal is to win Superbowls
Posted on 3/8/23 at 4:10 pm to RUFshreve
Posted on 3/8/23 at 4:10 pm to RUFshreve
...if the goal is to win Super Bowls, making the playoffs is a helpful first step.
Derek Carr is a proven NFL QB who every analyst around says instantly makes the Saints the NFCS favorites and hence playoff bound.
We don't know how the draft will shake out, what breakout players will emerge, how healthy we stay, which impactful injuries will bite other teams...
TEAMS TO WIN SUPER BOWLS RECENTLY WHEN NOT THE BEST TEAM or had significant flaws:
2007 NYG
2011 NYG
2012 Ravens
2015 Broncos
2017 Eagles
2018 Pats
2020 Bucs
Eli won 2 Super Bowls in years where there were at least 3-4 other teams that were objectively more talented and overall just a better TEAM, but Eli's Giants got hot at the right time while their competition managed to play poorly at the wrong time.
Flacco and the Ravens were an "okay" good team. No one looks at that team as some sort of example of greatness.
2015 Broncos, Peyton's arm was falling off.
Nick FREAKING FOLES lifted the Lombardi--the perfect example of "any given Sunday".
The 2018 Pats would've been skulldrug by the 2018 Saints if not for the refs assfrickery in the NFCCG.
2020 Bucs only advanced to the championship round because Jared Cook is an athletic, high functioning retard.
Moral of the story:
Shut the frick up and enjoy it. The Saints still have a well above average roster talent-wise and reside in a crazy-weak division. Almost any respectable analyst is expecting a playoff run... from there anything is possible!
ALSO: Shut the frick up about the salary cap. It OBVIOUSLY isn't anything close to the problem it always gets framed as. We were supposed to be in cap hell in 2016 and then went 2017-2020 as the winningest team in the NFL.
Derek Carr is a proven NFL QB who every analyst around says instantly makes the Saints the NFCS favorites and hence playoff bound.
We don't know how the draft will shake out, what breakout players will emerge, how healthy we stay, which impactful injuries will bite other teams...
TEAMS TO WIN SUPER BOWLS RECENTLY WHEN NOT THE BEST TEAM or had significant flaws:
2007 NYG
2011 NYG
2012 Ravens
2015 Broncos
2017 Eagles
2018 Pats
2020 Bucs
Eli won 2 Super Bowls in years where there were at least 3-4 other teams that were objectively more talented and overall just a better TEAM, but Eli's Giants got hot at the right time while their competition managed to play poorly at the wrong time.
Flacco and the Ravens were an "okay" good team. No one looks at that team as some sort of example of greatness.
2015 Broncos, Peyton's arm was falling off.
Nick FREAKING FOLES lifted the Lombardi--the perfect example of "any given Sunday".
The 2018 Pats would've been skulldrug by the 2018 Saints if not for the refs assfrickery in the NFCCG.
2020 Bucs only advanced to the championship round because Jared Cook is an athletic, high functioning retard.
Moral of the story:
Shut the frick up and enjoy it. The Saints still have a well above average roster talent-wise and reside in a crazy-weak division. Almost any respectable analyst is expecting a playoff run... from there anything is possible!
ALSO: Shut the frick up about the salary cap. It OBVIOUSLY isn't anything close to the problem it always gets framed as. We were supposed to be in cap hell in 2016 and then went 2017-2020 as the winningest team in the NFL.
0
Posted on 3/8/23 at 4:44 pm to RUFshreve
If Rodgers is traded, and the Falcons/Redskins do not get Lamar Jackson, both of which are likely. Then. Carr is a top 5 QB in the NFC based on experience and ability combined. We can win the division the next three seasons and anything can happen in the NFC playoffs. So yes this move makes contenders in the NFC. Then it’s one game where the ball can bounce however.
Posted on 3/8/23 at 5:20 pm to RUFshreve
quote:From what I've read, 80% of the board wants to disband the team for 3-4 years, and then suddenly decide to start trying to play football again hoping to roll a hard 6. Sounds great on a message board, but maybe not so much in reality.
it seems 80% of the board supports the move
But yes, the Bengals did intentionally decide to suck for most of the past 3 decades so they could draft Joe Burrow. I bet that was a joyous and much appreciated 30 year wait for the Bengals fan.
