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Message

re: Getting rid of the "shift" in baseball is

Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:01 pm to
Posted by LSURulzSEC
Lake Charles via Oakdale
Member since Aug 2004
79462 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:01 pm to
quote:

a horrible idea


wrong...
Posted by Metaloctopus
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2018
6907 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:07 pm to
quote:

They’d have to have strict boundaries or leave things to judgement calls AND some rule about when players could move. It is an asinine notion.




From what I understand, infielders will always have to have both feet in the dirt and stay on their respective sides (in other words, the third baseman and shortstop can't setup on the other side of second base).

I don't know if it's until the pitcher starts his motion, or until the ball is put in play that they can leave the dirt. Whatever it is, I don't think it will be confusing at all.

I hate the shift, but I do wish players would try to just beat it. But they are all taught about launch angle, and nothing about fundamentals, like bunting when an entire side of the field is vacated. Managers can't complain about losing the ability to shift if they won't do anything to see to it that their players try to combat it. People are tired of watching line drives get caught in shallow right field by the second baseman, and so baseball is trying to do something about it, since then the managers and players won't.
This post was edited on 6/4/22 at 6:11 pm
Posted by CottonWasKing
4,8,15,16,23,42
Member since Jun 2011
29538 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:08 pm to
quote:

Yet Ted Williams, the last guy to bat over .400 (.403) in the big leagues, faced a huge shift to the right side his entire career.



Your best velo pitchers in the 40s and 50s topped out in the low to mid 90s.

Now the AVERAGE fastball in the MLB is around 93 mph.

Stop trying to compare between the eras. It’s foolish.
Posted by upgrade
Member since Jul 2011
15074 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:08 pm to
I am on the fence about it because I hate the shift.
But on the other hand I hate that they need to make a new rule for the game that’s over 150 or whatever years old.

They want to outlaw the shift and bitch that games take too long.
Posted by TheArrogantCorndog
Highland Rd
Member since Sep 2009
15942 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:12 pm to
bullshite.. players need to learn how hit oppo... shite, take a note from softball and slap it

Dick trickle a few down the oppo line into short outfield and stretch it for a double

That'll put an end to that shite quick
Posted by CDawson
Louisiana
Member since Dec 2017
20237 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:12 pm to
quote:

the greatest hitter who ever lived


That would be Barry Bonds but point taken. These idiotic rule changes don’t help the game.
Posted by CottonWasKing
4,8,15,16,23,42
Member since Jun 2011
29538 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:13 pm to
quote:

But they are all taught about launch angle, and nothing about fundamentals, like bunting when an entire side of the field is vacated.



Hitters are doing what the “fundamentals” tell them. They’re hitting it where it’s pitched. It’s not like they’re rolling over outside corner breaking balls and complaining about it not being a hit. It’s a about squaring up a center cut fastball and driving it 100+mph over the second base bag and it turning into an easy out. What is a hitter supposed to do if he can’t expect success when he hits the ball hard where it’s pitched.

And as far as bunting if you want someone like Joey Votto or Bryce Harper or Yordan Alveraz to bunt then you’re just helping the defense.

They’re welcoming the bunt. Why do you think that is? It’s because they’d rather him stay on first than try to put a ball into orbit.
Posted by Timeoday
Easter Island
Member since Aug 2020
22901 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:26 pm to
quote:

I’m more amazed that we can’t teach top players to hit to opposite fields and take advantage of it


Teaching them how to bunt would help a ton as well.
Posted by Timeoday
Easter Island
Member since Aug 2020
22901 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:27 pm to
quote:

Did you know Teds head was frozen?


Yep, his estate is waiting for baseball to get rid of the shift.
Posted by Metaloctopus
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2018
6907 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:27 pm to
quote:

Hitters are doing what the “fundamentals” tell them. They’re hitting it where it’s pitched. It’s not like they’re rolling over outside corner breaking balls and complaining about it not being a hit. It’s a about squaring up a center cut fastball and driving it 100+mph over the second base bag and it turning into an easy out. What is a hitter supposed to do if he can’t expect success when he hits the ball hard where it’s pitched.


This is exactly what I said people are tired of seeing. The only way to ensure that doesn't happen, is to either make an effort to hit the ball the other way (pitchers miss their location often, allowing plenty of opportunity to just serve it the other way), or bunt.

quote:

And as far as bunting if you want someone like Joey Votto or Bryce Harper or Yordan Alveraz to bunt then you’re just helping the defense.


So, what you're saying is that hitting line drives right into their waiting gloves ISN'T helping the defense? If you show the other team that you are willing to be unselfish, they won't keep shifting you.

quote:

They’re welcoming the bunt. Why do you think that is? It’s because they’d rather him stay on first than try to put a ball into orbit.


This is the worst argument of all, and I've heard it so many times. Stop for a second and think about this: How does the shift prevent a ball from leaving the park? It doesn't. When a team doesn't want a player to hurt them, they walk the guy. That's always the case. When they don't want to just put the guy on base, they put on the shift and hope he hits it at them. If you simply bunt, then teams know they are giving you an automatic hit if they shift you. So they will be less inclined to shift, and you can swing away.

