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re: The Official NBA Free Agency/Offseason Thread Update: MITCHELL TO CLE
Posted on 7/11/22 at 11:40 am to Mad Scientist26
Posted on 7/11/22 at 11:40 am to Mad Scientist26
Jonas is cheaper and we have control for 2 years whereas Turner is not only more expensive this season but he will be looking for a big contract once he becomes a free agent after the season.
0
Posted on 7/11/22 at 11:45 am to PELsu
quote:right but there’s a lot of moving water between ayton signing an offer sheet and actually signing a contract with Indy. PHX has several days to match and they aren’t going to let ayton walk for nothing. So I would say that of all the possible outcomes ayton signing outright (after PHX declines to match) is the least likely to happen
If Ayton signs outright, then he is out of Durant discussions.
Posted on 7/11/22 at 11:53 am to PELsu
The idea of Myles Turner is better than the player, IMO. It would be worth consideration if he was a better rebounder, but we would get killed on the boards with a Turner/Zion front court.
Posted on 7/11/22 at 11:54 am to cgrand
Would it be better to be a FA next year?
I heard some people say that Ayton might just pick up his option and be an UFA next summer. It's a bit of a risk. But if he doesn't get a max deal. Then it might be worth the gamble..
I heard some people say that Ayton might just pick up his option and be an UFA next summer. It's a bit of a risk. But if he doesn't get a max deal. Then it might be worth the gamble..
This post was edited on 7/11/22 at 11:55 am
Posted on 7/11/22 at 11:56 am to Epic Cajun
quote:
but we would get killed on the boards with a Turner/Zion front court.
That's the biggest issue IMO.
You would basically need 1-3 to all be Josh Hart clones to make up the interior rebounding deficiencies.
Of course Zion should also be a lot better defensive rebounder than he is...
Posted on 7/11/22 at 12:04 pm to Mad Scientist26
quote:
I’m team Jonas because A.) he’s better than Myles Turner B.) He wants to be here C.) I’m not for change just for change sake. We finally have consistency and a winning team. Let’s not mess up team chemistry for the sake of doing it.
Not disagreeing with you and don’t want to debate who is better, as I love how much Jonas has bought in and fits with the current culture. But from a purely, on-court “fit” argument, I think Turner is still slightly better. Now that we have CJ to pair with BI and Zion, Val’s strengths on the offensive end are not nearly as needed as they were to start last year. Turner’s rim protection is a skillset that is missing from this roster and Turner won’t be as easily played off the floor come playoff time. I will say that one thing Val obviously does do better on the defensive end is rebound. I would worry about our defensive rebounding with Turner until Zion and BI start picking it up on that end.
Posted on 7/11/22 at 12:15 pm to cgrand
quote:
quote:
right but there’s a lot of moving water between ayton signing an offer sheet and actually signing a contract with Indy. PHX has several days to match and they aren’t going to let ayton walk for nothing. So I would say that of all the possible outcomes ayton signing outright (after PHX declines to match) is the least likely to happen
I’m not completely sure what you mean by any of this. If Ayton signs the offer sheet, Phoenix either matches or doesn’t. The end.
If Phoenix were offering the max to sign direct, this would be over already.
Would Phoenix match the offer? That’s still to be determined. But the second he signs an offer sheet, he is not in the immediate Durant discussion.
I’m fairly confident he ends up sign and traded to Indy, but for very very little return beyond the ability for Phoenix to make additional maneuvers.
This post was edited on 7/11/22 at 12:17 pm
Posted on 7/11/22 at 12:23 pm to PELsu
Regarding Jonas vs Turner, I have struggled so much with that idea. Contract wise, I’m sure Turner would extend if traded, so the years don’t bother me. It would probably be in the $20 million a year range, so while the dollars don’t directly bother me, that is a fair amount more than Jonas and we are pinching pennies.
On the court, he solves a lot of things. And it sounds great on paper. Until you see them on the court and realize Jonas can pick up and toss Turner wherever he wanted. All things mentioned above are true. Rebounding would be a major issue, and Turner’s shooting is wildly overrated IMO.
But it sure would be nice to have Turner and Herb on defense. And we could be way more athletic as a team. Tough call.
On the court, he solves a lot of things. And it sounds great on paper. Until you see them on the court and realize Jonas can pick up and toss Turner wherever he wanted. All things mentioned above are true. Rebounding would be a major issue, and Turner’s shooting is wildly overrated IMO.
