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re: Severance Season 2 Discussion (Spoilers)
Posted on 3/21/25 at 1:39 pm to jlovel7
Posted on 3/21/25 at 1:39 pm to jlovel7
quote:Well then why was innie Mark not at all affected by seeing his wife as Ms. Casey shortly after he arrived. Gemma's devastating death literally sent him there, but iMark had no emotional response to her that I can recall. Seems that would've been just as much an emotional trigger for Mark as the crib would be for Gemma.
She was free from those feelings BECAUSE macro data sorted them away. The cold harbor room wouldn’t work until the file got to 100%. So clearly some pre work has to be done to sever a person that is individual to each person.
Posted on 3/21/25 at 1:52 pm to iwyLSUiwy
quote:
I feel like this is a dumb question but why would they need to erase the triggers/depressing thoughts from a severed person. Wouldn't she be free from those once she goes in the room with the crib? Just like she has no memories of Mark when he comes in, she wouldn't have memories of losing a child.
I think there’s always some amount of bleed-through. Irving with the black hallway is an example. The implication seems to be that a “normal” innie may not remember the miscarriage while disassembling the crib, but that the deep-seated feeling of sadness might seep in.
In all of the rooms, they’ve been testing her for that bleed-through. I suppose this final test represents the memory that would affect her the most.
The idea of bleed-through kind of makes sense from a neurological perspective. Someone earlier in the thread was asking how the innies remember some things (like language) without remembering others. There are different types of memory that, as I understand it, are stored and processed differently in your brain. So the goal of something like a severance chip would be to isolate all of the parts that define someone’s personality/identity without lobotomizing them. That might be part of why they had her disassemble the crib as well - to see how it affected her motor skills?
In any case it seems to me that Cold Harbor represents a level of perfection in the severance technology. As for the implications of that perfection - the why of it all - I have no idea.
Of course some of this is speculation and I may be way off, but that’s my impression anyhow.
Posted on 3/21/25 at 1:53 pm to Handsome Pete
quote:
Well then why was innie Mark not at all affected by seeing his wife as Ms. Casey shortly after he arrived.
It’s a good question but I got the feeling he was affected by seeing her. Not in a “holy shite I thought you were dead” way but more of a “something seems off about this” way.
Posted on 3/21/25 at 1:57 pm to jlovel7
quote:
It had to still be Gemma at least partially. We saw some of Dillon’s files (tumwater) as rooms for Gemma.
They were helping but mark obviously was much better at piecing her mind together.
Interesting, I didn’t catch that. So I guess anyone with the right knack for refining can do it, but Mark’s relationship with Gemma makes him a lot better at it? I can live with that explanation, I think.
Posted on 3/21/25 at 2:12 pm to lostinbr
quote:
I think there’s always some amount of bleed-through. Irving with the black hallway is an example. The implication seems to be that a “normal” innie may not remember the miscarriage while disassembling the crib, but that the deep-seated feeling of sadness might seep in.
In all of the rooms, they’ve been testing her for that bleed-through. I suppose this final test represents the memory that would affect her the most.
The idea of bleed-through kind of makes sense from a neurological perspective. Someone earlier in the thread was asking how the innies remember some things (like language) without remembering others. There are different types of memory that, as I understand it, are stored and processed differently in your brain. So the goal of something like a severance chip would be to isolate all of the parts that define someone’s personality/identity without lobotomizing them. That might be part of why they had her disassemble the crib as well - to see how it affected her motor skills?
In any case it seems to me that Cold Harbor represents a level of perfection in the severance technology. As for the implications of that perfection - the why of it all - I have no idea.
Of course some of this is speculation and I may be way off, but that’s my impression anyhow.
I can accept that, but if that is all it is, that would be a pretty big let down.
This was supposed to be the biggest day in the history of the company, Lumons biggest accomplishment. How could that be close to as big as just the severence process/surgery itself? Or severence being a seemingly working system for employment? What they already accomplished is much more impressive than possibly stopping bleed through memories of a severed employee.
