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Message
re: 6/4/2025: State of the Pelicans with Joe Dumars
Posted on 6/5/25 at 2:20 am to Delusional
Posted on 6/5/25 at 2:20 am to Delusional
quote:
I can see being patient with Z - don't have much of a choice. Willie? i dont see why he's able to stick around.
Agreed. Zion came into the season overweight as usual, got hurt as usual, then came back in the best shape + playing his best since his 2nd season. I really think that the "injury" that got him shut down late in the season was a tank move. His value is too damaged to be worth trading right now. I'm not against trading Zion, but him staying healthy and in shape is the only chance this team has at being relevant over the next 3+ seasons. Plus he's fun to watch when he's on his game. And there's still talent on the team between CJ/Herb/Trey/85% healthy Murray, but they're not putting asses in the seats unless Trey takes a big step up soon (which he very well may), so I really don't think that the Pels are considering moving him.
1
Posted on 6/5/25 at 4:31 am to Balsamic_duck
quote:
There was also a supposed mandate to get rid of Zion. That doesn’t look to be happening
No, there wasn't. Where do people come up with this stuff? It was perfectly obvious from the beginning that Dumars was brought onboard was to try to manage Zion and get him to achieve his potential.
Posted on 6/5/25 at 5:31 am to Balsamic_duck
quote:
There was also a supposed mandate to get rid of Zion.
This was also walked back like the next day after it was said…
The comments about being forced to keep Willie were never walked back
This post was edited on 6/5/25 at 5:31 am
Posted on 6/5/25 at 7:05 am to THRILLHO
quote:
His value is too damaged to be worth trading right now. I'm not against trading Zion, but him staying healthy and in shape is the only chance this team has at being relevant over the next 3+ seasons. Plus he's fun to watch when he's on his game
That is just optimistic wishful thinking. Zion's reputation can't be flipped in a season. He would need multiple 60+ game seasons playing at an all-star level to justify people's trade valuation of him. It's not realistic.
For next season to be a success, he has to play over 65 games (he has done this once). He has to play at least 34mpg (never done that). He needs to put up stats in comparison with other max level players, so something like 28+, 8+, 6+ (all would be career highs). If you don't think he can hit those or come remotely close, then what the F are we doing?
Posted on 6/5/25 at 8:25 am to brmark70816
quote:
Zion's reputation can't be flipped in a season. He would need multiple 60+ game seasons playing at an all-star level to justify people's trade valuation of him. It's not realistic.
Or just one wcf run lol.
And I think most people's trade valuation of Zion is pretty spot on right now. He'd probably get one first and a starting player. Similar to what we got for ingram.
He gives you a full wcf run as the best player on the court and teams will drop their fricking pants for him.
Posted on 6/5/25 at 8:31 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
He gives you a full wcf run as the best player on the court and teams will drop their fricking pants for him
Are you serious? That is your expectation?
Posted on 6/5/25 at 8:40 am to brmark70816
quote:
Are you serious? That is your expectation?
Oh frick no, I dont think he'll ever be the best player on a playoff team at this point. He hasn't done it.
I'm pointing out the only scenario that his value would be maxed out in a short amount of time.
Posted on 6/5/25 at 8:47 am to GOP_Tiger
quote:
Where do people come up with this stuff?
Shamit is the one who reported this, at least that I saw. He was correct on the Willie stuff so it seemed he would be correct on this. However, from the moment of Dumars' introductory press conference, it seemed that he wanted to try to work it out with Zion.
I think that with how the lottery went riding with Zion is the best option for the season. As others have said, he really looked good to close the year. The team shut him down and was obviously tanking so I am not as concerned with him only playing 30 games. That number should have been closer to 50. It is not a huge change but I never remember Griff saying Zion was the face of the franchise or the undisputed leader and best player in interviews. I think it is obvious that Dumars is going to empower him to be that guy this season in a way that Griff never did. If it doesn't work then you move on. His value won't be any lower than it is now. I am intrigued to see how he comes into camp and if he can build on the way he closed last season. The potential is still tantalizing.
Posted on 6/5/25 at 9:19 am to ThePistol
quote:
As others have said, he really looked good to close the year
He finished the year hurt and unable to play more than 30mpg
quote:
The team shut him down and was obviously tanking so I am not as concerned with him only playing 30 games. That number should have been closer to 50.
No no no, this is a lie. He got hurt and agreed to sit out to recover. They can't sit him without his consent and an existing injury. You can't respin this into a positive. He missed the games cause he was injured. There is no such category as sitting out to tank. That's BS.
quote:
If it doesn't work then you move on. His value won't be any lower than it is now.
