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re: Do you feel Hollywood has lost the trust of the viewer?
Posted on 5/27/24 at 12:15 pm to Roaad
Posted on 5/27/24 at 12:15 pm to Roaad
quote:
How much do you think the perception of pervasive woke messaging is contributing to the box office decline?
Not as much as people think. It’s a lot of contributing factors.
1. Social media allows for immediate gratification. Movies and even TV take time and patience for the gratification of a three act structure. It’s a journey. Kids just don’t want that. It’s not entertaining for them when they can get gratification 24/7 from TikTok, IG and their favorite YouTube channel/streamer
2. Companies pushing digital releases early as soon as there is any sign of trouble at the box office. And even when there’s not. Hollywood is obsessed with digital platforms right now, just a reflection of the younger generation.
3. It costs too much to go as a family. Yeah you can save $$$ by bringing your own snacks but that’s not really going to help movie theaters themselves. That’s where they make the majority of their revenue to keep the lights on and pay staff.
Ultimately, I don’t think it comes down to trust or lack thereof. I think it comes down to the fact that we are a society that is constantly overwhelmed with information and media. TD, Twitter, IG, TikTok, all the immediacy of streaming. And that’s not even considering the large portion of Americans that are watching sports as well. I even think the MCU and these huge franchises have played a part. Unless something feels like an event (like an Avengers, Dune 2, Oppenheimer, etc.) then people just don’t see the need in it anymore. But then you have a movie like Wonka make $600M so who the frick knows
3
Posted on 5/27/24 at 12:17 pm to SlowFlowPro
They also need to get realistic with the budget for these movies. It woudn’t be so doom and gloom if every movie didn’t need to make 3/4 of a billion dollars before it starts making a profit.
With everything Dune was able to do with $185 million regarding the technical aspects of movie moving, no movie should approach that budget unless it’s on that scale and quality. It cost $100 million more to make the CGI-distaster that was Quantumania
With everything Dune was able to do with $185 million regarding the technical aspects of movie moving, no movie should approach that budget unless it’s on that scale and quality. It cost $100 million more to make the CGI-distaster that was Quantumania
Posted on 5/27/24 at 12:17 pm to Roaad
Trust doesn’t have anything to do with it. Hollywood has lost the attention of the viewer.
They are now competing with YouTube, tiktok, and reels.
That’s where people are consuming content.
They are now competing with YouTube, tiktok, and reels.
That’s where people are consuming content.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 12:19 pm to WicKed WayZ
quote:I have allowed for that, yes
It’s a lot of contributing factors.
quote:I think it is actually undersold. Disney basically saying it was trying to propagandize your kids in the much publicized video definitely had an effect.
Not as much as people think
It definitely altered my viewing/spending habits. We can pretend like I am the only one, sure.
But it seems a bit naive.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 12:20 pm to Esquire
quote:This is a real problem, too.
They also need to get realistic with the budget for these movies.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 12:28 pm to Roaad
I think most of society isn’t nearly as plugged into this kinda shite as people that are regularly online are. I think they just make a lot of shitty movies (the woke shite being a big part of that), people are having shorter and shorter attention spans on social media, and it’s just expensive to go see stuff especially if it’s not that interesting.
My kids love going to the movies though. Hopefully they can get their act together.
My kids love going to the movies though. Hopefully they can get their act together.
This post was edited on 5/27/24 at 12:29 pm
Posted on 5/27/24 at 12:32 pm to Roaad
quote:
How much do you think the perception of pervasive woke messaging
Yeah, it's not just my perception. And some aren't even trying to hide it anymore. Have you seen the video of that black female writer who straight up said I have a gay agenda and I'm making as many characters gay as I can?
I guess you want me to believe that that's just my mind playing tricks on me, right? Like it's just my perception of things through my white, racist preconceived notions and bigoted goggles, right?
Or maybe they do have an agenda and it's pretty fricking easy to see.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 12:33 pm to Esquire
quote:
They also need to get realistic with the budget for these movies.
I agree 1000%. That's part of my "we may see a 90s-esque independent resurgence" argument.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 12:51 pm to Roaad
quote:
Do you feel Hollywood has lost the trust of the viewer?
They lost my trust because of stupid shite like Captain Marvel communicating to a species through song and dance (yes, I was bored this weekend and finally decided to watch. It was flat out mediocre until this point and then it became the absolute shitshow everyone claimed it to be)
Posted on 5/27/24 at 1:42 pm to Roaad
I think it’s more interest than trust.