Posted on 3/8/23 at 5:24 pm to drizztiger
Posted on 3/8/23 at 6:12 pm to 3PieceSpicy
quote:
So you don’t think the Bengals fans were excited about their rebuild situation with Joe Burrow when they drafted him?
You mean when they absolutely blew for years and then lucked into a generational talent? They hit the lottery of course they were excited. Yeah the Saints should try to imitate the Bengals.
Posted on 3/8/23 at 6:20 pm to St Augustine
quote:
Absolutely none of this is incorrect. Enjoy the hail of downvotes coming your way
Who gives a frick about downvotes? Now that's some loser mentality shite. Like being the most popular kid in the special Ed class.
Now, tell me which point specifically is wrong. Can't wait to be educated by you.
Posted on 3/8/23 at 6:25 pm to BayouBlitz
quote:
So what amazing QB is available that you would have jumped on?
Exactly.
Reading comprehension isn't your strong suit, so let me simply it for you. There are none.
That's the whole fricking point. And overpaying for a guy like Carr, just to max out on a wildcard loss is ignorant, if the goal is to really compete for rings. Now if the goal is just to sell tickets, like some here have pointed out, then yeah I get it.
That's why I said in the OP, I get it from the FO's perspective. Just don't understand why a single fan would be happy about it.
We essentially just locked ourselves into mediocrity for 3-4 years. Yay?
Posted on 3/8/23 at 6:30 pm to RUFshreve
I would have rather done a true rebuild with a drafted QB because that gives you the largest cap room by having your starting QB on a rookie contract. I know that’s easier said than done but I only would have gone the vet route if there were another young QB that had potential. Those don’t come along often which made us signing Brees at 26 am outlier and we only got him because of his shoulder injury and the Miami Dolphins doctors. The team around Carr isn’t good enough to make a big run and we don’t have the money to be players in free agency so it will require drafting well. We are basically paying our QB win now money with a roster in rebuild. It doesn’t make smart football or business sense.
This post was edited on 3/8/23 at 6:32 pm
Posted on 3/8/23 at 6:40 pm to LSUPilot07
Exactly my thoughts. This move caps our potential past this year.
The FO is behaving as if this roster is ready to compete and it's just not anymore. I'm shocked so many fans are supporting these decisions.
The FO is behaving as if this roster is ready to compete and it's just not anymore. I'm shocked so many fans are supporting these decisions.
Posted on 3/8/23 at 7:56 pm to RUFshreve
quote:
Now if your goal is to save Allen's job for another year or two, and remain competitive in the worst division in football, and a wildcard playoff exit, then this move makes sense
The vast majority of Saints Talk is still in the dark about this. They really think the Saints are all of a sudden a contender with a bunch of retreads from the Raiders who have all been career losers.
Posted on 3/8/23 at 8:00 pm to RUFshreve
Some fans can’t separate their hearts from common sense. I want the Saints to win too but it’s not happening on an ever aging team with vets on contracts with huge cap hits coming because they continually kick the can down the road so you’re left with some players you have to keep a year or maybe more than you should have and you have to play them because they make so much. I’m confident Cam and Demario will live up to their deals but guys like Mathieu and Peat seem cocked. Ramcsyck and his big contract are worrisome too because he’s got a degenerative knee that can only be managed and will get worse as he ages.
This post was edited on 3/8/23 at 8:04 pm
Posted on 3/9/23 at 2:53 am to St Augustine
quote:
Our best players are getting old, our head coach has never been a winning HC, our starting QB has never won anything meaningful, after almost a decade in the league. Our cap situation is arguably the worst in the league and instead of biting the bullet and using the time to wipe the slate clean and rebuild the right way, we're still kicking the can down the road like we have a chance to compete with this team.
Absolutely none of this is incorrect. Enjoy the hail of downvotes coming your way
Which parts? We do have some solid young talent but some of our anchor players are getting up their in age.
Our head coach won back to back games for the first time last season....
Carr quite literally hasn't won anything meaningful. His playoff record after 10 seasons is 0-1.
Our cap situation absolutely is arguably the worst in the league.
Which part of the above is incorrect?