But it sure would be nice to have Turner and Herb on defense. And we could be way more athletic as a team. Tough call.
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:08 pm to PELsu
quote:
If Ayton signs the offer sheet, Phoenix either matches or doesn’t. The end.
they can decline and let him leave, least likely.
they can match and keep him, second most likely.
they can match and agree to a sign & trade with Indy during which they can add in Brooklyn and other teams if needed and expand the trade (for Durant)...most likely
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:11 pm to cgrand
quote:
they can match and agree to a sign & trade with Indy during which they can add in Brooklyn and other teams if needed and expand the trade (for Durant)...most likely
I don't think this is true unless this changed in a cba and I didn't know.
If he signs the offer sheet only two things can happen: The let him walk, or they match and he is there for the entire next season.
If they want to sign and trade him, he doesn't sign an offer sheet.
This post was edited on 7/11/22 at 3:12 pm
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:13 pm to Fun Bunch
I'm pretty sure Lonzo signed an offer sheet with Chicago last year.
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:15 pm to cgrand
quote:
they can match and agree to a sign & trade with Indy during which they can add in Brooklyn and other teams if needed and expand the trade (for Durant)...most likely
If Ayton signs an offer sheet they can only match, a S&T is off the table once an offer sheet is signed. But before letting Ayton sign an offer sheet Indy will see if Phoenix wants to turn it into a S&T since there's a chance they can get something else they want out of the deal.
I don't know what the most likely end result is, but the most preferred goal by all parties involved is Indy tries to turn getting Ayton into a bigger deal.
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:17 pm to TigerinATL
If Ayton can’t get along with Monty 2.0, I struggle to see him getting along with Rick Carlisle.
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:17 pm to CP3forMVP
I don't think so. He may have "agreed" with Chicago and we agreed to a S&T, but he didn't sign an actual offer sheet.
from nba.com
from nba.com
quote:
Negotiate a sign-and-trade if he hasn’t signed an offer sheet with another team.
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:17 pm to CP3forMVP
quote:
I'm pretty sure Lonzo signed an offer sheet with Chicago last year.
No he didn't. The tampering investigation happened not because he signed an offer sheet at 6:00 pm that we had 2 days to match, but because a full S&T was announced at 6:00pm that required not only Lonzo agreeing to a deal, but Chicago/NOLA agreeing to a trade and Temple agreeing to a S&T as well.
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:20 pm to TigerinATL
A “sign and trade” is an actual legal agreement. It’s a contract the player signs. Completely different than a restricted player offer sheet signed.
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:28 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
No he didn't. The tampering investigation happened not because he signed an offer sheet at 6:00 pm that we had 2 days to match, but because a full S&T was announced at 6:00pm that required not only Lonzo agreeing to a deal, but Chicago/NOLA agreeing to a trade and Temple agreeing to a S&T as well.
I don't know, you may be right, I just know if you go back and read all the stories regarding that deal they all say he signed an offer sheet to execute the sign and trade. For example:
quote:
The moment NBA free agency opened at 6 p.m. ET on Monday, Lonzo Ball agreed to a four-year, $85 million offer sheet with the Chicago Bulls, according to The Athletic's Shams Charania. The deal is part of a sign-and-trade
quote:
As had been expected, Lonzo Ball has agreed to a four-year, $85 million offer sheet with the Chicago Bulls, leading to a sign-and-trade with the New Orleans Pelicans, a story broken by Adrian Wojnarowski of ESPN and confirmed by K.C. Johnson
This post was edited on 7/11/22 at 3:32 pm
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:30 pm to CP3forMVP
Again, a sign and trade is a contractual agreement being offered.
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:30 pm to CP3forMVP
"agreed to" =/= "signed"
Posted on 7/11/22 at 3:37 pm to Fun Bunch
I’m actually starting to doubt myself to be honest. Something I found:
“ Trade Limitations — After exercising a Right of First Refusal, the team cannot trade that player for one year without the player’s consent. Even with the player’s consent, he cannot be traded to the team whose Offer Sheet was matched for one year.”
Aka, he can be traded if he agrees, and not to team that made offer
“ Trade Limitations — After exercising a Right of First Refusal, the team cannot trade that player for one year without the player’s consent. Even with the player’s consent, he cannot be traded to the team whose Offer Sheet was matched for one year.”
Aka, he can be traded if he agrees, and not to team that made offer
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