There is more preaching going on in a 2 hour movie than a month of church attendance.
There is more preaching going on in a 2 hour movie than a month of church attendance.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 6:02 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
I agree 1000%. That's part of my "we may see a 90s-esque independent resurgence" argument.
100% we will. It’s already in its infant stages
Posted on 5/27/24 at 6:24 pm to WicKed WayZ
I have a couple of thoughts on this.
1) I think movie makers always pushed an agenda. Mostly, we watched if it was a good story. Wall E is a one example. I remember people loving it, pretty universally, but taking issue with the agenda pushing nature of its message.
2) In relation to the above, they decided to play into the "woke" areas. Changing sex, race, and sexual preference of characters that were already established. They also slapped us in the face with it. There is a gay/trans person in every damn movie. Just gets tiring. It was there before, but they didn't rub our noses in it.
3) The remakes didn't work. Not sure when it started, but they aren't working. They changed the story to suit these agendas.
4) Theaters are fricking expensive. We are a family of 7. Yeah, that shite ain't happening. I'll wait for streaming.
1) I think movie makers always pushed an agenda. Mostly, we watched if it was a good story. Wall E is a one example. I remember people loving it, pretty universally, but taking issue with the agenda pushing nature of its message.
2) In relation to the above, they decided to play into the "woke" areas. Changing sex, race, and sexual preference of characters that were already established. They also slapped us in the face with it. There is a gay/trans person in every damn movie. Just gets tiring. It was there before, but they didn't rub our noses in it.
3) The remakes didn't work. Not sure when it started, but they aren't working. They changed the story to suit these agendas.
4) Theaters are fricking expensive. We are a family of 7. Yeah, that shite ain't happening. I'll wait for streaming.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 6:42 pm to bad93ex
Don’t understand the charge for purchasing online. Like the theaters are already trying to overcome a ton of hurdles, why make it harder for people?
Posted on 5/27/24 at 7:47 pm to 1999
They still make money even with their agenda clearly being thrown in people's faces. They just won't make nearly as much. I wouldn't be surprised if movie theaters go away though there's not enough block buster movies to keep them afloat. Seems like for every success like Barbie or Oppenheimer there's 5 bombs like Furiosa.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 7:55 pm to Roaad
Sure looks that way. By many accounts, Fall Guy and Furiosa are good movies, but both have flopped.
I think people are just sick of remakes, reboots, sequels, spinoffs, etc.
I think people are just sick of remakes, reboots, sequels, spinoffs, etc.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 7:56 pm to Roaad
It’s definitely a huge problem part of the declining movie attendance. People saying it’s not must not know many people with kids. I’m at the age where most of my friends have kids. Previously they would take their kids to every cartoon movie even if it didn’t have great reviews. It was something to do and the kids loved it. A few have talked about how expensive it’s gotten and a few have kids that have aged out of cartoons. But the majority have just said frick Hollywood and them putting this shite in kid’s movies. They just decided not to go support that anymore.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 8:05 pm to Roaad
Top performing Hollywood-produced movies measured by world-wide box office from 2021 to 2023:
1. Avatar 2 - $2,300M
2. Spidey No Way Home - $1,900M
3. Top Gun Maverick - $1,500M
4. Barbie - 1,400M
5. Super Mario Bros - $1,300M
6. Jurassic World 3 - $1,000M
7. Oppenheimer - $974M
8. Doc Strange 2 - $955M
9. Guardians 3 - $845M
10. No Time to Die - $775M
Just outside of the top ten are movies like the last 2 Fast & Furious movies, Black Panther 2, Robert Pattison Batman, and Shang Chi.
In 2024, I'd expect Dune 2, the latest Planet of the Apes, and Deadpool 3 to be the big winners. Remains to be seen if any cross $1BB in world-wide box office.
Amongst these films, I'd argue that there is no distinct correlation to political leanings or cultural issues and box office. Avatar, Barbie, and Oppenheimer are arguably Left. Maverick is slightly Right. Everything else is politically & culturally neutral. What do these films have in common? They are major "event films" and/or based on extremely popular and proven IP.