Honestly, it seems like Ms. Casey and Mark S being in the same room together numerous times and neither of them having any recollection of each other or feelings of trauma is about as successful as you're ever going to get. I've never had a kid but If I did, I would hope my wife would love it more than she loves me. That being said, I don't think a crib of a miscarriage child would be THAT more traumatizing than seeing your husband that you were married to for years and went through that trauma with would be some minor test in relation.
I normally read up on episode recaps of this show just to wrap my brain around things more. The Rolling Stone recap person had some pretty similar thoughts to me. He or she loved the show and gave high praise, but this seemed to be a similar complaint....
quote:
Outie Mark’s appeal to Gemma — who has been placed in a scenario designed to figure out just how much separation there is her real, grief-stricken self and the fake personality Innie Mark just created for her — is deliberately smaller, and well-played by Scott and Dichen Lachman. But it’s undercut at least somewhat by the show’s vagueness about the full details of Cold Harbor. The season’s seventh episode gave us a rough outline of what it does, in going several steps beyond severance to reprogram people’s minds with custom-built personalities. We just don’t know exactly how it’s meant to be applied, what would happen to Gemma and Mark upon its completion, nor even why it’s so bad for Mark to release Gemma back out into the world. It’s not even clear whether any of the real Gemma bled into the latest personality, or if the scenario — dismantling a baby crib — was so inherently sad that any stranger offering a similar plea would have coaxed her out of the room and back into her true self. It seems like Mark is getting through to some version of his wife, especially given how upset Jame Eagan and Dr. Mauer(*) are by Mark’s mere presence. But the show is ambiguous enough about all of this that it doesn’t hit as hard as it’s meant to.
(*) When Mark is liberating Gemma, Dr. Mauer screams that he’ll “kill them all!” Presumably, he means that Gemma’s various programmed innies will cease to exist if she gets out of the building. Which raises the question of whether these personalities qualify as people in the same way that, say, Innie Mark or Helly do. Dr. Mauer certainly seems to think of them that way.
It’s one of a number of fuzzy ideas from this season that have rendered it less effective overall compared to the first. Though Innie Mark tells Helly that he knows why Lumon is doing all of this, it doesn’t seem as if Harmony has told him — or us — enough to truly understand. There were also various issues with pacing and character in the episodes that came after “Woe’s Hollow.” The show didn’t seem to know what to do with Mark’s response to being assaulted by Helena, so it downplayed it altogether and focused only on Helly’s anguish. (Which is an important detail, too; there just should have been room for both.) The Irving and Dylan subplots both wound up underfed because so much time was being devoted to other issues, including two episodes late in the season where neither character appeared at all. We still know nothing about what Outie Irving was up to, with whom he was working, how (or if) Innie Irving knew about any of it, and it feels like the show skipped multiple steps in dramatizing whatever the relationship is between Outie Irving and Outie Burt. Even the idea introduced in the finale that Jame Eagan has come to prefer his daughter’s innie to her outie feels like we needed another beat or two between him and Helena earlier in the year.
Posted on 3/21/25 at 2:41 pm to iwyLSUiwy
quote:
This was supposed to be the biggest day in the history of the company, Lumons biggest accomplishment. How could that be close to as big as just the severence process/surgery itself? Or severence being a seemingly working system for employment? What they already accomplished is much more impressive than possibly stopping bleed through memories of a severed employee.
Oh I agree, which is why I mentioned “the why of it all.” I don’t think we’ve seen the “why” yet. There must be some consequence of perfecting the technology that hasn’t been revealed yet, Lumon’s actual objective for the severance program.
I mean if you think about it, everything we’ve seen about the severed floor seems to exist to serve this agenda. Surely Lumon didn’t invent severance for the sake of researching severance. And it has to be more than their little labor/delivery cabins. I think there’s a long game.
Maybe it’s silly, but I still find the reincarnation theories interesting. If they can put a person’s “tempers” into a bucket and isolate them, maybe they can pull Kier’s tempers out of a bucket to replace them.
Posted on 3/21/25 at 2:48 pm to lostinbr
So was the band supposed to be a waffle party? Mark got a waffle dinner card from milcheck
Posted on 3/21/25 at 4:10 pm to jlovel7
Apparently season 3 has been greenlit.