Posted on 3/9/23 at 6:42 am to RUFshreve
Why would you wipe the slate clean and rebuild when you have a top 5 defense. With a defense like that you just have to get in the playoffs and anything can happen. People have this Tom Brady/Pat Mahomes delusion where you have to be a Super Bowl favorite every year. Look at last Super Bowl winners over the last 20 years or so. Plenty of average quarterbacks backed up by elite defense.
I don’t get the mindset of “if the goal is to win super bowls why do this” do you realize how rare it is for a generational type qb to pop up in the draft and then also be in position to draft said player? Such a spoiled fan base that thinks the only way to be happy is to draft a generational quarterback and be superbowl favorites for years to come. Much higher percentage chance of drafting a bust.
I don’t get the mindset of “if the goal is to win super bowls why do this” do you realize how rare it is for a generational type qb to pop up in the draft and then also be in position to draft said player? Such a spoiled fan base that thinks the only way to be happy is to draft a generational quarterback and be superbowl favorites for years to come. Much higher percentage chance of drafting a bust.
Posted on 3/9/23 at 8:28 am to 3PieceSpicy
quote:
So you don’t think the Bengals fans were excited about their rebuild situation with Joe Burrow when they drafted him? You don’t think they weren’t absolutely gassed up for the last 1-2 months of their 1-15 season when they had a future hall of fame QB from Ohio waiting for them w the first pick?
I’m sure they loved their 185-260-3 record with 0 playoff wins and 1st round picks like Akili Smith, David Klingler, Ki-Jana Carter, Peter Warrick and Chris Perry after Sam Wyche left the team. Is that what you want? Because it sounds like that’s what you want.
Posted on 3/9/23 at 9:23 am to LSUPilot07
SOOOO Tired!
This is maybe a good 3-4 year window, and you have to hope you can put all the other pieces in place in time.
by year 5, if that rookie QB turned into what you hoped, he's getting PAID and you're in the same spot.
QB is the SINGLE MOST important position in ALL OF SPORTS to get right.
How many years of watching the ...Browns, Bengals, Lions, Jets, Raiders, Redskins, Texans... all try the "tank and get cap space and get our QB in the draft" route and just end up sucking, and sucking, and sucking.
It's like some of you people don't live in reality...
This is maybe a good 3-4 year window, and you have to hope you can put all the other pieces in place in time.
by year 5, if that rookie QB turned into what you hoped, he's getting PAID and you're in the same spot.
QB is the SINGLE MOST important position in ALL OF SPORTS to get right.
How many years of watching the ...Browns, Bengals, Lions, Jets, Raiders, Redskins, Texans... all try the "tank and get cap space and get our QB in the draft" route and just end up sucking, and sucking, and sucking.
It's like some of you people don't live in reality...
Posted on 3/9/23 at 9:49 am to RUFshreve
quote:
If the goal is to win Superbowls
It's not. Detroit, Jacksonville, New York Jets, Houston, Cleveland etc aren't trying to win a Super Bowl.
Posted on 3/9/23 at 11:00 pm to saintsfan1977
quote:
It's not. Detroit, Jacksonville, New York Jets, Houston, Cleveland etc aren't trying to win a Super Bowl.
And yet all but one of those teams(Houston) has a better chance at winning a SB than us in the next 3-4 years.
Posted on 3/10/23 at 3:17 am to pankReb
quote:
Which part of the above is incorrect?
Not me going back to re-read the post and seeing you were actually agreeing who you quoted.
Posted on 3/10/23 at 11:51 pm to RUFshreve
quote:
And yet all but one of those teams(Houston) has a better chance at winning a SB than us in the next 3-4 years.
Lol, I don’t think so. I’ll take our chances over all of those teams of just getting to the Super Bowl. Easily.
Jacksonville may have the better coach and qb of that group but play in the AFC against way better QBs that will be in their prime the next 3-4 years, so it’s highly unlikely they ever get there.
This post was edited on 3/10/23 at 11:52 pm
Posted on 3/10/23 at 11:56 pm to RUFshreve
We had Payton and breez for 16 years and won 1 Superbowl. Without carr the saints turn back into the laughing stock of the NFL. Getting carr keeps us relevant . Pick up a young QB and keep things rolling for the future. Not long ago no free agents wanted to come to Nola. Don't go backward.
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