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Message
re: Did Michael Jordan insult Cowherd's momma?
Posted on 2/18/13 at 12:30 pm to tigerpimpbot
Posted on 2/18/13 at 12:30 pm to tigerpimpbot
Lebron tries to fight the women in the stands
1
Posted on 2/18/13 at 12:32 pm to shel311
quote:Not at all. From the beginning to now, I have made the case that Jordan had a will and competitiveness that distinguishes him from Lebron at this point. You have bounced around trying to prove that to be an impossible observation. Then, in the end, you acknowledge that things like hustle and effort, though not statistically quantified, are observable.
You have clearly showed that you build your narratives and thoughts, and work the facts into them.
I have been consistent, you have drummed up debates about Tony Parker, Bill Russell, Charles Barkley, Karl Malone and the 11th and 12th guy on the bench.
This post was edited on 2/18/13 at 12:33 pm
Posted on 2/18/13 at 12:32 pm to SabiDojo
quote:
Right! Because THAT is how you prove yourself to be a MAN!
It's a common fact Charles Barkley was a better man once he got up off the court with a Shaq rumble.
quote:
You know, because taking care of your kids, never getting arrested, and just being a decent human being is NOT enough.
Only a Lebron camper would want to talk about off court when discussing on court.
quote:
All men should be like Shawn Kemp. Get high and go bang broads and never take care of the kids.
Dude, this isn't father of the year competition.
Posted on 2/18/13 at 12:34 pm to Chad504boy
quote:
It's a common fact Charles Barkley was a better man once he got up off the court with a Shaq rumble.
I disagree. I think Charles was a better man with his controversial "I am not a role model" soundbite.
Posted on 2/18/13 at 12:34 pm to WDE24
quote:
Then, in the end, you acknowledge that things like hustle and effort, though not statistically quantified, are observable.
I'm done here.
If we can't read and comprehend, what's the point?
Posted on 2/18/13 at 12:36 pm to shel311
quote:Give me the benefit of the doubt and just assume that the message wasn't as clearly delivered as you thought. I'm willing to understand if you explain it differently.
If we can't read and comprehend, what's the point?
Does hustle, effort, will, and inner drive exist? Are all of these things, assuming you agree they exist, equal among all competitors? Assuming no, then is it possible to observe actions that demonstrate hustle, effort, will, and inner drive?
This post was edited on 2/18/13 at 12:37 pm
Posted on 2/18/13 at 12:38 pm to WDE24
Are points per game a quantifiable comparable statistic if we can't put a science to the rule changes in the NBA over the past 10 years in what could have been before those changes?
Posted on 2/18/13 at 12:42 pm to Chad504boy
quote:
Lebron tries to fight the women in the stands
Posted on 2/18/13 at 12:48 pm to WDE24
quote:probably just the fact that he has ice cold blood flowing through his veins
You have never met them. How can you even pretend to have an opinion about this?
ETA to add that is indeed a fact
This post was edited on 2/18/13 at 12:50 pm
Posted on 2/18/13 at 1:10 pm to WDE24
quote:
Does hustle, effort, will, and inner drive exist? Are all of these things, assuming you agree they exist, equal among all competitors?
Don't these thing show up in their statistics though? If you don't hustle and show effort, your rebounding numbers will dip. Will and inner drive can pretty easily be seen in how your game and numbers progress during your career.
The only way it's tough to capture is defense because we haven't exactly figured out a way to quantify individual defense in an effective manner. But we'll get their eventually.
I mean that's just my view though. Also, teams themselves chart this kind of stuff in statistical form. So it's definitely quantifiable. The Heat chart effort all the time with charges taken, quality rotations, and hedging. Just because fans don't have access to this information doesn't mean that we can't quantify it. We just haven't.
Posted on 2/18/13 at 1:12 pm to jturn17
quote:SportView!!!
So it's definitely quantifiable. The Heat chart effort all the time with charges taken, quality rotations, and hedging. Just because fans don't have access to this information doesn't mean that we can't quantify it. We just haven't.
Posted on 2/18/13 at 1:21 pm to yankeelover
quote:
Today he said that marketing made Jordan popular
And Lebron wasn't marketed?
Posted on 2/18/13 at 1:22 pm to shel311
quote:
SportView!!!
SportVu is going to be crazy. It's going to take a decade just to figure out what info from that is even worth anything. But the Heat don't have that yet. They just manually chart every game.
That's the subtle irony of all these player decisions. The way fans have analyzed the game for the past 20-30 years has been archaic. Teams have analyzed the game in a much more advanced manner, and it's taken fans years to catch up. And we're only now getting there because the internet has made this stuff widely available. Hell, Dean Smith was talking about points per possession and efficiency back in the 70s and 80s. But I digress.
Posted on 2/18/13 at 1:45 pm to jturn17
quote:I heard Haberstroh talking about it on LeBatard's radio show.
SportVu
I tried to google it, though with the way I spelled it compared to the way you spelled it, it makes sense that I couldn't find any good articles on it
quote:
That's the subtle irony of all these player decisions. The way fans have analyzed the game for the past 20-30 years has been archaic. Teams have analyzed the game in a much more advanced manner, and it's taken fans years to catch up. And we're only now getting there because the internet has made this stuff widely available. Hell, Dean Smith was talking about points per possession and efficiency back in the 70s and 80s. But I digress.
I have my reservations on how popular it can be for fans as a whole, but I can't wait to see more and more info come out from SportVu.
Posted on 2/18/13 at 1:52 pm to tigerpimpbot
quote:
MJ was an a-hole but he was teflon due to his popularity.
And yet, Pippen, Kukoc, Rodman, etc never seem to have minded. I'm willing to bet they didn't give a shite if MJ was an a-hole.
Posted on 2/18/13 at 2:02 pm to JohnnyKilroy
Bill Simmons called it. Years will go by and MJ's achievements will slowly be scrutinized.
Posted on 2/18/13 at 2:05 pm to DollaChoppa
quote:
It helped tremendously. You really cant argue that.
I like it when people that were like 3 when Jordan was at his peek make comments like this.
Posted on 2/18/13 at 2:11 pm to jturn17
quote:Often, yes.
Don't these thing show up in their statistics though?
quote:That is part of the equation. Size, strength and position typically play a larger role with regards to rebounds.
If you don't hustle and show effort, your rebounding numbers will dip.
quote:I would agree that evidence of some of these intangibles is partially quantifiable, but not directly.
Also, teams themselves chart this kind of stuff in statistical form. So it's definitely quantifiable.
quote:Again, these aren't the same as the intangibles I have mentioned and don't necessarily chart effort. At least not directly. They chart certain aspects of basketball that people associate with effort. I agree with the association, but only loosely.
The Heat chart effort all the time with charges taken, quality rotations, and hedging.
I like sabermetrics and the additional quantification that teams are doing, but I suspect we will never be able to directly quantify the types of intangibles I listed above. Who knows though? As it relates to MJ and LBJ, though, we know that the statistics aren't available.
This post was edited on 2/18/13 at 2:15 pm
Posted on 2/18/13 at 3:01 pm to yankeelover
quote:
. Today he said that marketing made Jordan popular
It did, but being popular didn't make him the GOAT. He did that on his own.
Posted on 2/18/13 at 3:12 pm to Ford Frenzy
quote:
MJ won 6 NBA finals and was the MVP all 6 times, that pretty much says all you need to know about him
LeBron will never do anything to compare to that
you do not know this for sure. i agree, at the moment MJ is top dog. but i would not ever say lebron won't win five more rings, no matter what the odds are
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