Posted on 3/21/25 at 4:14 pm to jlovel7
quote:
So was the band supposed to be a waffle party?
Honestly, all of the in-depth discussions about innie - vs - outie, bleed through, and Gemma mind wipe -- there isn't nearly enough discussion about
why the hell did they have the Bayou Classic halftime show? Who came up with that idea?
Posted on 3/21/25 at 4:24 pm to Floating Change Up
quote:
why the hell did they have the Bayou Classic halftime show? Who came up with that idea?
I found that wild. Also are all those people severed? They just kept playing while milchick was clearly being held captive? It was weird.
Posted on 3/21/25 at 4:39 pm to Floating Change Up
quote:
why the hell did they have the Bayou Classic halftime show? Who came up with that idea?
Who gives a shite, Milkshake owned that shite...
Dude is the best part of the show
Posted on 3/21/25 at 7:35 pm to Esquire
I JUST realized that's Sandra Bernhard. I haven't seen or thought of her in decades
Posted on 3/21/25 at 8:53 pm to Shiftyplus1
Damn. Gemma can't catch a break at all
Posted on 3/22/25 at 6:35 am to Floating Change Up
quote:
why the hell did they have the Bayou Classic halftime show? Who came up with that idea?
I think it’s because the audience loves watching him dance. So the writers made up a scenario that leaned into it. I told my husband Milkshake needs to be king/grand marshal of a parade next Mardi Gras. Dude’s a treasure.
Posted on 3/22/25 at 8:46 am to ILurkThereforeIAm
Finally had the opportunity to watch the season finale this morning, and I'm impressed. I love shows which present protagonists with a choice between two difficult, yet valid life options.
Option A: Eternal happiness, stability, and peace with a compassionate woman who deeply admires and respects you.
Option B: A third round of awkward, clumsy intimate congress with a bat-shite crazy, long-legged redhead who will grind you to death in an office meeting room after you set a new stamina record of 20 seconds.
Every single male on tigerdroppings would choose Option B, and I appreciate Dan Erickson's and Ben Stiller's artistic integrity for recognizing innie Mark's true motivations and maintaining a character-driven narrative.
Option A: Eternal happiness, stability, and peace with a compassionate woman who deeply admires and respects you.
Option B: A third round of awkward, clumsy intimate congress with a bat-shite crazy, long-legged redhead who will grind you to death in an office meeting room after you set a new stamina record of 20 seconds.
Every single male on tigerdroppings would choose Option B, and I appreciate Dan Erickson's and Ben Stiller's artistic integrity for recognizing innie Mark's true motivations and maintaining a character-driven narrative.
This post was edited on 3/22/25 at 8:52 am
Posted on 3/22/25 at 9:49 am to MikeyFL
Well he had a connection with A. Wasn't like she was just the girl who was too nice.
He has the connection with Helly because of shared adversity. If Gemma thinks, n she gets out of there, goes to his sister's, and sees if outie ever comes back home.
He has the connection with Helly because of shared adversity. If Gemma thinks, n she gets out of there, goes to his sister's, and sees if outie ever comes back home.
Posted on 3/22/25 at 9:50 am to MikeyFL
Nothing will ever top the S1 finale but it was a really strong ending to the season. Answered (confirmed) some stuff yet still left a ton unanswered. They had to find a way to keep a lot of the core people inside Lumon and they came up with a pretty plausible explanation to get them there. I have to think next season largely involves either Helly or mark on the testing floor in the Gemma position, the others trying to tame their tempers and perhaps Irving working on the outside to get them out. Or maybe even they bring Irving back considering the circumstances.
Posted on 3/22/25 at 9:56 am to iwyLSUiwy
I took an edible and the comedy show / Kier entrance / marching band playing “chosen one” was incredible
Posted on 3/22/25 at 10:14 am to NIH
Well I know what I’m doing tonight
Posted on 3/22/25 at 10:48 am to Salmon
The season was great. Still the best show around. No letdown at all. Enjoyed each episode equally.
I’ve got one just tiny little complaint. We really needed more Ricken. He was barely there this season. He’s such a great character.
I’ve got one just tiny little complaint. We really needed more Ricken. He was barely there this season. He’s such a great character.
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