But nobody does anything but just keep hitting into the shift, and then they complain about it.


Posted by SammyTiger
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Feb 2009
79421 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:33 pm to
I think You probably just limit it with some general rules

Something like No more than 4 fielders to either side of 2nd base.

You could somewhat shift but as as extremely as they do now.
Posted by CottonWasKing
4,8,15,16,23,42
Member since Jun 2011
29538 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 6:53 pm to
quote:

This is the worst argument of all, and I've heard it so many times. Stop for a second and think about this: How does the shift prevent a ball from leaving the park? It doesn't. When a team doesn't want a player to hurt them, they walk the guy. That's always the case. When they don't want to just put the guy on base, they put on the shift and hope he hits it at them. If you simply bunt, then teams know they are giving you an automatic hit if they shift you. So they will be less inclined to shift, and you can swing away.



They’re giving away the bunt. Which means they’re giving up first base. You put your standard left handed power hitter on first base it’s going to take at least two hits to score him. The offense knows that and the defense knows that. He has no value on first base.

His value lies in driving the ball. He keeps pulling the ball because over the course of the season they will score more runs hitting over the shift than bunting around it.

The shift that you love has directly caused the three true outcome player that you claim to hate.
Posted by PurpleExile
Member since Dec 2020
604 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 7:18 pm to
It's not surprising that you neanderthals would take the "just hit 'em where they ain't" side of the argument.

Historically, other sports have always adjusted to keep their games' balance between offense and defense.
Basketball added the 3-point shot.
The NFL is always changing -- defensive backs used to be allowed to drape themselves all over pass receivers.

For 150 years a line drive over the second baseman's head has been a base hit. But now that same ball, even if it's struck 100 miles an hour, is being turned into an out.
The defense has gained a major advantage not by being better fielders, but because of more advanced statistical analysis and the fact the rules have allowed them to take advantage of it.

It isn't golf. Pitchers are throwing 95-plus. Hitters can't be expected to shorten their swings every time and plunk a chip shot to the opposite field. People watch baseball to see the best players hit, not to see whose scouting department had the best computer read-out of where to position its fielders.

And stop with the "just bunt" crap. The bunt is baseball's worst play, a waste of an at-bat and often also the waste of an out.


Posted by FulshearTiger
Member since Jul 2015
5295 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 7:24 pm to
quote:

Yet Ted Williams, the last guy to bat over .400 (.403)


Fun fact: Ted Williams never batted .403
Posted by CottonWasKing
4,8,15,16,23,42
Member since Jun 2011
29538 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 7:25 pm to
quote:

It's not surprising that you neanderthals would take the "just hit 'em where they ain't" side of the argument. Historically, other sports have always adjusted to keep their games' balance between offense and defense. Basketball added the 3-point shot. The NFL is always changing -- defensive backs used to be allowed to drape themselves all over pass receivers. For 150 years a line drive over the second baseman's head has been a base hit. But now that same ball, even if it's struck 100 miles an hour, is being turned into an out. The defense has gained a major advantage not by being better fielders, but because of more advanced statistical analysis and the fact the rules have allowed them to take advantage of it. It isn't golf. Pitchers are throwing 95-plus. Hitters can't be expected to shorten their swings every time and plunk a chip shot to the opposite field. People watch baseball to see the best players hit, not to see whose scouting department had the best computer read-out of where to position its fielders. And stop with the "just bunt" crap. The bunt is baseball's worst play, a waste of an at-bat and often also the waste of an out.


THANK YOU
Posted by Bumble Bee
Northwest, La
Member since Jan 2011
894 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 7:31 pm to
quote:

It isn't golf. Pitchers are throwing 95-plus. Hitters can't be expected to shorten their swings every time and plunk a chip shot to the opposite field. People watch baseball to see the best players hit, not to see whose scouting department had the best computer read-out of where to position its fielders.


1. RH hitters have no problem going to the opposite field. It seems only lefties do.

2. People watch Baseball to see the best players. hitters AND PITCHERS. The other problem is the ADD society wants high scoring games and has zero appreciation for the art of a pitchers duel.

3. Bunting is part of fundamental baseball. Once again, the ADD society isn't happy if the ball isn't hit over the fence.
Posted by Timeoday
Easter Island
Member since Aug 2020
22901 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 7:34 pm to
quote:

Fun fact: Ted Williams never batted .403



LINK ]My bad. It was .406
Posted by mojoebigdog
louisiana
Member since Feb 2009
694 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 7:36 pm to
Been all year
Posted by Timeoday
Easter Island
Member since Aug 2020
22901 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 7:38 pm to
quote:

And stop with the "just bunt" crap. The bunt is baseball's worst play, a waste of an at-bat and often also the waste of an out.


C'mon man. The squeeze play is a thing of beauty when properly executed. Heck, the Tigers scored 2 runs on one safety squeeze a few weeks back!!
Posted by CoyoteSong
Colorado
Member since Aug 2021
2603 posts
Posted on 6/4/22 at 7:41 pm to
I am still trying to understand why they decapitated his frozen head from his frozen body.
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