The real factors effecting box office are almost certainly (1) changes in consumer behavior & preference and (2) major Hollywood studios (and the tech co's that now own studios - Netflix, Apple, Amazon) prioritizing streaming growth from 2021-forward. Regarding #1, I don't think Hollywood has really figured out what will sell at the post-pandemic box office beyond sure-fire event films. Films like Quantumania, The Marvels, Ghostbusters Whatever, and Aqua-Man 2 (the first one made nearly $1.2BB!) absolutely bomb, while Anyone But You ($25M budget, $200MM box office) is a surprise hit. And then you have Elemental, which started off looking like a bomb, but then went on to make ~$500MM, with a big chunk of that AFTER it was released on Disney+.
1. Avatar 2 - $2,300M
2. Spidey No Way Home - $1,900M
3. Top Gun Maverick - $1,500M
4. Barbie - 1,400M
5. Super Mario Bros - $1,300M
6. Jurassic World 3 - $1,000M
7. Oppenheimer - $974M
8. Doc Strange 2 - $955M
9. Guardians 3 - $845M
10. No Time to Die - $775M
Just outside of the top ten are movies like the last 2 Fast & Furious movies, Black Panther 2, Robert Pattison Batman, and Shang Chi.
In 2024, I'd expect Dune 2, the latest Planet of the Apes, and Deadpool 3 to be the big winners. Remains to be seen if any cross $1BB in world-wide box office.
Amongst these films, I'd argue that there is no distinct correlation to political leanings or cultural issues and box office. Avatar, Barbie, and Oppenheimer are arguably Left. Maverick is slightly Right. Everything else is politically & culturally neutral. What do these films have in common? They are major "event films" and/or based on extremely popular and proven IP.
The real factors effecting box office are almost certainly (1) changes in consumer behavior & preference and (2) major Hollywood studios (and the tech co's that now own studios - Netflix, Apple, Amazon) prioritizing streaming growth from 2021-forward. Regarding #1, I don't think Hollywood has really figured out what will sell at the post-pandemic box office beyond sure-fire event films. Films like Quantumania, The Marvels, Ghostbusters Whatever, and Aqua-Man 2 (the first one made nearly $1.2BB!) absolutely bomb, while Anyone But You ($25M budget, $200MM box office) is a surprise hit. And then you have Elemental, which started off looking like a bomb, but then went on to make ~$500MM, with a big chunk of that AFTER it was released on Disney+.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 8:48 pm to Esquire
quote:Even if it IS a big "experience it on big screens" movie, I'm ok with streaming it.
It’s too easy to watch new movies at home if you wait three weeks. Unless it’s an event movie that’s designed for the big screen, most people have enough options at their fingertips to wait a few weeks and watch it at home for a fraction of the price.
I have a lower tier 58" 4k LCD tv, nothing special but you know what, picture looks good to me.
I have a 450w Yamaha 7+1 AV receiver, with the speakers and subwoofer properly tuned and placed correctly, and the sweet spot for viewing/listening is my leather sofa, and my living room can go pitch black (darker than a theater with exit lights, for example). I have some TV tray stands so I can set up a nice spread.
I saw Top Gun Maverick and Dune 1 both in the theaters and streamed, and my personal experience I preferred to be home. Better food/snacks, far more convenient, a lot cheaper. A bit better sensory experience, but not by a lot. I saw Multiverse of Madness in the theater (not on a premium screen), and my sensory experience was BETTER at home. Better at home with the first Shazam, too- and that was on a premium screen at Seigen AMC for the premier, when I saw it at the theater.
I looked forward to Dune 2, but didn't catch it at the theater, and don't regret it at all. The movie I do regret not seeing was Godzilla Minus One, because they're dicking around and may not stream it before Christmas, and I want to see it.
This is the decision many of us made a decade ago with football. If you no longer care about it being a social event, your viewing experience is better nowadays at home (I quit drinking, so tailgating is not the draw it used to be for me).
I think that's why so many services are going to an ad-based model... not just to make money advertising, but I think they're going to try to 'ruin' the streaming so people go back to the theaters. That probably won't work, so Hollywood will either have to adapt and accept lower box office, or get squeezed even on big hits.
Posted on 5/27/24 at 10:42 pm to Roaad
Yes. There's a Solo (after TLJ) effect hitting a lot of projects.
The benefit of the doubt used to be given but it now the opposite is true
The benefit of the doubt used to be given but it now the opposite is true
Posted on 5/27/24 at 11:25 pm to Roaad
quote:
They can't just come out and say they are stopping, or apologize, because then they'd lose dollars from the other half.
This is the way.
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