If it doesn't work, the season is a bomb and we just wasted it. We will have to waive him and get nothing in return. There is no trading him then. There are people that say we should waive him now. Getting a 1st and a playable player is gravy. We should do it now. Get it over with.
quote:
am intrigued to see how he comes into camp and if he can build on the way he closed last season. The potential is still tantalizing.
Once again, at some point you have to know how silly this sounds..
Posted on 6/5/25 at 9:22 am to supe12sta12z
For sure, gotta give Dumars room to work. It's his job to get the right players in the building and how he wants to do that is his decision. How the team competes and physical conditioning is what I'll be keeping my eye on. How Pels play the Ferrari with a Mack truck body that's always in the garage is important but not the nearly the highest priority.
Posted on 6/5/25 at 10:33 am to Pistol44
quote:
"I want people to come to the games and say "Did you see the Pels game last night? Those guys are intense every night"... It's not hey the Pels shot 40 3's last night... People care about the intensity... I know that sells, it's sold forever" -- Joe Dumars message for Fans
LINK
Duuuuuude
Posted on 6/5/25 at 10:44 am to brmark70816
quote:You're delusional. It was obvious he was going to be shut down as there was no need to bring him back on a bottom 5 team out of any playoff contention. He did play more than 30 mpg at times and averaged 29 mpg on the season.
No no no, this is a lie. He got hurt and agreed to sit out to recover. They can't sit him without his consent and an existing injury. You can't respin this into a positive. He missed the games cause he was injured. There is no such category as sitting out to tank. That's BS.
Posted on 6/5/25 at 10:45 am to whatiknowsofar
Posted on 6/5/25 at 10:45 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:Gonna be rough with Dumars in charge. As much as I am not a huge fan of the new NBA where players give up layups in order to take 3s, he has to adapt to the current NBA and not the 70s and 80s.
LINK
Duuuuuude
Posted on 6/5/25 at 10:46 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
"I want people to come to the games and say "Did you see the Pels game last night? Those guys are intense every night"... It's not hey the Pels shot 40 3's last night... People care about the intensity... I know that sells, it's sold forever" -- Joe Dumars message for Fans
I think he sees this as a good thing. Building a gritty team like say the teams he had in Detroit or the Memphis grind teams, etc.
I think its out of touch with the reality of the league
Posted on 6/5/25 at 10:58 am to Fun Bunch
This is also the polar opposite of Willie preaching “.5 offense”
If he wants a gritty tough team he needed to fire Willie and hire Jenkins or now that he’s available Thibs
If he wants a gritty tough team he needed to fire Willie and hire Jenkins or now that he’s available Thibs
This post was edited on 6/5/25 at 10:58 am
Posted on 6/5/25 at 11:23 am to Soggymoss
quote:
This is also the polar opposite of Willie preaching “.5 offense”
I disagree. He stressed intensity. You can play fast paced and do it with intensity. He's not advocating "grit and grind." He wants intensity - not dudes who settle for threes.
Posted on 6/5/25 at 11:38 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
"I want people to come to the games and say "Did you see the Pels game last night? Those guys are intense every night"... It's not hey the Pels shot 40 3's last night... People care about the intensity... I know that sells, it's sold forever" -- Joe Dumars message for Fans
I don't see any problems with the statement, it is true. Can the Pels actually put something like that on the court? I am not sure. Pels are in a division with AD, Kyrie, Sengun, Amen, Wemby, Fox, Jah, and JJJ along with the top two picks in the draft. Additionally all these teams have depth. Pelicans are going to have to acquire talent to reasonably contend.
I do want to see the Pels compete without the silly 'tank strategy' providing more excuses. I want to see physical development from the Pels. No more Fat Albert and the Cosby kids. I want to see organized team play not LeBron ball. If Joe can set this type of foundation, I'm all good.
Posted on 6/5/25 at 12:23 pm to Pistol44
Every time Dumars has opened his mouth I lose confidence. He doesn’t like analytics, he doesn’t want the team to shoot 40 3s, all he talks about is grit and toughness.
Grit and toughness only get you so far. You need to be able to have an efficient offense. What is his plan to do that?
Grit and toughness only get you so far. You need to be able to have an efficient offense. What is his plan to do that?
Posted on 6/5/25 at 12:56 pm to Pistol44
quote:
"I want people to come to the games and say "Did you see the Pels game last night? Those guys are intense every night"... It's not hey the Pels shot 40 3's last night... People care about the intensity... I know that sells, it's sold forever" -- Joe Dumars message for Fans
This message delivered while throwing his support behind the most inconsistent player in franchise history. I can't wait to see Zion's intensity while he stands in the half court corner catching his breath while everyone else runs offense.
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